Crying about PVP realms ''Blue'' response

[Stede]

CRZ only affects a zone if the population there isn't considered high enough. If there's reasonable world PvP going on already, then the zone's not going to be cross-realmed. If there isn't, sure, it's gonna be combined with others, but that's bringing back population densities to where they should be.

I've been playing since Vanilla, on balanced PvP servers, and have been a part of guilds that deliberately sought out and started world PvP that whole time. We have always been on the "weaker" side of the fight, population-wise. The experience post-CRZ is very much how I recall Vanilla being, in that higher levels would swoop in and gank you all the time.

My current server is one of the more active and balanced PvP realms; Bleeding Hollow US. I've been here for a while. Your accusations are entirely baseless and false.

Oh, they're not baseless. At all. Your post was pretty much begging for it. And CRZ'ing a 10/20/40-man group around to camp the Dark Portal until trouble shows up, and then dropping group so you can't be counter-corpse-camped isn't balanced no matter how you spin it. And I've played on US-Emerald Dream since before and after CRZ in a top wPvP guild where we'd do monthly 200v200 in addition to daily scrims and ganks. So I can tell you, that no - CRZ didn't help it.

World PvP should carry risk. It should mean that every time you step outside a sanctuary, you're looking over your shoulder. Its shouldn't mean you can group with a buddy and phase in and out of a zone at will. You've yet to address this as a real issue and have even dismissed it entirely. Which means you're either disingenuous or ignorant.

My apologies that I ascribed to you the lesser of those two. I tend to give folks the benefit of the doubt.

---------- Post added 2012-12-07 at 07:22 PM ----------

Yes. Because it was never intended that PvP realms should behave mostly like PvE realms.



A player choosing the wrong realm type out of ignorance of the ruleset is not in any way, shape, or form Blizzard's fault, nor are they under any responsibility to give them a free pass out of their mistake.

Pay for a transfer, or reroll, or learn to accept the consequences of your choice. Because that's what it was; YOUR choice. The only person to blame if you're on a PvP realm and don't like it, is you.

Nobody chose CRZ. And trying to truthfully discern Blizzard's intentions is pretty laughable. Your arguement isn't just weak. It's invalid.

[Deleted]

Very much enjoy world PvP, which is why I'm playing on a pvp server.. Having said that however.. Getting ganked 3v1 every fucking time cause your server is completely dominated by the one faction is utter crap and has nothing to do with PvP, or what I signed up for on a PvP server.

[thunderdragon2]

Yes. Because it was never intended that PvP realms should behave mostly like PvE realms.



A player choosing the wrong realm type out of ignorance of the ruleset is not in any way, shape, or form Blizzard's fault, nor are they under any responsibility to give them a free pass out of their mistake.

Pay for a transfer, or reroll, or learn to accept the consequences of your choice. Because that's what it was; YOUR choice. The only person to blame if you're on a PvP realm and don't like it, is you.

ah so typical

so i have to chose between a good raiding guild and no ganking? almost all of the decent guilds are on pvp servers

tho endus ill give you this i played on a pve server during uldur and i missed being on a pvp server but being ganked 5v1 is not what most ppl have in mind of what pvp is when they chose a pvp server

[Swineflew]

or in my case 5 transfer fees CRZ has took all intention away form me of levekling another character even if im really interested in the next new class/race we get next Xpac if we get anew 1 that is

So roll on a pve server or level through dungeons.

I'm sorry but your single player leveling game is gone.

[thunderdragon2]

So roll on a pve server or level through dungeons.

I'm sorry but your single player leveling game is gone.

when did i ever say it was a single player leveling game.

i just simply wont level another toon so i wont have to deal with the crz ganking shit

[Galaddriel]

Before the CRZ was introduced the odds of running into another player was verry low on my realm never had a big problem , but with the introduction for CRZ all of that changed . it'd good for those that enjoy PVP but they forgot the option for people that don't like pvp to move to pve realms.
and no one will pay 11 times transfer fee so they will stop playing and blizzard will lose more customers because of this.

What they seem to be oblivious to is that for every person happy with the change (the ganker) you've got someone unhappy with the change (the gankee).

Looks like they just cut their subs in half.

[Endus]

You've yet to address this as a real issue and have even dismissed it entirely. Which means you're either disingenuous or ignorant.

My apologies that I ascribed to you the lesser of those two. I tend to give folks the benefit of the doubt.

