Falkland Islands - your view

[Deleted]

Britain crushed the Egyptians as well. This is what they used to do, kill the people who want independence. Haven't any of you seen Brave heart? Falklands, Northern Ireland and Scotland should be able to break free like India did.

Because only Britain did this.

[Elodeon]

You know, instead of whining about people not bending over backwards to accommodate your unreasonable excuses for land grabs.

The only reason your position seems to have consensus here is because the language spoken is English. (Hint, hint. English is spoken by whom?)

If you went to a Spanish speaking forum, the situation and assumptions would be entirely the other way around.

Anyways, you are missing my point. My point is that, contrary to beliefs widespread in countries that are close to England, Argentina does have a reasonable claim over economic resources right in front of them, where no one actually lives except a handful of people from Britain.

The British side publicly defends their claim with an argument of self-determination for the Falklands population, but this population is paltry and irrelevant considering the claims involved. The self-determination argument is attractive to people who adopt a certain set of naive ideals, but it is ultimately stupid.

Your claim that it's irrelevant who writes international law is pretty much an abdication of your argument. Of course it matters. You would like to put up international law as some sort of immutable ideal that should be respected at all times, but really, that's only because in this case it was written in your point of view's favor.

The conflict over the Falklands is ultimately a conflict of power, a conflict which Argentina lost. This is of course embarrassing for them. I don't care if Britain keeps the Falklands, just don't make stupid arguments about self-determination, because that's not what this is all about.

"Token" population? As in, you mean they live there solely to justify the British claims to the islands?

You think not?

Straight from the Wiki:

A population decline leading up to the Falklands War has reversed, with the population bolstered by immigration from the British island of Saint Helena, and Chile[134] though figures for immigration are skewed by including children born to Falkland Islander women who for medical reasons travelled abroad for their confinement as being "born abroad".[131] Historical census figures show that the population rose from an estimate of 287 in 1851 to 2,272 in 1911. The population was 2,094 in 1921 and 2,392 in 1931, but it then declined to 1,813 in 1980.[131] However, the population recorded in the 2001 census was higher than at any previous point in history.

[Deleted]

The only reason your position seems to have consensus here is because the language spoken is English. (Hint, hint. English is spoken by whom?)

If you went to a Spanish speaking forum, the situation and assumptions would be entirely the other way around.

Anyways, you are missing my point. My point is that, contrary to beliefs widespread in countries that are close to England, Argentina does have a reasonable claim over economic resources right in front of them, where no one actually lives except a handful of people from Britain.

The British side publicly defends their claim with an argument of self-determination for the Falklands population, but this population is paltry and irrelevant considering the claims involved. The self-determination argument is attractive to people who adopt a certain set of naive ideals, but it is ultimately stupid.

Your claim that it's irrelevant who writes international law is pretty much an abdication of your argument. Of course it matters. You would like to put up international law as some sort of immutable ideal that should be respected at all times, but really, that's only because in this case it was written in your point of view's favor.

The conflict over the Falklands is ultimately a conflict of power, a conflict which Argentina lost. This is of course embarrassing for them. I don't care if Britain keeps the Falklands, just don't make stupid arguments about self-determination, because that's not what this is all about.

Define "right infront of them", aren't the islands outside of their waters?

[Deleted]

Also consider this, The Falkland islands are as close to Argentina as Portugal is to Mainland Britain. Do we have a right to claim Iceland as British seeing as it's closer to Britain than the Falklands are to Argentina! I mean, who cares what the Icelandic people want, there's only 300,000 of them

If you think that Argentina have a right to claim the Falklands as theirs by reason of proximity or the fact that they had 18 soldiers garrisoned on it once. Then lets use this analogy, should the US should hand over Guam to China or North Korea, as they are closer by proximity to Guam than Mainland US, who cares what the Guam islanders want right? Oh and just imagine there happened to be a huge amount of natural resources in Guam... 'Oh yes China we acknowledge that you once had a fishing boat run aground on it - sure take it!'....... GTFO.

[Northem]

It is pure common sense.

The day will arrive in which the Anglo-Saxon Empire will fall under its own weight, in fact, his fall is already starting. And that day, the rest of the free world will own their own destinies. A new age will rise from the ashes of the english-speaking lands...

The sovereignty of the Malvinas Islands is to the Republic of Argentina as the sovereignty of Gibraltar is to the Kingdom of Spain. Just a matter of time before the Anglo-American potency ceases to exist, and will be then when the Kingdom of Spain and all its offspring-countries of the Hispanic America may claim the land they stole from us!

Too many abuses we have suffered from the Anglo-Saxon Empire, too much contempt ... and too much complacency for our part ... It's the time!

For the King! For the Hispanic Empire!

[Deleted]

Britain fought for the islands when there was no hint of oil there and NOW the Argentinians want to start up the argument again? Good luck.

It's more of a matter of pride for the UK now, just as it was last time. If the UK were to give up The Falklands to Argentina either through invasion (unlikely) or political pressure it would present a host of problems for other British overseas territories.

[larrakeyah]

The people want to remain part of Britain, end of story.

[Deleted]

I`ve never understood why the UK has any rights to an island on the other side of the planet, other then the royals saying go grab that land for us, regardless of how many may die on both sides.
Having said that. The people living on that island want to remain under English sovereignty & that is their choice. If the UK agrees for them to do so, then it`s not up for debate.
This isn`t like they kicked the previous tenants off or killed them all to take this itty bitty bit of ground in the firsts place.
There was no one there.
Southern Ireland & gawd knows how many countries that the Brits invaded over the centuries have since broken free & they`ve not gone chasing after them again....yet

[corebit]

The native Falklanders have already spoken (many times) that they wish to remain a British territory and under British rule.

