Mega-Thread: Gun Control Thread

[Rukentuts]

Bob exercising his right to own a gun does not deprive Jane of her right to live, of course, so I can't tell if you are going for demagoguery and just stumbling into ignorance, or if ignorance was the plan all along.

What part of on a societal level, a positive correlation to homicide exists, don't you get? Because you're currently framing clinging to security blankets on a higher plane than life.

[Mayhem]

I have to make up specific scenarios to prove that there are specific scenarios? No shit.

no you have to make up specific scenarios to prove that there is sometimes a need for firearms, but that rare need doesn´t make it an overall positive

you´re basically arguing guns can save lifes and it´s good we have them even though they end more lifes than they save, no further regulation needed

- - - Updated - - -

Well, your position is in direct opposition to statistics. Other than ignorance, what else could it be?

... of defensive vs. offensive gun uses? moving goal posts again are we?

[TZucchini]

So: victim blaming.

Got it.

Advocating for preventative measures is not victim blaming. But I can see why you would be confused.

[Tinykong]

no you have to make up specific scenarios to prove that there is sometimes a need for firearms, but that rare need doesn´t make it an overall positive

you´re basically arguing guns can save lifes and it´s good we have them even though they end more lifes than they save, no further regulation needed

Strawman argument, away!

... of defensive vs. offensive gun uses? moving goal posts again are we?

Who said anything about specific uses? You're moving goal posts here.

You said guns are "generally bad." How many firearms are used in crimes every year compared to overall ownership?

- - - Updated - - -

Advocating for preventative measures is not victim blaming. But I can see why you would be confused.

So, females shouldn't wear revealing clothing because they could get raped?

[Zackandjames]

When I was 16 years old I was shot and robbed at gunpoint. I believe guns are a fundamental right of an individual to protect them self, to use for hunting and what ever rational, moral use a gun is needed for. Even though I almost died by somebody's Irresponsible "Cuz" who had a gun and used it to shoot me, I still believe in a persons right to own a gun. Our founding fathers believed that the individual should be able to own and carry guns. Guns could also be considered the citizens insurance plan against tyrannical Governments. Guns are not the problem. Stupid, or uneducated, ignorant, and mentally ill people are the problem.

P.S. The guy who shot me got a Malicious wounding charge and paid for his irresponsible, and reckless use of the firearm.

[TZucchini]

So, females shouldn't wear revealing clothing because they could get raped?

Is there a positive and significant correlation to women wearing revealing clothing, and being raped because of it? Or is this just another terrible false equivalency?

[Tinykong]

Is there a positive and significant correlation to women wearing revealing clothing, and being raped because of it? Or is this just another terrible false equivalency?

Is there one to me walking down a "dark alley at 2.a.m in a shady part of town" and being murdered? You started this victim blame train, I'm just trying to get some clarity.

[TZucchini]

Is there one to me walking down a "dark alley at 2.a.m in a shady part of town" and being murdered? You started this victim blame train, I'm just trying to get some clarity.

Is there positive and significant correlation to crime occurring in areas of high crime? Well yes, there is.

[Tinykong]

Is there positive and significant correlation to crime occurring in areas of high crime? Well yes, there is.

So, yes, it's victim blaming. The two statements are comparable.

Progress.

[TZucchini]

So, yes, it's victim blaming. The two statements are comparable.

Progress.

What two statements are comparable?

And again. Asking people to take precautions to avoid harm is not victim blaming. It's why police advocate that citizens lock their doors. Are the police victim blaming as well?

[Tinykong]

What two statements are comparable?

Telling someone not to walk down the street because they might get murdered is the same as telling someone not to wear revealing clothing because they might get raped.

And again. Asking people to take precautions to avoid harm is not victim blaming. It's why police advocate that citizens lock their doors. Are the police victim blaming as well?

Telling people they shouldn't do something because they might get victimized is victim blaming.

- - - Updated - - -

It's also incredibly racist. Should I be fearful of minority males? I mean, they are statistically most likely to commit crimes.

[TZucchini]

Telling someone not to walk down the street because they might get murdered is the same as telling someone not to wear revealing clothing because they might get raped.

That's the most ridiculous false equivalency I've heard in this thread.

Telling people they shouldn't do something because they might get victimized is victim blaming.

No. Telling a victim that their actions caused them to become a victim, is victim blaming.

Telling a non-victim to take valid precautions to prevent harm is definitively not victim blaming. How could you possibly be this confused?

- - - Updated - - -

It's also incredibly racist.

Can you please define racism for me?