It's a pretty minor issue, and one that can easily be corrected via some technical means, for instance if you join a specific zone via grouping, have the player remain in that server until they've been out of PvP long enough to allow them to unflag (obviously, they can't on a PvP realm, but the timer still exists).

They could still die and go AFK until the timer's up, but they can do that anyway.

Also, kudos on the irrational resorting to insults. It's always a sign that your argument's strong when you resort to name-calling to defend it.

Nobody chose CRZ. And trying to truthfully discern Blizzard's intentions is pretty laughable. Your arguement isn't just weak. It's invalid.

The addition of CRZ didn't change the ruleset they DID choose. Stop attacking a strawman and then claiming my argument's invalid.

The PvP ruleset states, clearly, that being constantly ganked by max-level characters and corpsecamped for hours is perfectly legitimate forms of gameplay. It states both of those, specifically, in the official PvP realm policy. Complaining when they occur is baseless. Players were warned.

It's like going to the park, and seeing two paths, one saying "NO DOGS ALLOWED", and the other saying "DOG TRAIL". If you're afraid of dogs and go down the dog trail, you only have yourself to blame. It doesn't matter if there were no dogs there the last few times you went; the rules for the trail were clearly posted and you had a clear choice.

[Swineflew]

when did i ever say it was a single player leveling game.

i just simply wont level another toon so i wont have to deal with the crz ganking shit

Well that's what you want. You want to level on a pvp server without interference from the other faction.
You said it yourself, you want to play on a pvp server, but don't want to be ganked.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[Mortiegama]

Best thing ever! At the start of Vanilla, I had two groups of friends: one that went to a PvP Server and another that went to a PvE Server. Needless to say I went to the PvE one. I knew what it would be like on the PvP and the stories held true. I like to enjoy my game without hindrance and if you went PvP you waived that right to complain. I'm glad PvP Servers are finally seeing PvP, ganking, camping, lowbie snatching, all that should've happened since the start. If you play PvP, DEAL WITH IT (haha).

Though, it would be nice if they offered a one time transfer off of a PvP to PvE server.

[Swineflew]

What they seem to be oblivious to is that for every person happy with the change (the ganker) you've got someone unhappy with the change (the gankee).

Looks like they just cut their subs in half.

Except that not every "gankee" is a crybaby who expects to roll on a pvp server and not encounter pvp.

[Endus]

ah so typical

so i have to chose between a good raiding guild and no ganking? almost all of the decent guilds are on pvp servers

No, you need to accept the consequences of your choices.

Blizzard provided a choice. If you choose a PvP server, for whatever reason, you accept the responsibility for that choice. You're the one who chose to accept those rules. You don't get to then complain about them after the fact.

If I'm lactose intolerant and order a milkshake, my stomachache is my own damn fault, not the restaurant's that served it to me.

[thunderdragon2]

Well that's what you want. You want to level on a pvp server without interference from the other faction.
You said it yourself, you want to play on a pvp server, but don't want to be ganked.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

ill try this again i dont care about the apposite faction is the apposite faction of other factions that bother me, i got ganked while leveling me monk by a max lvl horde from another server, iu logged my hunter as i had enough and when i got there he was gone ( most likely safe in his own servers capital) atleast if hes on the same server as me theres still chance form payback with oposing faction mambers on different servers there isnt that chance

get me now?

[Endus]

ill try this again i dont care about the apposite faction is the apposite faction of other factions that bother me, i got ganked while leveling me monk by a max lvl horde from another server, iu logged my hunter as i had enough and when i got there he was gone ( most likely safe in his own servers capital) atleast if hes on the same server as me theres still chance form payback with oposing faction mambers on different servers there isnt that chance

get me now?

How is that different from a max-level player from your own server ganking you, and then going to his capital? You could write his name down to hunt him down later, I guess, but ideally, you should be getting ganked enough that doing so becomes impractical.

[Rivellana]

Yes. Because it was never intended that PvP realms should behave mostly like PvE realms.

A player choosing the wrong realm type out of ignorance of the ruleset is not in any way, shape, or form Blizzard's fault, nor are they under any responsibility to give them a free pass out of their mistake.

Pay for a transfer, or reroll, or learn to accept the consequences of your choice. Because that's what it was; YOUR choice. The only person to blame if you're on a PvP realm and don't like it, is you.

However, it was Blizzard's fault that they let most servers fall into a state of such low population or imbalance that the players playing on them couldn't tell much difference between a PvP or PvE server as far as world PvP was concerned. It's also their fault that they let the servers stay like that for so long that they let their playerbase get used to that environment. It may not have been their intention, but they definitely let it happen.

