My situation with my current guild..

[Velshin]

Find a new guild, that guild doesn't deserve you as a player or a friend.

Although tbh, having an os is a pretty big thing nowadays. I need to start getting a holy set together ready for when I need to go holy, and not too excited about it >_<

Yeah I agree I'm atm collecting prot gears have some heroic tanking stuff and have the off spec prot ready. Thanks for your feedback and opinion.

[isadorr]

The problem is that the raid leader hate melees in general and told me he barely can tolerate one melee in the grp which the frost dk.

It is a fact that progression is faster with range and melee have always had it bad in wow progression. Ret has great burst then bad sustained dps, we had 2 ret pallies who werent that great in DS go holy or as you, would be benched. We are full clearing heroic mode and on weekends our melee run a alt raid so they can gear out a range for the start of progression in the next tier.

It is about numbers and we like to have melee but overall we end up with a range heavy setup at the beginning of every tier, and if you look at progression guilds especially world class guilds, they do the same. Run alt runs and gear up alts that can step in so they are learning the fights but aren't a hinderance to progression. He is not a bad raid leader and in fact is is the norm.

If you are trying to progress and want that is best for the guild progression, then you would either respec or accept others doing more dps with better utility. If it is about friendship then i am guessing you arent a raiding progression guild.

---------- Post added 2013-02-02 at 05:10 AM ----------

Never understood guilds where people are perma-benched. If the raid leader thinks someone isn't good enough to be raiding, he should kick that person from the raid team / guild. Keeping someone around just because he might be useful if someone's absent is rather disespectful.

You need a bench if you are going to push progression. Swapping people out to maximize the raids chances is common among progression guilds.

---------- Post added 2013-02-02 at 05:14 AM ----------

I'm not saying I'm the best retri even when it comes to pve heroic raiding but as I said in my previous posts I pull my own weight durning hc raids and downed heroics where I'm at least something like second or third in dps when it comes to heroic current tier. I don't think the reason was because of my dps because we have lower dps ppl in our guild as well and they are not getting the same treatment of getting benched as much as I'm but yeah I guess I always consider some ppl even good friends are honest with me and telling me if I'm doing something wrong or something instead of just benching all the time.

I have friends in casual progression guilds and i see this all the time. One person says my dps isnt bad or the raid dps isnt bad and then I look at logs. I tell my friend the raid leader he has bad dps and that is why they are hitting enrages or barely beating them. People sometimes dont realize how bad they are until they look at other guilds and what numbers they are pulling.

I jumped on my mage alt and ran with them, their top dps was a ret. I destroyed him with lesser gear and not raiding with them before. Some people dont know that they arent pulling good numbers or people that say this class or this class is fine until they look at raidlogs seeing how their class is 40k dps behind other classes in the top 100 parses.

---------- Post added 2013-02-02 at 05:17 AM ----------

Yes some logs you are checking are correct that it seems low but guess what? after 2 months of being benched and just not raiding and spending hours and hours waiting for raid spots makes even the best awesome players get rusty don't you think? I'm not making excuses here its true that some fighs I'm doing lower than average but guess what? that was the end when I los eve motivation to even raid after of being months and months of just not raiding. One more thing most of the time durning heroic raids fights the raid leader telling us to stop dps all of us to have good transition such as spirit king fights and elegon heroics and much more like when the stun of feng failed where we have to stop dps and run because feng didn't get stunned all of these facts are one of the reason of what you saw low dps the other reason I mentioned above.



Also never trust logs 100% because you have no idea what kind of talk or communications happening in vent durning raids. My mentality is not just pulling weight ofc everyone wants to be the best but when you sometimes hear your leader shout and whine about not whoring dps meter because he doesn't care then the other min he says what is the wrong with dps? then yes thing get little but annoying. I never said I'm super amazing but I have been playing for a very long time before the invention of logs and achievements got released. Played with so many hardcore guilds with top servers hc with the mentality of "as long as you pull your weight and don't die and fail and we get hc kill that's fine no need to dps whoring" and other hc mentality who wants ppl to smash meter as you said. It's just different mentality.

But anyway thanks for your feedback and opinion mate most appreciated.

FUN FACT: in the HC progression you mentioned it was 25M, it is incredibly easy to carry a bad dps in 25m than it is to carry them in 10M.