[Tinykong]

That's the most ridiculous false equivalency I've heard in this thread.

Is it hard for you to compare two equivalent things? Could explain your problem.

No. Telling a victim that their actions caused them to become a victim, is victim blaming.

Telling a non-victim to take valid precautions to prevent harm is definitively not victim blaming. How could you possibly be this confused?

You're telling me that my actions could cause me to be victimized and I should change them. It's the same thing.

Can you please define racism for me?

Should I be scared of minority males? According to you, that's a valid precaution, right? They are statistically the most likely to commit crimes, according to your logic, I should be watching for them in high crime areas. Wouldn't want to get victimized.

[TZucchini]

Is it hard for you to compare two equivalent things? Could explain your problem.

A woman wearing revealing clothing is not equivalent to walking in a crime ridden area at 2 in the morning. They're not comparable. In the least.

You're telling me that my actions could cause me to be victimized and I should change them. It's the same thing.

Blaming a victim for being a victim, is not the "same thing" as advocating for preventative measures for non-victims. It's not even in the same ballpark. They're practically opposites.

Should I be scared of minority males? According to you, that's a valid precaution, right? They are statistically the most likely to commit crimes, according to your logic, I should be watching for them in high crime areas. Wouldn't want to get victimized.

Could you please define racism for me? I figure I'd ask again since you dodged the question the first time.

[Tinykong]

A woman wearing revealing clothing is not equivalent to walking in a crime ridden area at 2 in the morning. They're not comparable. In the least.

Yes, it is. You're saying that my actions are leading to being victimized.

Blaming a victim for being a victim, is not the "same thing" as advocating for preventative measures for non-victims. It's not even in the same ballpark. They're practically opposites.

It's the same thing. You're telling me that what I am doing could result in me being victimized, and telling me to change my behavior. You're blaming me.

Could you please define racism for me? I figure I'd ask again since you dodged the question the first time.

You're a smart guy, go look it up if you need a definition.

[TZucchini]

It's the same thing. You're telling me that what I am doing could result in me being victimized, and telling me to change my behavior. You're blaming me.

Advocating for preventative action is not the "same thing" as blaming someone for not taking preventative action.

Does anyone actually agree with this nonsense?

You're a smart guy, go look it up if you need a definition.

There's an obvious reason as to why you're not answering the simple question asked of you. We both know why. So let's just chalk up that "it's racist!" comment to momentary lapse in judgement.

[Tinykong]

Advocating for preventative action is not the "same thing" as blaming someone for not taking preventative action.

So, you believe that women shouldn't dress provocatively.

There's an obvious reason as to why you're not answering the simple question asked of you. We both know why. So let's just chalk up that "it's racist!" comment to momentary lapse in judgement.

If you wanted a definition of a word, you should have gone and looked it up. Since you obviously wanted more than just a definition, this was another loaded question (shocking. ) which merits no response.

[TZucchini]

So, you believe that women shouldn't dress provocatively.

If women dressing provocatively positively and significantly correlates to them being raped, then I would certain caution them against it.

Since it doesn't, your suggestion is a laughable false equivalency.

And I would never tell a rape victim that she shouldn't have dressed the way she did. That would be victim-blaming.

If you wanted a definition of a word, you should have gone and looked it up. Since you obviously wanted more than just a definition, this was another loaded question (shocking. ) which merits no response.

I asked you for the definition because you clearly don't know what the word "racist" means. Certainly not after you accused me of being so, simply by advocating for preventative measures. Not surprised that you're trying to race-bait though.

[Tinykong]

If women dressing provocatively positively and significantly correlates to them being raped, then I would certain caution them against it.

Since it doesn't, your suggestion is a laughable false equivalency.

And I would never tell a rape victim that she shouldn't have dressed the way she did. That would be victim-blaming.

But you would certainly tell an assault victim they shouldn't have walked down that alley way...

Whatever it takes to justify your ridiculous position that I don't need a firearm, I just can avoid being a victim, right?

I asked you for the definition because you clearly don't know what the word "racist" means. Certainly not after you accused me of being so, simply by advocating for preventative measures. Not surprised that you're trying to race-bait though.

It's not racist to be fearful of minority males? Interesting.

[TZucchini]

But you would certainly tell an assault victim they shouldn't have walked down that alley way...

No. I certainly wouldn't do that either. That would be victim-blaming. I'm advocating for prevention.

It's not racist to be fearful of minority males? Interesting.

No, actually. It's not. This is why I asked you to define 'racism', because you clearly don't know the definition.

But regardless, I never stated I was fearful of minority males. So again, you're projecting.