They certainly don't have a "responsibility" to give "free passes" to make up for the unrest that CRZ has created on PvP realms, however, they are a business. Businesses stay afloat by making customers happy with their product and will often make allowances to keep their customers happy.

It's not that it matters much to me, because I'm not leveling any toons in areas with CRZ now and I don't have a problem with world PvP in the areas where CRZ isn't. I do understand the frustration of the people who feel like Blizzard pulled the rug right out from under them by putting CRZ into place with virtually no warning though.

[Deleted]

PvP realms aren't intended to be "fair". "Fair" is for battlegrounds and arenas. World PvP in general isn't expected to be "fair", and the entire environment on PvP realms is designed to be "unfair".

Straight from the PvP realm policy ff the battle.net help site;

[...]

This is explicitly what these servers are for. Not knowing what kind of server you're playing on is NOT an excuse. Them fixing realm population density through CRZ is not an issue.

I know what those servers are far, and I am telling you there is a market for players who are OK with world PvP if it isn't grieving low level vs high level but of same level. Its bloody silly like a kid who gets beaten up by a 30 year old body builder and then has to go to his daddy (his level 90 guild mates) to come help him. Why beat up the kid in the first place? Let dad fight dad. Also, my suggestion was hypothetical, and I believe there is a market for it. I believe there are many more people who are good with world PvP, but want to have a mechanism to make sure low level vs high level is not possible. I actually used to play a game which worked exactly like this some 10 years or so ago: Utopia, by Swirve.

Also, yes changing the server density over night is a big issue because I and many other paying customers are complaining about it. We rolled on a server with a certain culture where we know our allies and our foes. Sure, sometimes new players come roll and guilds merge, transfer, but that's all manageable since it isn't huge impact. We made alts, esp in Cata which was alt paradise, and now suddenly our server is completely different overnight thanks to a change from Blizzard.

[Anjerith]

I always enjoy when a Blue shines their balls up, puts them in their pants and then takes a great big crap all over the spoiled community - even when it's at my expense.

[Obby]

and then this ensues....some poor lvl 20 was accidently cought in your cleave fills out a ticket and a rogue gm boots you for 3 hours >.>

[thunderdragon2]

No, you need to accept the consequences of your choices.

Blizzard provided a choice. If you choose a PvP server, for whatever reason, you accept the responsibility for that choice. You're the one who chose to accept those rules. You don't get to then complain about them after the fact.

If I'm lactose intolerant and order a milkshake, my stomachache is my own damn fault, not the restaurant's that served it to me.

i accepted it till mop,

answer me this tho, say ur leveling a new charactor and u get ganked in EPL say 5 times , you log your main and arrive at EPL to find that the person that ganked you is no longer there, would you be happy?

yes it was MY choice to rrol a pvp server, BUT i don't like being denied MY chance of payback coz they can just hs bck to the safety of their server capital city to avoid REAL pvP, if i wasn't denied that chance i wouldn't have a problem with CRZ, until that chance comes i WILL ALWAYS have a problem with crz

[Deleted]

What they seem to be oblivious to is that for every person happy with the change (the ganker) you've got someone unhappy with the change (the gankee).

Looks like they just cut their subs in half.

Oh, no, its not like they're losing subs like that. Its more like they made this world with all these quests in Cata and guess who isn't using any of that content instead playing BGs and LFDs. All the people who got ganked switch to this hence a waste of developer time to make quests in the open world.

[Keoren]

so i have to chose between a good raiding guild and no ganking? almost all of the decent guilds are on pvp servers

Yes, all of the guilds that are on PvP realms made the decision to play in an environment with the specific rule set. If you wish to play with them, you must accept the PvP realm environment. Not a single one of these guilds or players on their realms are responsible for what might be a lack of high-end raiding on PvE realms, as you put it.

However, it was Blizzard's fault that they let most servers fall into a state of such low population or imbalance that the players playing on them couldn't tell much difference between a PvP or PvE server as far as world PvP was concerned. It's also their fault that they let the servers stay like that for so long that they let their playerbase get used to that environment. It may not have been their intention, but they definitely let it happen.

I agree that Blizzard could have done some things differently and I'm not going to argue against these so-called free passes that many are asking for. What I think needs to be accepted is that the players are also responsible for their own choices. Before one even can try out a PvP realm and get the false impression of how they function, they have already accepted the rule set when creating or moving a character there.