[Megathread] Star Citizen

[kenn9530]

The game was still the game 3 months after the initial Kickstarter ended, don't be an idiot. It wasn't until the crowdfunding got closer to 100 million that it actually started changing. Most if not all of the stretch goals (until 68 million ot so) was for the original pitch, it was still the same not-MMO when they stopped doing stretch goals. After that they realised they could milk it to no end and make it into whatever bullshit it is now.

And I would've taken the original pitched game in 2016 or whenever, played 100 hours of it and then moved happily to other games. I don't want a game that lasts forever. I don't want an MMO. I wanted the game that was supposed to be a mix of Wing Commander and Freelancer, as it was pitched. I don't understand your boner for games that last forever. I don't want to play one game for years. Why would I want that? Why would I want something just because someone somewhere thinks we should want games that last for years? Is rather have 15 hour SQ42 and then dedicated server multiplayer in the same universe where I can (or could've) played with my friends when I want to, than wait hopelessly for whenever SQ42 is supposedly releasing plus stupid ass badly designed MMO.

As soon as they added stretch goals that was them expanding the game, even by the 4 million mark they had doubled the amount of star systems in the game and almost every stretch goal expanded that further before they even hit 10 million, so the game had already changed massively in the first few months.

It doesn't matter what you want, what matters is what most ppl want and that's a space MMO that lasts for years so we don't need to spend decades waiting on another one to be developed. There are barely any space games that actually last, that's what's missing a full space MMO, the funds generated proves what the players want is an MMO, why don't you just stick to the single player game then because we are getting both.

SQ42 is complete and will be released when its giving the best possible gameplay experience. Its highly likely it will be ready before GTA 6 comes along.

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Ok. I'm developing a space game. It'll be the game you want, trust me bro. How much are you donating?

CR has proven that he can make great space games, that's why ppl supported the game, only stupid ppl back projects that they know knowing about the ppl making them.

[XDurionX]

There are lots of systems already complete for SQ42 alone, most of the star systems dont take long at all to be made.

He claims after they've done 2 star systems in 15 years.

[Kyanion]

It doesn't matter what you want, what matters is what most ppl want and that's a space MMO that lasts for years so we don't need to spend decades waiting on another one to be developed.

Yet the original game pitched was not a MMO and you're STILL waiting decades for it. G fucking G.

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SQ42 is complete and will be released when its giving the best possible gameplay experience. Its highly likely it will be ready before GTA 6 comes along.

Unless SQ42 is complete and launches and is a fucking tire fire. It could be awful, you don't know.

And if it releases before gta6, why does this game suddenly matter? I thought SC had to release before Cyberpunk or whatever other games you decided to compare SC to. What happens if GTA6 releases first? Do we win a prize?

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He claims after they've done 2 star systems in 15 years.

Trust kenn man, SQ42 will be the best thing ever and not quickly forgotten after it launches like many other games in the past.

[Kilpi]

As soon as they added stretch goals that was them expanding the game, even by the 4 million mark they had doubled the amount of star systems in the game and almost every stretch goal expanded that further before they even hit 10 million, so the game had already changed massively in the first few months.

It doesn't matter what you want, what matters is what most ppl want and that's a space MMO that lasts for years so we don't need to spend decades waiting on another one to be developed. There are barely any space games that actually last, that's what's missing a full space MMO, the funds generated proves what the players want is an MMO, why don't you just stick to the single player game then because we are getting both.

SQ42 is complete and will be released when its giving the best possible gameplay experience. Its highly likely it will be ready before GTA 6 comes along.

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CR has proven that he can make great space games, that's why ppl supported the game, only stupid ppl back projects that they know knowing about the ppl making them.

To me it doesn't matter at all what anyone else wants. A lot of people also like to play CoD, Fortnite and PUBG, but I don't. And I don't believe for a second that SQ42 is less than 2 years away. Not until they've shown at least something to back that.

