5.2 Shaman changes

[Deleted]

Honestly, I very much doubt whether Elemental will "only" see a 2% buff. I wouldn't be surprised if it's higher than that.

From what source? FS buff is at best a few hundred DPS buff(perhaps 200 roughly estimated).

And EM seems totally out of control right now. Those talents won't go live like that, since AS is static 5% haste, EM is 30% haste for 20 sec every minute. It even averages 10% haste vs 5% + instant cast every 1.5min.
For exact results, we will have to wait for the updated simcraft. PE will be a real choice for elemental for certain fight lengths. On a 5min fight, it will still be inferior by 2 or 3 %, but over a 6min patchwork fight, it might work very well as a little dps increase.

We will first have to wait what their plan is for our t4 talents. Their goal is to make them a real choice, which in current PTR state, simply isn't true. EM is easily double as good as AS and EotE is also somewhat behind.

[Sarevokcz]

Honestly, I very much doubt whether Elemental will "only" see a 2% buff. I wouldn't be surprised if it's higher than that.

wait, what? tuning underpowered talents to be competitive with the others on the same tier we were using is >2% buff?

[Deleted]

wait, what? tuning underpowered talents to be competitive with the others on the same tier we were using is >2% buff?

They could change EM to be a proc with 10% and 10% mastery and 10% crit. Or a random chance of getting one of the three (like EB procc).

Or they could finally fix haste scaling by giving LB and CL a 2 sec casttime as elemental, but of course buff damage per cast to compensate.


There are only two speccs left with a broken haste talent: elemental and to a lesser extent frost mages. Time to fix this!

[Recom]

You guys are getting this all wrong, the goal of the changes datamined was not to buff/nerf any spec it was only to tweak underpowered talents and mandatory glyphs, nothing more. Once that's done (and final, we all agree EM cannot go live like that), maybe we'll see a buff to elemental damage.

[oxpo]

I do really hope that's the case..

[zenga]

They could change EM to be a proc with 10% and 10% mastery and 10% crit. Or a random chance of getting one of the three (like EB procc).

I hope not for the crit part as that sounds like a waste for lava burst, a 15% haste + 15% mastery would be nice however.

[mrinvisable2]

dont worry we will get shamanism buff as in every patch

[Deleted]

I hope not for the crit part as that sounds like a waste for lava burst, a 15% haste + 15% mastery would be nice however.

Well you don't know what you deserve!

Anyways, it's only about giving a class with 1.5 seconds casts not a 30% haste cd that is completely wasted when stacked with heroism/BL.

---------- Post added 2012-12-26 at 02:58 PM ----------

You guys are getting this all wrong, the goal of the changes datamined was not to buff/nerf any spec it was only to tweak underpowered talents and mandatory glyphs, nothing more. Once that's done (and final, we all agree EM cannot go live like that), maybe we'll see a buff to elemental damage.

I think so too. And that's what i fear, If they nerf EM again, then enhancement gets only a nerf via UF and elemental would've only that little flame shock buff.

[Terminal Lance]

Everyone relax with EM buff, it's the first batch of 5.2 patch notes It's most definitely not making it live as is. Maybe if they reduced Haste to 25% and reduced duration to 15 sec... it would really be nice though if it's cooldown was reduced to 1min; would line up well with Engineering stuffs.

[Koohii]

Ok, so they said they'd try to give compensation for Ele/Enh for the totem nerf via a Def. CD. Ele got SR, which is great for them, but what about Enhance? We're still the weakest melee in PvP survival wise (Damage wise maybe as well? I only have honor gear with T1 weapons and a couple Mal pieces, but feels like I hit for nothing.) so hopefully we could get a talent reworked for all specs to give us an immunity like most other classes have, maybe a disarm as well as we fight a lot of melee too?

I notice we have no Mortal Strike debuff either like most others have, that could be easily baked into Stormstrike. I just want some stuff so DPS shaman can be a little less frustrating in PvP and not have to roll Resto in order to get to a decent rating without smashing your monitor.

[Endus]

You were the one telling us always that elemental is okay. Now elemental is by far the worst DD and even 17-18% behind Affli.

If you haven't been posting on the forums, kindly don't make claims about what people have been saying.

I've been consistently saying that Elemental's damage was low and in need of a buff since shortly after we had the data to make those kinds of calls. You're trying to pull my comments regarding Elemental DPS in 4.2-4.3 in, which is bollocks, since that was an entirely different context with entirely different damage numbers, where Elemental wasn't lagging as badly as we are today.

Stop trying to provoke a reaction out of people by taking their comments out of context and being rude and condescending in your own comments. That's not just me; you've pulled that behaviour on pretty much everyone else in the thread as well.