[Velshin]

It is a fact that progression is faster with range and melee have always had it bad in wow progression. Ret has great burst then bad sustained dps, we had 2 ret pallies who werent that great in DS go holy or as you, would be benched. We are full clearing heroic mode and on weekends our melee run a alt raid so they can gear out a range for the start of progression in the next tier.

It is about numbers and we like to have melee but overall we end up with a range heavy setup at the beginning of every tier, and if you look at progression guilds especially world class guilds, they do the same. Run alt runs and gear up alts that can step in so they are learning the fights but aren't a hinderance to progression. He is not a bad raid leader and in fact is is the norm.

If you are trying to progress and want that is best for the guild progression, then you would either respec or accept others doing more dps with better utility. If it is about friendship then i am guessing you arent a raiding progression guild.

---------- Post added 2013-02-02 at 05:10 AM ----------



You need a bench if you are going to push progression. Swapping people out to maximize the raids chances is common among progression guilds.

---------- Post added 2013-02-02 at 05:14 AM ----------



I have friends in casual progression guilds and i see this all the time. One person says my dps isnt bad or the raid dps isnt bad and then I look at logs. I tell my friend the raid leader he has bad dps and that is why they are hitting enrages or barely beating them. People sometimes dont realize how bad they are until they look at other guilds and what numbers they are pulling.

I jumped on my mage alt and ran with them, their top dps was a ret. I destroyed him with lesser gear and not raiding with them before. Some people dont know that they arent pulling good numbers or people that say this class or this class is fine until they look at raidlogs seeing how their class is 40k dps behind other classes in the top 100 parses.

---------- Post added 2013-02-02 at 05:17 AM ----------



FUN FACT: in the HC progression you mentioned it was 25M, it is incredibly easy to carry a bad dps in 25m than it is to carry them in 10M.

That's true but my heroic progress was in fact was 10 man before becoming 25 I only raided 25 heroic progress for 2 weeks then we lost a lot of members (something like 4 or 5 raiders) in our guild and the guild back to 10 man. So yeah most of my current heroic progress is actually 10 man.

Trust me man I'm okay with getting replaced and benched I have patience and I know when it comes about setup and progress heroic the setup need to be optimal. However, if you read my post as I said It's not like 1 or 2 weeks benched out it's entire over 2 months 80% of the time getting benched most of the time even when the heroic boss is on farm something like spirit king hc for example as you see killed it more than once and all of these kills are 10 man. Another example will be wil lof the emperor heroic the guild killed it more than 3 times which consider it as a farm yet I never got even the chance to fight it even though I manage to get off spec some tanking gears and spec ready for the spark soaking.

[Deleted]

To be fair my two toons i raid on are a Frost DK and a Ret Pally as main specs, i have offspecs geared for both if there is a need for me to perform a certain role, i hate playinga holy pally, but raid needed a healer so guess what i went holy for that night, thats what rls likepeople who will do stuff they don't like to help the group.

As for your dilema, my frost dk is very slightly less geared then my ret, and guess what apart from the odd gimmick fight, i would rather take my frost dk to any fight where dps was going to an issue

[Maleric]

Whatever the reason you're getting sat, it's BS that the raid leader won't tell you what that reason is. "Melee are bad" is just an excuse, as most raid groups include melee DPS.

[Boneshatter]

I don't know you or your guild but I'm guessing there is more to it than just a melee thing.

Example and true story- Two weeks ago my raid group parted ways with our top dps. Despite his dps numbers his raid awareness was horrible. He died more than anyone else by a noticable amount. If he got chained to someone on heroic dogs they were both going to die. If he got turned into a construct on Ambershaper during the monstrosity phase we had to have healer cooldowns up because he was going to miss the interrupt, and if we didn't dps him down fast enough he was going to get controlled. He would ask questions after the strategy was discussed that made it obvious he wasn't listening. We replaced him with someone in less gear that pulls less numbers but actually listens and does what they're supposed to do and in our 2 weeks with the new person we have cleared 2 new heroic bosses and are very close to a third. Farm bosses are much easier as well.

I'm not saying this is the exact case with you, but you really need to take an honest look at yourself and figure out the real reason you were benched. If you can't come up with anything then you need to find another group to raid with.