And as I've said so many times; I don't want a game that lasts forever. If someone else does, good for them. But if I back a game that wasn't supposed to be MMO, and would've been finished years ago without feature creep, and I'm no longer gonna get it, I'm more than in my right to criticize it. If they now changed the game to not be an MMO or even a live service game, would you be here defending it because "that's what the God wants to do with my money"?

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Yes, yes he has. He was the visionary behind the Wing Commander series that I loved as a kid. I believe in his vision. His management of that vision is in question. That's what people keep trying to say. People aren't shitting on Star Citizen because it's CR's vision. They're shitting on it because he can't put his vision into existence within a respectable time period.

Now reply and tell me I'm just a hater and I don't know how reality works, then invent a false reality as a rebuttal. It's clearly working so well for you.

I'm shitting also on his vision. Or rather the current vision, not the original vision that I backed.

[Gorsameth]

Oh oh can I say it again?

SQ42 does not exist!

[kenn9530]

To me it doesn't matter at all what anyone else wants. A lot of people also like to play CoD, Fortnite and PUBG, but I don't. And I don't believe for a second that SQ42 is less than 2 years away. Not until they've shown at least something to back that.

And as I've said so many times; I don't want a game that lasts forever. If someone else does, good for them. But if I back a game that wasn't supposed to be MMO, and would've been finished years ago without feature creep, and I'm no longer gonna get it, I'm more than in my right to criticize it. If they now changed the game to not be an MMO or even a live service game, would you be here defending it because "that's what the God wants to do with my money"?

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I'm shitting also on his vision. Or rather the current vision, not the original vision that I backed.

What you want doesn't matter what most ppl want and what CR wants to do is all that matters, its always been a CR game he will do whatever he wants to make it his game regardless of you not liking it or not, you are not important and the opinions you have do not matter, the game is being developed the way CR wants to make it, complaining is a waste of time. If you don't like something you have to accept it and move on, its not very productive to whine about the same things over and over is it.

[kenn9530]

Yes, yes he has. He was the visionary behind the Wing Commander series that I loved as a kid. I believe in his vision. His management of that vision is in question. That's what people keep trying to say. People aren't shitting on Star Citizen because it's CR's vision. They're shitting on it because he can't put his vision into existence within a respectable time period.

Now reply and tell me I'm just a hater and I don't know how reality works, then invent a false reality as a rebuttal. It's clearly working so well for you.

Time is irrelevant, a game takes whatever time it needs to develop it, that's the reality of games development, SC is larger than most games that currently exist, but according to you its taking too long, that is not something you can decide is true or not, according to you its ok for other companies to take as long as they want to develop a game but its not ok for CiG to do the same.

[Calfredd]

Time is irrelevant, a game takes whatever time it needs to develop it, that's the reality of games development, SC is larger than most games that currently exist, but according to you its taking too long, that is not something you can decide is true or not, according to you its ok for other companies to take as long as they want to develop a game but its not ok for CiG to do the same.

Kenn the liar speaks once more. Idea guys really shouldn't be in charge because of examples like Star Citizen and Chris' other projects; it took kicking him off his leadership position to even release any half-decent game.

[Kilpi]

What you want doesn't matter what most ppl want and what CR wants to do is all that matters, its always been a CR game he will do whatever he wants to make it his game regardless of you not liking it or not, you are not important and the opinions you have do not matter, the game is being developed the way CR wants to make it, complaining is a waste of time. If you don't like something you have to accept it and move on, its not very productive to whine about the same things over and over is it.

I know there is nothing productive about this thread. But I can still complain, because my opinion and what I want is the only thing that matters to me. And I'm not even being unreasonable with it since I'm not arguing the game should be something I've come up with, but I'm just arguing the game should be what it was originally supposed to be, and it hasn't been improved by the last 500 million in funding and feature creep that followed it.

If this is the game CR thinks is the best he can make, then he's just proven to me that he wasn't the right designer for a space game for me. Luckily I was never a huge fan of the character called "Chris Roberts", just Freelancer.

