Mega-Thread: Gun Control Thread

[Elegiac]

I hope this is a more favorable source for you, Didactic! I know your dismissiveness was about that and not about this being a very uncomfortable topic for you.

See, was that so hard?

It also doesn't actually, you know, change anything. America has a problem of too many guns in circulation that are too easy to acquire - so I'm not sure what you think your point is or why you think the existence of people with certain prejudices would be 'uncomfortable' for me.

[PickleballAce]

It also doesn't actually, you know, change anything. America has a problem of too many guns in circulation that are too easy to acquire - so I'm not sure what you think your point is or why the existence of people with certain prejudices would be 'uncomfortable'.

I have to say that I have always been a huge fan of your internet character.

[Milchshake]

"An instructor at the CCW event showed slides titled, “Firearm Safety for White People,” and 'Firearm Safety for Black People.'”
This is really revolting. Looks like several GOP candidates were invited.



Racist comments were made at a CCW event held over the weekend.
Several local Republican politicians were in attendance, including North Las Vegas Mayor John Lee who appeared to be sitting in the front row.
No response from him.




Gun Culture is basically an extension of Slave Owner culture. Change My Mind.

[Elegiac]

I have to say that I have always been a huge fan of your internet character.

So you don't actually have a point. Good to know.

[PickleballAce]

"Several local Republican politicians were in attendance..."

<---- This is my surprised face.

- - - Updated - - -

So you don't actually have a point. Good to know.

The feigned obtuseness is, as always, just masterfully deployed. *Chef's kiss*

[Elegiac]

The feigned obtuseness is, as always, just masterfully deployed. *Chef's kiss*

I'm just glad I don't have to pay rent for the sheer amount of your headspace that I apparently occupy. Rofl.

Again: I'm not sure what you think your point was with that article since it in no way disputes the fact that there are too many guns in circulation. Unless your 'point' was something to the effect of "see, people can be prejudiced against X group therefore systemic racism doesn't exist!", which... No, but okay.

[Stormdash]

Bigotry is a moral failing, not a psychological one. Be instantly wary of anyone who wants to brand that which they find inimical to be mentally ill, since the only reason to do that is as pretext to deprive them of legal agency.

[Endus]

Bigotry is a moral failing, not a psychological one. Be instantly wary of anyone who wants to brand that which they find inimical to be mentally ill, since the only reason to do that is as pretext to deprive them of legal agency.

While I agree with the point that we make far too many accusations of mental health failings when the reality is moral failings, and that evil, abusive people are just bad people, not mentally ill, the idea that such accusations of illness are pretexts to denying them legal agency is wildly off-base. The overwhelming majority of mental illnesses don't deny anyone's legal agency; you have to be so ill that you're a danger to yourself or others before you'll be committed against your will to an institution. Paranoid schizophrenia or sociopathy or psychopathy or delusional behaviour, by examples, all fail to meet that bar by themselves, just due to diagnosis alone.

By all means, yes, let's call evil people "evil" rather than giving them the excuse of an illness they suffer from, which deflects the blame they should be forced to accept for their choices. But that's more about not stigmatizing mental health issues and not giving bigots that potential excuse.

[XDurionX]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61192975

Gun deaths were the leading killer of US children in 2020

If only there had been good kids with guns to save em from the bad kids with guns

[PhaelixWW]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61192975

Gun deaths were the leading killer of US children in 2020

If only there had been good kids with guns to save em from the bad kids with guns

I mean... "children, adolescents, and young adults", since the age range is <20, not <18.

Hopefully this was somewhat of a pandemic blip and it will go back down.

[Draco-Onis]

I mean... "children, adolescents, and young adults", since the age range is <20, not <18.

Hopefully this was somewhat of a pandemic blip and it will go back down.

I don't know I think the psychological damage that has happened due to the pandemic will last for years.

[PhaelixWW]

I don't know I think the psychological damage that has happened due to the pandemic will last for years.

I'm not suggesting it'll be 100% back to where it was before. Like many things, it subscribes to an aspect of the Pareto principle.

I think it wasn't necessarily due to just long-lasting psychological damage. I'm sure the bulk of it was due to short-term hardship coupled with a lack of other distracting activities.

[Mayhem]

I'm not suggesting it'll be 100% back to where it was before. Like many things, it subscribes to an aspect of the Pareto principle.

I think it wasn't necessarily due to just long-lasting psychological damage. I'm sure the bulk of it was due to short-term hardship coupled with a lack of other distracting activities.

Do I understand you here, you're saying people shoot each other in the US because of short-term hardship coupled with a lack of distracting activities?

dafuq?

[PhaelixWW]

Do I understand you here, you're saying people shoot each other in the US because of short-term hardship coupled with a lack of distracting activities?

dafuq?

Are you intentionally misunderstanding me or something?

People commit violence for all kinds of reasons. The uptick in violence in the last couple of years, however, is largely due to pandemic-centered hardships combined with the fact that some of the more violence-prone people have more time on their hands than common sense.