[Deleted]

Your raid leader is a moron.

Find a better/more suitable guild.

[Velshin]

I don't know you or your guild but I'm guessing there is more to it than just a melee thing.

Example and true story- Two weeks ago my raid group parted ways with our top dps. Despite his dps numbers his raid awareness was horrible. He died more than anyone else by a noticable amount. If he got chained to someone on heroic dogs they were both going to die. If he got turned into a construct on Ambershaper during the monstrosity phase we had to have healer cooldowns up because he was going to miss the interrupt, and if we didn't dps him down fast enough he was going to get controlled. He would ask questions after the strategy was discussed that made it obvious he wasn't listening. We replaced him with someone in less gear that pulls less numbers but actually listens and does what they're supposed to do and in our 2 weeks with the new person we have cleared 2 new heroic bosses and are very close to a third. Farm bosses are much easier as well.

I'm not saying this is the exact case with you, but you really need to take an honest look at yourself and figure out the real reason you were benched. If you can't come up with anything then you need to find another group to raid with.

I agree with you and understand your point as I said I have been in so many hardcore guilds before that for many years and this is the first time I encounter such issues by being benched because of being melee. I even talked to the raid leader himself in skype private alone me and him explaining and asking him the reasons behind all of this and he said it flatly to me: "Sorry man but melees sucks I really hate melees in 10 man raiding I can barely tolerate 1 single melee in the 10 man heroic progress."

This is exactly what he said in skype between me and him I'm not making this up. As for the low dps with some logs that other ppl seeing in this thread, there are many reasons behind it which you can't see it in Wol unfortunately. One of them that sometimes our Raid leader shout in vent by telling all of us to completly stop dps to have a better transition etc etc. Specially when this happens in a fight like spirit king hc where there are so many downtime for melees: such as dodging the double Flanking + Reflect + Shields etc etc. Same goes for elegon hc again the RL telling us to stop dps completly to have a better transition which I just press esc in my keyboard to avoid any drama and confusion. That's why for those ppl who are judging me by the logs because don't judge the person by his/her logs or achievements only start judging him when you actually play with the person yourself. You can link me all logs of the life or all achievements in your life I will not judge you if you are good or bad until I play with you in person then I will see it for myself. Example, will be 1 month ago I was pugging msv we needed a tank, a prot pala whispered me to invite him and he had all achievements of msv and even have 4/6 hc in msv but guess what? he was failing to tank stone guard so much causing us to wipe for 1 hour and half.

[Cirque]

I don't know what guild or server you're in, but anyway.

Rets are not bad. But for us, in terms of raid buffs and utility, other classes just brought more or the things we actually needed in our specific 10man setup (not saying rets bring nothing to the table, mind you). Maybe it is a similar case in your guild.

I don't think versatility has to be an issue, as some players have been arguing. In casual guilds, one thing I know is that "versatile", "hybrid" players are usually not really good players. The tank who goes dps and has no clue, the dps who goes healer and obviously is like wtf. I for one would never bench any hybrid for not wanting to play more than one spec in the casual guild I once, upon a time, was helping RL. In more serious guilds, I expect versatility and nothing less, though, from both pures as well as hybrids.

One thing is sure though: you're not being sat for no reason, also not cause "rl hates all melee": I bet he's saying that to not answer you. Maybe the others who took your place are better players, or whatever. Maybe there's another reason (think of guild drama) that has pushed you into the bench position. I'd say talk to some guildies, see what they know, and talk to your RL again, asking for an honest and complete answer.

You could always consider migrating. I know it costs you money but if your current realm is not offering what you need, it's probably a worthwhile investment.

The logs people have posted - you're defending yourself. I do not say you lie and the logs tell true - of course, there's many circumstances that can screw your DPS over. Yet, are you sure your performance is not actually less good than you believe it is? Most people refuse to see that they're not really good, the majority of trials we failed suffered from that disillusion. In fact, any player who claims is good probably is not. It's only if you know you can constantly improve that you have a shot at being great, really. Anyway, just consider your overall performance.