But at least they still have the chance of releasing a decent SQ42 campaign in the coming decade.

[kenn9530]

And here the circular logic you're using begins to circle the drain and you're not infracted for trolling.

I will say that if a developer promises things, and throws out dates for completion of those promises, and misses them, it's a problem.

You will then reply that he never made such promises, even though there's quantifiable data proving that he made such promises, and that I'm either a hater or stupid if I think otherwise.

Prove me wrong. Reply and tell me that it's raining while CR is pissing on my head. Well, I guess *your* head, since you've been throwing your money at him with no expectations except "it'll be his vision and it'll be awesome, even if I'm 90 years old when it's done."

The rational reply you *should* be making is "yeah he made those promises and they didn't come to fruition. I'm ok with that. It's your money, you can choose to invest if you wish." At least then I can take you seriously.

Its already been disproven time and time again they have made no such promise to release the game at any point yet, those are the facts, and even if there was a full release all planned CR can change it if he wanted to since he has stated on many occasions he will not compromise on the quality of the game, that is also not going against any promises, promises are not facts or things that can always happen, the real world does not work that way.

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I know there is nothing productive about this thread. But I can still complain, because my opinion and what I want is the only thing that matters to me. And I'm not even being unreasonable with it since I'm not arguing the game should be something I've come up with, but I'm just arguing the game should be what it was originally supposed to be, and it hasn't been improved by the last 500 million in funding and feature creep that followed it.

If this is the game CR thinks is the best he can make, then he's just proven to me that he wasn't the right designer for a space game for me. Luckily I was never a huge fan of the character called "Chris Roberts", just Freelancer.

But at least they still have the chance of releasing a decent SQ42 campaign in the coming decade.

No the game is what CR wants it to be just like he stated in the kickstarter, its his game he gets to decide whats best for it or not no matter if you are not happy with it or not. No game at the beginning stays the same throughout the whole development, thats the whole point in games development to actually develop a game and add things the game needs.

[banmebaby]

Yeah, there are promises in game development. "I'm going to develop a space game" is a promise. That's your limit, and your research of that single promise parted you with your money. My limit is a lot higher than that. Stop shitting on my limits, I'm still researching on whether my money is worth parting with, like you keep telling us we should be doing.

A quick remind that unlike what Kenn says about refunds:

Your not entitled to one its up to the company but this has nothing to do with SC in the first place.

You are VERY MUCH entitled to one depending on where you live, if you are within EU/UK (possibly AUS too?), you should still be able to get a 100% refund, CIG will fake ignorance and try to dissuade you from it by hiding behind their user agreements, but they know perfectly well that such bullshit doesn't overlap EU laws.

If you are from the US however, your only option is the grey market, last time I checked the market was saturated with people trying to get their money back, so prices plumped down to under 50% of original worth yet I've heard about people actually making a profit by having limited edition JPGs in their accounts.

There is an entire reddit community dedicated helping out people with it, you can check it out at:

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen...nd_start_here/

[kenn9530]

I never said anything about a promise to release the game, but at least you're staying on brand. Kudos, I guess? I'm talking about other promises he's made along the way that didn't come to fruition. I'm not going to list them, because they've already been listed, and you rejected those as well. This is trolling.

You have successfully argued that "Chris Roberts wants to make a space game" as a sufficient amount of research to give him your money. Just because I reject the premise that "Chris Roberts wants to make a space game" to be *NOT* a sufficient amount of research, neither makes me dumb nor unrealistic.

Not everything you get promised is always possible thats not how the real world works, what examples of your so called promises has he not delivered on then, you have yet to bring up anything actually relevant, you are the one here being non constructive by bringing in no relevant information that you are complaining about.

[Kilpi]

No the game is what CR wants it to be just like he stated in the kickstarter, its his game he gets to decide whats best for it or not no matter if you are not happy with it or not. No game at the beginning stays the same throughout the whole development, thats the whole point in games development to actually develop a game and add things the game needs.

