No Ghostcrawler, rogues are not ok

[Deleted]

Sweet rogue tears.

[EqualWin]

you said you're good but you eat a 10 sec disarm?

you don't use the enchant disarm reduction? wat

[Thasta]

Destruction Warlock Rain of Fire is completely ridiculous in arena, they can actually cover HALF the arena map in instant, non casted AOE. Its probably impossible for ANY stealth class to get an opener against a decent destro lock right now.

[Haloswin]

So there I was in a 2v2 match the other day running mage/rogue (I play the rogue and I'm a pretty good player) and we come across a Destro warlock/Spriest team. In previous seasons this team would have been completely non-viable and a total joke that I only come across below 1500mmr (Not somewhere I often am). The warlock is specced into the ability that increases AOE ability radius by 500%. Now my question before I explain what happened in the arena is who on planet earth thought that spec was a good idea? Its hard enough as it was to get a clean opener in arena without that crap and a clean opener is the entire advantage of playing a stealth class is it not? So you maybe can guess what happened, the lock runs into the middle of the Nagrand arena and casts Reign of Fire at his max range. The AOE was so huge and came so fast that there was statistically no way to LOS the Spell without using a cooldown ability (Sprint) or speccing into Nightstalker (Which is actually a pretty bad spec despite attempts to make all talents viable) and of course after that the priest runs around to where I am and casts Phsycic Horror (Disarm/Horrify). I died before the 10 second disarm was over because I wasnt ready for that kind of absurd burst and like most rogues I like to save cloak of shadows for a kill because against a caster team it is the ONLY way to get a kill most of the time.

I hope GC reads this, please discuss problems and solutions for stealth classes.

Honestly, I agree with what you're saying about the AOE but, not using your abilities is all on you. Our damage is down, so 2v2 is painful for us, but we can still be as annoying and disruptive as ever in other brackets.

2v2 is just not the best place to really look for answers to the balance issues.

[Sylar Hao]

A few social rouges in our guild were complaining the other day and I think its hilarious. "My toon isnt the same op toon it was last xpac and I dont wanna have to actually learn anything new so Ill complain". Bottom line is there is a way for you to kill that team you and your partner just need more work with new spells/mechanics. Just because you face rolled casters before doesnt mean that its gonna be the same in the new season.

Quoted for truth.

Finally warlocks can do something to rogues without being permanently locked and for the first time in years and seasons rogues aren't at the top owning everything and looking only for warlocks in bg because they were their freekill target.

So finally rogues are balanced instead of op, just get over it. You got countered by that talent, well, you'll pretty sure win other 2vs2 matches... and by the way, 2v2 has been a broken bracked since forever.

---------- Post added 2012-11-03 at 09:47 PM ----------

Destruction Warlock Rain of Fire is completely ridiculous in arena, they can actually cover HALF the arena map in instant, non casted AOE. Its probably impossible for ANY stealth class to get an opener against a decent destro lock right now.

So? Destro's been an easy target and a non competitive spec since forever, it deserves its moment of glory too, not only the typical rogues and mages. If a stealth class can't get an opener from stealth against only a single spec out of 34 there are in the game, they'll have to deal with it and guess a different strategy.

[Koji2k11]

Quoted for truth.

Finally warlocks can do something to rogues without being permanently locked and for the first time in years and seasons rogues aren't at the top owning everything and looking only for warlocks in bg because they were their freekill target.

So finally rogues are balanced instead of op, just get over it. You got countered by that talent, well, you'll pretty sure win other 2vs2 matches... and by the way, 2v2 has been a broken bracked since forever.

---------- Post added 2012-11-03 at 09:47 PM ----------

So? Destro's been an easy target and a non competitive spec since forever, it deserves its moment of glory too, not only the typical rogues and mages. If a stealth class can't get an opener from stealth against only a single spec out of 34 there are in the game, they'll have to deal with it and guess a different strategy.

hmm i remember WL being viable in almost every season look it up

[Verain]

[/COLOR] So? Destro's been an easy target and a non competitive spec since forever, it deserves its moment of glory too, not only the typical rogues and mages.

Warlocks have had adequate representation in arena. There are more lock glads than rogue glads.

Destro, Affliction, and Demo have all had their time in arena. Destro wasn't viable for quite some time.

Guess what else wasn't?

Combat

I notice you were comparing a single spec to an entire class. Rogues being terrible in arena is FAR worse than a single spec of any class being untenable, especially when your alternate options use the exact same gear and fill the same role.

If a stealth class can't get an opener from stealth against only a single spec out of 34 there are in the game, they'll have to deal with it and guess a different strategy.

We don't have another strategy. Would it be ok if mutilate was just permanently immune to magical damage? I mean, it's only one out of 34 specs in the game. Just use a different strategy.

