Should we blame the president or the people?

[Rukentuts]

Increase our home oil production)

Increasing production of oil at home would almost certainly be met with a fast OPEC cut in production to offset it.

[Vizardlorde]

My grandfather, who is 75 and only worked in the US for like 2 years maybe less, is getting his second $15,000 surgery to get an implant that will allow him to get an erection again after chemotherapy killed his his ability to get them naturally. The first surgery was not exactly successful and he wet himself for 2 months and limped when walking. Idk how much the removal surgery cost medicare but that incredibly stupid old man (single btw) cost medicare $30 000 + dollars.
PS idk the name of the implant in English.

[GreatSageCorban]

Increasing production of oil at home would almost certainly be met with a fast OPEC cut in production to offset it.

I seem to recall the opposite happened back in the... 70's or 80's. When we threatened to increase our own oil production, OPEC drastically reduced the prices to 'out compete' our own oil.

[Rukentuts]

I seem to recall the opposite happened back in the... 70's or 80's. When we threatened to increase our own oil production, OPEC drastically reduced the prices to 'out compete' our own oil.

OPEC knows we cannot come anywhere close to being self sufficient on oil. The instant we try to produce more they will just offset it and the global prices will be the same.

Now, if we started making cars that ran on natural gas...

[Talen]

In this case the coach wants a new contract and has had a dismal record, but is still blaming the coach he replaced 4 years ago.

Its not that simple.

Many of the problems the country faces were indeed caused by or exacerbated by Bush.
What's more is that the sheer scale of the issues Bush left behind were never going to be fixed in just 4 years.
Especially because the economic issues have built up over decades, due to policies from both parties.

Obama also largely squandered his first two years (IMO) by trying to be cross party.
The Republicans haven't helped with their obstructionist attitude.

Yes...obstructionist. They've made no secret that their primary aim isn't to help the country...its to kick Obama out and the manner in which they have held up legislation, even routine legislation and at times held the nation hostage should be cause mor for shame than celebration.

I've never seen such hatred, such vitriol against a sitting president. And there seems to be no good reason for it.

Obama's tenure hasn't been perfect. Far from it. At the same time, he hasn't been the disaster many Republicans depict him as. He's done well in many aspects of the job. The big question is would a Republican have done better? They'd probably have followed many of the same policies which got the nation into the mess its in...but wouldn't have had to put up with quite so much obstruction.

But given the mess he was landed with, then yes....its probably still fair for Obama to blame Bush. Of course, if he was being more complete and accurate, he'd also have to blame Clinton, Bush Sr and Reagan as well.

EJL

[GreatSageCorban]

OPEC knows we cannot come anywhere close to being self sufficient on oil. The instant we try to produce more they will just offset it and the global prices will be the same.

Now, if we started making cars that ran on natural gas...

Tesla right now has a battery powered car that can travel 300 miles on a single charge, and only takes about 30 minutes to bring it to a half tank at a "super charging station" (only in California right now.) They also have a calculator on there to find out how much it would cost you in your electric bill with your normal driving habits. (say 50-80 miles a day.) I think mine came out to be about $7 a month in 'fuel' costs for having an electric car. (vs. my normal 200-300 fuel bills)

The downside is it's new Technology. It's expensive. (100k for the 300 mile range vehicle.) They're also trying to get off the ground. I really hope they do.

[oblivionx]

Its not that simple.

[insert liberal rant here]

Actually it is that simple.

Coach wants a new contract and has a dismal record. Coach doesn't get contract.

[Purlina]

3 kids isn't huge. Now, try putting in 2 baby seats in that thing, rear facing, and having someone actually fit in either of the front seats. Now take a 1000 mile vacation somewhere with both parents plastered to the dash board, and one kid smashed between his to crying siblings in the armored carriers. (Not to mention all the luggage)

How often do you take a 1000 mile vacation? Why not just rent it for trips, and have a family car for daily use...

[Rukentuts]

Actually it is that simple.

Coach wants a new contract and has a dismal record. Coach doesn't get contract.

No facts, no links, and posts filled with straw-man arguments...

[oblivionx]

No facts, no links, and posts filled with straw-man arguments...

Where is the "straw-man argument" exactly?

[GreatSageCorban]

How often do you take a 1000 mile vacation? Why not just rent it for trips, and have a family car for daily use...