But Argentina doesn't even acknowledge this truth, and instead wants to claim the Islands without its citizens consent.

This is just another stir-shit-up tactic by Kirchner, the current Argentinian President, to divert attention away from the country's economic problems. A cheap but effective tactic used by thug countries such as Communist China, North Korea, and Iran.

[larrakeyah]

Thanks to the banana republic like nationalization of Repsol-YPF I'm 100% sure Spain will support the UK.

EDIT: it was a response to Northem

[Elodeon]

Define "right infront of them", aren't the islands outside of their waters?

You tell me. Does this look like outside of their waters?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fa...onomicZone.png

[yetgdhfgh]

It is pure common sense.

The day will arrive in which the Anglo-Saxon Empire will fall under its own weight, in fact, his fall is already starting. And that day, the rest of the free world will own their own destinies. A new age will rise from the ashes of the english-speaking lands...

The sovereignty of the Malvinas Islands is to the Republic of Argentina as the sovereignty of Gibraltar is to the Kingdom of Spain. Just a matter of time before the Anglo-American potency ceases to exist, and will be then when the Kingdom of Spain and all its offspring-countries of the Hispanic America may claim the land they stole from us!

Too many abuses we have suffered from the Anglo-Saxon Empire, too much contempt ... and too much complacency for our part ... It's the time!

For the King! For the Hispanic Empire!

King? Which king?

The Spainish empire destroyed and raped south america and now spain is just a bankrupt country begging countries like germany and the UK to stop it going bankrupt

You will never get back gibraltar and the argintines will never get the falklands

DEAL WITH IT!

[semaphore]

The only reason your position seems to have consensus here is because the language spoken is English.

Irrelevant. The claims are claims regardless of what language you chose to defend your claim in.

The bottom line is that you have failed to produce any logical argument to support the Argentinian claim. All your posts are filled with nothing but logical fallacies. Your Argentinian claim turns out it's utter bullshit based on deliberately and dishonestly ignoring the historical fact that the Argentinians did not live in the Falkland Islands, which belonged to a different empire. Your attacks on the British claim turns out to be completely baseless in international law.

And having been defeated on all fronts, instead of formulating any rational argument based on the legalities of the matter, you start whining about international law not being on your side. Hey, guess what? If the law doesn't support you that means you are wrong!

Since apparently you can't come up with a better excuse than "it's ours because we're greedy and want the oil" then there's no reason to take you seriously anymore.

[Deleted]

The people want to remain part of Britain, end of story.

Exactly. I am baffled by the fact that are people, even though they are a minority in this thread, that support Argentina's claims. This is a simple democratic matter. Even though it's only a very small amount of people that lives on the Falkland Islands, they have chosen through democratic processes to not join Argentina and not become independent. They chose to stay with Britain. If anyone is against that, they are in theory not accepting something that is democratic. If this weird behaviour in Argenttina keeps on, even if the referendum still shows a majority vote for staying with Britain, then it's obvious Argentina just want the oil.

[larrakeyah]

King? Which king?

The Spainish empire destroyed and raped south america and now spain is just a bankrupt country begging countries like germany and the UK to stop it going bankrupt

You will never get back gibraltar and the argintines will never get the falklands

DEAL WITH IT!

Spain is at odds with Argentina, don't listen to Northem.

[semaphore]

Define "right infront of them", aren't the islands outside of their waters?

It's also beyond ridiculous to try claim inhabited islands owned by another sovereign nation on the basis of territorial waters. Your territorial waters give way before the territory of another state. But then, Elodeon clearly wants to rewrite international law to benefit Argentina's this one claim.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Would Pres. Fernandez support returning Argentina to the indigenous peoples that were displaced by the Spanish and the Portuguese?


It has been a British Crown Dependency for over 150 years. Argentina invaded the Falklands in 1982, in a war of aggression. Argentina got their asses soundly kicked and lost in 3 months. The inhabitants want to remain a British dependency. The British government wants the Falklands to remain a British dependency. If Argentina wants the Falklands so bad, they can come invade again. Oh wait, we destroyed their air-force and navy 20 years ago and they haven't been able to buy any new equipment since then, because the government has RUN THE COUNTRY INTO THE GROUND.

Argentina probably couldn't afford to rent a fishing boat to travel the 1200 miles to the Falklands. For those more up to speed on American geography, that is approximately the distance between New York City, NY and Kansas City, MO. If you were to travel east from London, you would be in the Ukraine before you had travelled 1200 miles, having crossed 8 or 9 countries.

Haven't any of you seen Brave heart?

Yes, Braveheart is a true representation of historical facts. Oh wait, it isn't.

[Elodeon]

Then lets use this analogy, should the US should hand over Guam to China or North Korea, as they are closer by proximity to Guam than Mainland US,

Guam is pretty far from everything, though it's true that US doesn't have a huge claim by proximity.

who cares what the Guam islanders want right?

What does it matter what they want? Guam doesn't belong to the US because the islanders voted for it. I haven't seen anyone claim that.

Guam is important strategically, it belongs to the US because the US wants a base in the Pacific. End of story.

[Ianus]

Oil you say?

Time for the US to deliver some Freedom to the islands.

lol.. yeah it would be nice

[Deleted]

There is even questioning ? Go ask the people on this damn island, thats it. They say "we are english" what more does the world need to hear ?

and to Northem, I dont even know what to say... of course you can reclaim what they stole from you, but first germany wants his money back to keep your country alive.