[kamuimac]

I will throw one thing to discussion - sometimes people who are even very active memebers of the guild have no idea about the amount things that are discussed in officer channel regarding many important stuff - liek who to take to raids , what are people strong sides , what are peoples weak sides - some people may think they are awesome and stuff when in reality sometimes officers disscuss how to bench them from raid without causeing too much guild drama. People may think that their contribution to raid is very big when in reality its isnt - people very often overestimate their abilities - and then officers have to deal with such situations with doing as little damage to the guild as they can.

Also things like seting progress team are very seldom done by the RL by only himself - RLs very often take advice of other 2-3 people who are involved in raiding and are contributing the most to the team . OP u need to look at the bigger picture here - u are 1 person and they have to take into account what say other 10 people who invest teir time to raiding too. If ur feeling underappriciated - maybe u are indeed - but there may be few other reasons why other people dont want to raid with u - what people say to ur eyes and what they say behind ur backs are very often totaly different things. Think if its worth the nerves and effort from ur side to stay in the guuild u are in rigth now. Sometimes changing guilds or transfering to other server is very refreshing and very good option which will bring u tons of benefits.

[Deleted]

oh you should find a new guild.

[Ferocity]

I really don't feel like melee are that badly off this tier, put together a list over the fights and what specs they favor, melees advantages are mainly mobility, being able to ignore certain abilities and to a certain extent cleave (excluding the fact that mages/locks are outright better than any other dps atm and the fact that locks excel at everything).

They are a burden on each encounter except maybe Garalon, where 1-2 melee might be cool thing to have. "Mobility" is a pvp perk, in PvE - it is ability to deal damage from range if needed and ability to stay on range from other people when needed. It is ranged who can basically negate or ignore many abilities or not suffer from them as much as melee in PvE.

Call me bias'd about it, but until enrage timers for most fights will be entirely removed (enrage timer is feature of Patchwerk-like encounter), or melee dps no longer become target of heavy anti-melee nukes in raids (and I can list tons of such nukes in current raid tier, where ranged-oriented group makes such things way less painful), I don't see point in bringing more than 1 melee dps (in 10-men).

[Deleted]

They are a burden on each encounter except maybe Garalon, where 1-2 melee might be cool thing to have. "Mobility" is a pvp perk, in PvE - it is ability to deal damage from range if needed and ability to stay on range from other people when needed. It is ranged who can basically negate or ignore many abilities or not suffer from them as much as melee in PvE.

Call me bias'd about it, but until enrage timers for most fights will be entirely removed (enrage timer is feature of Patchwerk-like encounter), or melee dps no longer become target of heavy anti-melee nukes in raids (and I can list tons of such nukes in current raid tier, where ranged-oriented group makes such things way less painful), I don't see point in bringing more than 1 melee dps (in 10-men).

This was true and very significant in the past but now you have close to as many mechanics punishing ranged dpsers. If everything else is equal it's still a slight advantage to be range in the current content, but it's getting closer and closer to an even playfield or even a disadvantage for ranged.

[Deleted]

It sounds like you and your raid team has grown apart.

You start out by referring to your guild as a casual raiding guild, but your current raid leader obviously wants it to be a hardcore hc progression guild, so while you think it's ok to only be ret, since that's what you want to play, it is not what your raid leader wants to have in his group.

I know it sucks that you have spent such a large amount of time and commitment on helping the group in the hopes that you would get slightly better treatment and freedom of choice in the long run, but to the person that wants to be a hardcore hc progression raid leader those things are now outweigh by the fact he thinks you/your class/spec no longer fits in that vision.

[Velshin]

It sounds like you and your raid team has grown apart.

You start out by referring to your guild as a casual raiding guild, but your current raid leader obviously wants it to be a hardcore hc progression guild, so while you think it's ok to only be ret, since that's what you want to play, it is not what your raid leader wants to have in his group.

I know it sucks that you have spent such a large amount of time and commitment on helping the group in the hopes that you would get slightly better treatment and freedom of choice in the long run, but to the person that wants to be a hardcore hc progression raid leader those things are now outweigh by the fact he thinks you/your class/spec no longer fits in that vision.