I was just using a 1000 mile trip as an extreme example. However, any family outing would be impossibly difficult in a small vehicle. Packing stroller(s), Or going on a shopping trip, soccer match. Not to mention I'm 6'3" How would I ever fit in either front seat? I've got a Matrix right now, and I can't imagine making it in that car with 3 or more kids with 2 or more infant seats.

Where is the "straw-man argument" exactly?

Bush was an idiot financially. No president has really been a conservative fiscally, and we're approaching a cliff. Bush didn't fix the problem, but neither did Obama. The time is coming when cuts are going to made, and taxes will have to go up. Everyone is going to feel this one. It's just "Would you rather have your (random number) 500 weekly paycheck go to 300 and keep service, or go to 450 and lose some more entitlements."

[Skippy88]

Yes and No.

Yes, because the president has a lot of power which when yielded can affect a lot of people so when things happen they can stop in and fix it. No because a lot of what happens is out of his (or her) control and on a day to day basis I think most people would find their lives unchanged regardless of who's in charge.

Unfortunately, more and more it seems like politicians are only out for themselves and their attempts to get reelected rather than what's best for the country.

[Rukentuts]

Where is the "straw-man argument" exactly?

Are you absolutely serious?

Let me give you a hint:

In this case the coach wants a new contract and has had a dismal record, but is still blaming the coach he replaced 4 years ago.

Protip: "Logical" posters don't rely on logical fallacies to convey their points.

[Faloestin]

I bought a home in '04. (only 1500 sqft mind you.) I was stupid, and young. It was my fault. I also take full responsibility, and will not foreclosing like many others have. I'm underwater, I need a larger home for my family. I'm going to lose years of work and savings to do it, but I'm going to meet my obligation to the banks that credited me the money to make the loan in the first place. At least enough that when I do sell, I break even.

Part of the reason the boat I am in (and many others are in) is due to these people who are foreclosing in such large numbers. It's driving the home values down. The question is how did all these people who could not afford the loans in the first place (myself included) get approved.

Why on earth aren't you considering foreclosure? Do you think for a minute that the bank that's on the other side of that transaction wouldn't bail if it were in their economic best interest?

And the answer to how folks who couldn't afford the loan in the first place got approved can be found here.

[oblivionx]

Are you absolutely serious?

Let me give you a hint:


Protip: "Logical" posters don't rely on logical fallacies to convey their points.

So you are claiming that my response to someone likening the campaign for president and holding one man accountable to how teams fire coaches... and taking the coach angle and expanding on it is a mischaracterization? How so?

[Sole-Warrior]

When it comes to economy, its unfair to just point the figure at the President and ONLY the pres, individuals can also make dumb decisions which can effect the country as a whole.

[oblivionx]

When it comes to economy, its unfair to just point the figure at the President and ONLY the pres, individuals can also make dumb decisions which can effect the country as a whole.

It might be pretty unfair, I agree.

How is that this president gets away with blaming the former president then?

[Rukentuts]

So you are claiming that my response to someone likening the campaign for president and holding one man accountable to how teams fire coaches... and taking the coach angle and expanding on it is a mischaracterization? How so?

Because that fits the very definition of a straw-man logical fallacy. Do I seriously need to start spelling every small detail out for you so you can understand?

[GreatSageCorban]

Why on earth aren't you considering foreclosure? Do you think for a minute that the bank that's on the other side of that transaction wouldn't bail if it were in their economic best interest?

Well, for 1.) Foreclosure is not an end all solution. I make enough to pay the bill, so if I just walk away now (with no hardship) they 'will' come after me for the difference. (Law for my state.) This is also true if I were to attempt a shortsale, or a died in lu.
2.) Foreclosure stays with you on your credit forever, and it will impact everything you do for lending from then on.

So, after a lot of investigation. My choices were pay (random number) $50,000-$80,000 or... get a huge damaging credit hit, foreclosure on my record, and still have to pay $50,000-$80,000 and have to wait around 3-6 years before being able to get any other kind of loan again.

[oblivionx]

Because that fits the very definition of a straw-man logical fallacy. Do I seriously need to start spelling every small detail out for you so you can understand?

It only does if referring to the president as the coach is a mischaracterization.

I don't think it is, and I don't think you actually know what a straw man is.