I agree, his opinion is the only thing that matters to him. And my opinion is only thing that matters to me. If I disagree with his decisions, then I disagree with them. And I do. You are also right in that he can do whatever changes what he wants with the game, but that also means that he's changed the game a lot from what it was originally supposed to be, saying "he always meant it to be this way" doesn't change anything.

[kenn9530]

Kenn, be reasonable with yourself. Would any relevant promise I submit, that countless other posters have submitted and you summarily dismissed with "that didn't happen" or similar handwaving, sway you?

Thats what i thought you have nothing at all to say, you claim I'm trolling but all you do is provide nothing constructive at all, nothing to back anything you seem to claim, but alas its the level of discussion i expect from many posters that come in this thread.

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I agree, his opinion is the only thing that matters to him. And my opinion is only thing that matters to me. If I disagree with his decisions, then I disagree with them. And I do. You are also right in that he can do whatever changes what he wants with the game, but that also means that he's changed the game a lot from what it was originally supposed to be, saying "he always meant it to be this way" doesn't change anything.

You can disagree all you want, if you back a project you do the research on the one running it, if you are not happy that CR was already know to want to go as deep as possible with his games then you shouldn't put money into the project to begin with, if you back a CR game you expect it to take longer, to get far more features than was in the original plans, complaining is just a waste of time because it gets you nothing.

[Azadina]

thats the whole point in games development to actually develop a game and add things the game needs.

What the game needs? Like the 100 systems, functional servers, bugs fixed, content? None of it has been added, nor is being added.

[kenn9530]

What the game needs? Like the 100 systems, functional servers, bugs fixed, content? None of it has been added, nor is being added.

It doesn't have to be currently added to exist, that's not how game development works, the current PU is a small fraction of the work that has been done on the game, just something to test while everything else is being developed, there is plenty content, there is functional servers and bugs are fixed all the time so why don't you make some sense first.

[NatePsy]

A quick remind that unlike what Kenn says about refunds:



You are VERY MUCH entitled to one depending on where you live, if you are within EU/UK (possibly AUS too?)

Yeah most definitely Australia, we have some of the biggest consumer protections, even Valve bends the knee to our Consumer Commission regulators. CR would get dicked hard if a large portion of his backers were Australian.

[Dhrizzle]

@kenn9530

Interviewer: You have stated that you expect to have an Alpha up and going in about 12 months, with a beta roughly 10 months after that and then launch. For a game of this size and scope, do you think you can really be done in the next two years?

Chris Roberts: Really it is all about constant iteration from launch. The whole idea is to be constantly updating. It isn’t like the old days where you had to have everything and the kitchen sink in at launch because you weren’t going to come back to it for awhile. We’re already one year in - another two years puts us at 3 total which is ideal. Any more and things would begin to get stale.

This is the expectation Roberts set, beta after about 2 years and then launch. If the game is pretty bare-boned that's fine because more stuff can be added in later.

[Kilpi]

You can disagree all you want, if you back a project you do the research on the one running it, if you are not happy that CR was already know to want to go as deep as possible with his games then you shouldn't put money into the project to begin with, if you back a CR game you expect it to take longer, to get far more features than was in the original plans, complaining is just a waste of time because it gets you nothing.

Oh it really is pointless to tell you I backed the original pitch, not the all the crap he came up with years after that. You're hopeless.

[Azadina]

It doesn't have to be currently added to exist, that's not how game development works, the current PU is a small fraction of the work that has been done on the game, just something to test while everything else is being developed, there is plenty content, there is functional servers and bugs are fixed all the time so why don't you make some sense first.

There are no functional servers, and bugs are only halfway fixed, only to be immediately broken again in the next patch. Patches that seem very frequent too. Normally frequent content patched would be welcome, but not the way SC does them. They add almost nothing, reset characters, items, ships, and break absolutely everything that might have barely worked before.

Make sense of that then.