You'll note that this statement doesn't suggest that:

• all violence is due to these things
• all people are equally more prone to violence because of these things
• the violence is actually directly caused by these things

It's not fucking rocket science. People who are already either borderline prone to violence can find themselves on the far side of that borderline when faced with socioeconomic hardships. People who already at risk of feeling disenfranchised can resort to violence when more meaningful, constructive avenues are no longer apparent.

It's not going to make all angry or poor people killers, but it might contribute to some of them making that decision. Enough to cause an uptick in violence, for sure.

But when those socioeconomic hardships pass, so too does the pressure, and many of those borderline people will hopefully find themselves making a decision other than violence.

I mean, this is what outreach programs are all about and shouldn't really have to be explained to you.

[Mayhem]

Are you intentionally misunderstanding me or something?

People commit violence for all kinds of reasons. The uptick in violence in the last couple of years, however, is largely due to pandemic-centered hardships combined with the fact that some of the more violence-prone people have more time on their hands than common sense.

You'll note that this statement doesn't suggest that:

• all violence is due to these things
• all people are equally more prone to violence because of these things
• the violence is actually directly caused by these things

It's not fucking rocket science. People who are already either borderline prone to violence can find themselves on the far side of that borderline when faced with socioeconomic hardships. People who already at risk of feeling disenfranchised can resort to violence when more meaningful, constructive avenues are no longer apparent.

It's not going to make all angry or poor people killers, but it might contribute to some of them making that decision. Enough to cause an uptick in violence, for sure.

But when those socioeconomic hardships pass, so too does the pressure, and many of those borderline people will hopefully find themselves making a decision other than violence.

I mean, this is what outreach programs are all about and shouldn't really have to be explained to you.

I never claimed anything, I asked if I understood you right. Also, the 3rd point of your list is actually your argument unless due to has an entirely new meaning so idk.

And yeah, you have to explain this to me because programs like these are more or less unheard of around here at least concerning the purpose you're describing.

Hu, maybe it should be harder for violent people to obtain and keep guns after all.

[PhaelixWW]

I never claimed anything, I asked if I understood you right.

Clearly, you don't, because...

Also, the 3rd point of your list is actually your argument unless due to has an entirely new meaning so idk.

No, actually, it doesn't. Those factors can influence a person who is already prone to violence, but it isn't the cause of the violence.

If you say that the increase in forest fires is due to an abundance of dried out trees, does that mean you're also saying that those individual fires were caused by those trees?

No. The cause of the violence is still the person, not the circumstances, even when those circumstances can influence the person. But those circumstances do not make that person commit the violence.

But apparently that nuance escapes you.

Hu, maybe it should be harder for violent people to obtain and keep guns after all.

But... it is. There are plenty of laws that aim to prevent people who are known to be violent from obtaining and keeping guns.

But I'm pretty sure what you're attempting to say here is really... "maybe it should be harder for everyone to obtain and keep guns, because I don't trust them not to be violent" ...even though the vast majority of gun owners are non-violent.

[Mayhem]

No, actually, it doesn't. Those factors can influence a person who is already prone to violence, but it isn't the cause of the violence.

If you say that the increase in forest fires is due to an abundance of dried out trees, does that mean you're also saying that those individual fires were caused by those trees?

Yes, that's what due to means. Maybe you don't want to use it like that but that's what the term means, it's a synonym for because. I would agree with you that dried-out trees are a contributing factor in the size of forest fires or the chance of forest fires occurring if that's what you're trying to say.

No. The cause of the violence is still the person, not the circumstances, even when those circumstances can influence the person. But those circumstances do not make that person commit the violence.

But apparently that nuance escapes you.

Agreed, thanks for clearing that up.

But... it is. There are plenty of laws that aim to prevent people who are known to be violent from obtaining and keeping guns.

Well then these laws quite obviously don't work as shown by the uptick.

But I'm pretty sure what you're attempting to say here is really... "maybe it should be harder for everyone to obtain and keep guns, because I don't trust them not to be violent" ...even though the vast majority of gun owners are non-violent.

You keep forgetting that I am from a country that has 30%+ gun ownership. So no, that's not at all what I am attempting to say. They should lose all of them they become violent though because then I really don't trust them with firearms and I think that is fairly reasonable.

[DarkAmbient]

At least 10 people have been killed in a mass shooting at a supermarket in the US city of Buffalo, New York state, AP has reported.

The gunman is reported to have been taken into custody after the attack on Saturday afternoon.

The exact number of people hurt at the Tops Friendly Market in Jefferson Avenue is yet to be confirmed.

AP said they had been told at least 10 had died by law enforcement officials.

The Buffalo News said the attack had been carried out by a gunman dressed in body armour and armed with a high-powered rifle.

[Omians]

At least 10 people have been killed in a mass shooting at a supermarket in the US city of Buffalo, New York state, AP has reported.

Just heard about this, guy was also was streaming it on twitch by the sounds of it

[PhaelixWW]

At least 10 people have been killed in a mass shooting at a supermarket in the US city of Buffalo, New York state, AP has reported.

18-year-old white supremacist who wrote the N-word on his rifle, published a manifesto... and now is pleading not guilty.

Lock him up and throw away the key.