[Deleted]

Ok, so they said they'd try to give compensation for Ele/Enh for the totem nerf via a Def. CD. Ele got SR, which is great for them, but what about Enhance? We're still the weakest melee in PvP survival wise (Damage wise maybe as well? I only have honor gear with T1 weapons and a couple Mal pieces, but feels like I hit for nothing.) so hopefully we could get a talent reworked for all specs to give us an immunity like most other classes have, maybe a disarm as well as we fight a lot of melee too?

I notice we have no Mortal Strike debuff either like most others have, that could be easily baked into Stormstrike. I just want some stuff so DPS shaman can be a little less frustrating in PvP and not have to roll Resto in order to get to a decent rating without smashing your monitor.

4 days ago, GC stated that they are okay with enhancer in PVP because they nerf silences and so on.

Don't expect anything to come.

I just hope it's not an overall nerf as it could be with the UF nerf.

[Didrah]

If they want to make Unleashed fury more appealing for ele in pve they have to make that buff last at least 1 min, otherwise EB will always win.

Surely they will do the usual and boring shamanism buff that we all know is just a bandaid to cover our low performance.

[Kralljin]

If they want to make Unleashed fury more appealing for ele in pve they have to make that buff last at least 1 min, otherwise EB will always win.

I doubt that, strongly.

I'm not sure if Eb might be the clear winner with those Buffs to PE / UF.

[Deleted]

I doubt that, strongly.

I'm not sure if Eb might be the clear winner with those Buffs to PE / UF.

PE will win out on some fight lengthes, mostly when we get optimal use of FE. Say on a 6 min fight.

On a 5 min fight, PE will be the clear loser. Where the exact differences are? We will have to see, it will be dependent on how

But i've been running some sims:

for EB to work for enhancers, it would need 2k static agi in BIS gear. That's not going to happen, with EB having less than 60% uptime. Because of the UF nerf, it would be a little less.

It's mechanic is too weak for enhancement. It could look differently if they made the scale amount of stats scale with agi (EB scales pretty bad for enhancers). On top of that, it needed to be an isntant cast to fit in the rotation. And after that, we could talk about whether an agi procc is necessary or if we wouldn't work it better in the scaling part of secondary stats. It could be e.g. 50% of agi and 40% of int or so, to make it balanceable for enh and elemental.

UF for elemental is the same problem. It doesn't fit the rotation and nerfing bonus lb damage and buffing lb damage won't fix it if it's both 10%. LB is 35% of the damage with that talent, LB is 40%. That shift may be a 3% nerf to dps and a 4% buff to dps, resulting in a minor buff. Not enough to make up for the distance.

Both aside, EB also increases your AOE damage.

[CHRONICGODX]

PE will win out on some fight lengthes, mostly when we get optimal use of FE. Say on a 6 min fight.

for EB to work for enhancers, it would need 2k static agi in BIS gear. That's not going to happen, with EB having less than 60% uptime. Because of the UF nerf, it would be a little less.

It's mechanic is too weak for enhancement. It could look differently if they made the scale amount of stats scale with agi (EB scales pretty bad for enhancers). On top of that, it needed to be an isntant cast to fit in the rotation. And after that, we could talk about whether an agi procc is necessary or if we wouldn't work it better in the scaling part of secondary stats. It could be e.g. 50% of agi and 40% of int or so, to make it balanceable for enh and elemental.

Both aside, EB also increases your AOE damage.

Art of War procs could be cool for ele blast. MW5s have a chance to reset cooldown on ele blast?

[Lap]

I doubt that, strongly.

I'm not sure if Eb might be the clear winner with those Buffs to PE / UF.

yeah i'm uncertain as to if there's a 'clear' winner here...
In PVP however, dropped EB as fast as I can. Stuff getting locked out of every school and having to rely on crit for decent EB numbers. I'll take a LvB buff ANYDAY.

[Kralljin]

yeah i'm uncertain as to if there's a 'clear' winner here...
In PVP however, dropped EB as fast as I can. Stuff getting locked out of every school and having to rely on crit for decent EB numbers. I'll take a LvB buff ANYDAY.

Here's my hint for EB in PvP.

NEVER Cast Eb if your Enemy has an Interrupt rdy.

Only Cast EB:
If you want to fake cast, works great because many people know that interrupting Eb shuts down a Shaman
If you got just interrupted, since it's a multi school spell it can never get locked out, except if Eb itself is kicked.

Without Eb you won't have decent Burst outside of Ascendance.

[EleShamLAZERBEAMZ]

Nothing a Dmg increase.

Flame shock glyph not mandatory, who cares we dont have a glyph to replace it.

EM buff is a dps loss from the second cast chance almost certain.

Ele shamans bottom tier dps for ANOTHER tier.

[Relapses]

Nothing a Dmg increase.

Flame shock glyph not mandatory, who cares we dont have a glyph to replace it.

EM buff is a dps loss from the second cast chance almost certain.

Ele shamans bottom tier dps for ANOTHER tier.

Good thing these patch notes are final and 5.2 will be released before the next reset.