[Imbashiethz]

A few social rouges in our guild were complaining the other day and I think its hilarious. "My toon isnt the same op toon it was last xpac and I dont wanna have to actually learn anything new so Ill complain". Bottom line is there is a way for you to kill that team you and your partner just need more work with new spells/mechanics. Just because you face rolled casters before doesnt mean that its gonna be the same in the new season.

Go look at ladders in 2s & 3s. Then come back and tell rogues theyre all bad and just have to adapt. K cya.

[Sadgazm]

you said you're good but you eat a 10 sec disarm?

you don't use the enchant disarm reduction? wat

Everybody thinks they're good. He lost, he cried, he'll live.

[Verain]

I will throw in the fact that running without a weapon chain puts you at serious risk for troubles, especially in a non-healer comp. Dying over the course of 10 seconds without a healer is not unreasonable.

[Sylar Hao]

Warlocks have had adequate representation in arena. There are more lock glads than rogue glads.

Destro, Affliction, and Demo have all had their time in arena. Destro wasn't viable for quite some time.

Guess what else wasn't?

Combat

I notice you were comparing a single spec to an entire class. Rogues being terrible in arena is FAR worse than a single spec of any class being untenable, especially when your alternate options use the exact same gear and fill the same role.



We don't have another strategy. Would it be ok if mutilate was just permanently immune to magical damage? I mean, it's only one out of 34 specs in the game. Just use a different strategy.

This thread was about Destro locks, no about all Warlocks. The only viable spec has always been Affliction, Destruction has only had very few moments where it barely shone, and Demonology has never been useful in pvp at all.

And about that second part... seriously, you can't compare breaking stealth to being permanently immune to magic damage... that argument is totally pointless. Breaking stealth doesn't make the rogue less useful, he can still attack and perform everything a rogue can, he just loses Cheap Shot as opener. Look at this the other way around, as a warlock I can initiate any class whenever I want except rogues because they're in stealth... It's just the same.

[sinisterwyvern]

So there I was in a 2v2 match...

Lol @ anecdotal evidence + the fact that they balance for 3's and 5's, not so much for 2's

[Sesshou]

Lol @ anecdotal evidence + the fact that they balance for 3's and 5's, not so much for 2's

Oh, so the 500% larger RoF is smaller in 3s and 5s. Didn't realize that.

[mordale]

Oh, so the 500% larger RoF is smaller in 3s and 5s. Didn't realize that.

no but it is less useful/impacting.

[Absolem]

2014 expansion will fix it :P

---------- Post added 2012-11-04 at 05:03 PM ----------

Sweet rogue tears.

Yeah :P

Kinda sad after their OP status in cata.

[Mafic]

Shadow walk does not fix this issue. It only makes your stealth more stealthy. I does not prevent you from being removed from stealth by a 100 yard diameter AOE. Trust me this talent needs to be reworked, I thought through alot of angles of it before posting.

---------- Post added 2012-11-03 at 05:06 AM ----------



GC does come and read MMO champ forums somewhat frequently from what I've seen.

I was just joking...because I know it will not fix this issue lol.

[Tehterokkar]

Rogues QQing about being brought in line with others... Oh you have 3 minute CDs that you need to kill someone? Please tell me, I play a BM hunter

[Avengerx]

Rogues QQing about being brought in line with others... Oh you have 3 minute CDs that you need to kill someone? Please tell me, I play a BM hunter

You do know that currently BM is one of the most broken classes in pvp right?

It really seems like most posters have never played as a rogue before or are just not familiar with rogue mechanics. We are an opener based class period. Always been always will be,nothing we can do about this. If you take that away from us we have very little in utility that can keep us on the target.
GC said that rogues are fine. We could argue a lot about that but with gear our PVE dps is on par with the others. Now in PVP where due to humongously large amount of passive damage, we need to stay on the target all the time to be able to do something and without a great deal of cc and utility skills that's kinda impossible to do. That's not fine anymore and even Blizz admitted that. But instead of balancing rogue damage what are they doing? They are toning down the other classes so due to gear scaling the same thing will happen as in the end of cata...brilliant move btw.

[Zone]

for a while i was wondering whether the people who post all this "OMG ROUGES IN CATUNCLASM WERE OVERPOWDERED NOW THEY R LE BALANCED XDD" were trolling or just severely brain damaged, but then it dawned on me that mmo-c class forums have basically become the exact same as the wow official forums where people barely breaking 1500 that have no experience at all beyond their random battlegrounds in their lfr gear force their idiocy down every ones throat by posting the same nonsensical dumb shit over and over again

[Hungrydingo]

A few social rouges in our guild were complaining the other day and I think its hilarious. "My toon isnt the same op toon it was last xpac and I dont wanna have to actually learn anything new so Ill complain". Bottom line is there is a way for you to kill that team you and your partner just need more work with new spells/mechanics. Just because you face rolled casters before doesnt mean that its gonna be the same in the new season.

What do you mean they don't want to learn anything new? The class is EXACTLY the same as last expansion they just nerfed the length of our CDs and made it so you can't have both Prep and Shadowstep.