It's a casual guild I have been playing only ret even durning FL HC and DS HC when they were latest content and there was not a single problem at all. When I said being casual doesn't mean only normal mode and not capable of doing heroics that is not what I meant. Casual guild doesn't mean bad guild or not enough for heroics casual by saying casual I meant is friendly atmosphere with not a lot of raiding days and time for heroic raiding. For example, in cata heroic raiding the guild was raiding for only 2 or 3 raiding days for maximum of 3 hours and half raid time. This is what I mean when I said casual I don't refer casual as a bad guild or not enough for heroics this is not what I meant sorry if you misunderstand my meaning.

---------- Post added 2013-02-03 at 05:34 AM ----------

I don't know what guild or server you're in, but anyway.

Rets are not bad. But for us, in terms of raid buffs and utility, other classes just brought more or the things we actually needed in our specific 10man setup (not saying rets bring nothing to the table, mind you). Maybe it is a similar case in your guild.

I don't think versatility has to be an issue, as some players have been arguing. In casual guilds, one thing I know is that "versatile", "hybrid" players are usually not really good players. The tank who goes dps and has no clue, the dps who goes healer and obviously is like wtf. I for one would never bench any hybrid for not wanting to play more than one spec in the casual guild I once, upon a time, was helping RL. In more serious guilds, I expect versatility and nothing less, though, from both pures as well as hybrids.

One thing is sure though: you're not being sat for no reason, also not cause "rl hates all melee": I bet he's saying that to not answer you. Maybe the others who took your place are better players, or whatever. Maybe there's another reason (think of guild drama) that has pushed you into the bench position. I'd say talk to some guildies, see what they know, and talk to your RL again, asking for an honest and complete answer.

You could always consider migrating. I know it costs you money but if your current realm is not offering what you need, it's probably a worthwhile investment.

The logs people have posted - you're defending yourself. I do not say you lie and the logs tell true - of course, there's many circumstances that can screw your DPS over. Yet, are you sure your performance is not actually less good than you believe it is? Most people refuse to see that they're not really good, the majority of trials we failed suffered from that disillusion. In fact, any player who claims is good probably is not. It's only if you know you can constantly improve that you have a shot at being great, really. Anyway, just consider your overall performance.

Of course man I'm not saying I'm great and best ret ever hell not even close. There will be always room for improvements of course I agree and everyday we learn something new. However what I meant about my current logs specially the recent ones that to be honest with you I was raiding while having 0 motivation because of being benched 80% of the time and only raiding when the content is farm and when they have no one else to raid with. zero motivation spirit down + the a lot of stuff going on in vent like I mentioned above about the stop dps in vent by our raid leader and all of the stuff = affecting the dmg and performance overall. However, Yes I'm no in hell best ret or anything like that in fact at the moment I feel so rusty and out of shape because it's been long time since I raided a serious progress raid.

I love hearing opinions about everything which is one of the reason I created this thread. I'm not kinda guy who dismiss any feedback by saying "HEY I HAZ PLAY RET SINCE VANILLA YOU NU LEARN ME" haha nope I learn from everyone even the new players. Everyday we learn something new about the game either it's our class or spec.

Oh about talking to him man trust me I talked to him so many times to have an honest answer either front of officers or privately with him in skype and I always get the same answer. This case in the guild is not only me also another ret, rogue, and warrior suffering from the same fate that I'm and I can tell you that they are not bad players at all some of them better than me pve and raiding wise.

[Tene]

I don't know what guild or server you're in, but anyway.

Rets are not bad. But for us, in terms of raid buffs and utility, other classes just brought more or the things we actually needed in our specific 10man setup (not saying rets bring nothing to the table, mind you). Maybe it is a similar case in your guild.

I don't think versatility has to be an issue, as some players have been arguing. In casual guilds, one thing I know is that "versatile", "hybrid" players are usually not really good players. The tank who goes dps and has no clue, the dps who goes healer and obviously is like wtf. I for one would never bench any hybrid for not wanting to play more than one spec in the casual guild I once, upon a time, was helping RL. In more serious guilds, I expect versatility and nothing less, though, from both pures as well as hybrids.

One thing is sure though: you're not being sat for no reason, also not cause "rl hates all melee": I bet he's saying that to not answer you. Maybe the others who took your place are better players, or whatever. Maybe there's another reason (think of guild drama) that has pushed you into the bench position. I'd say talk to some guildies, see what they know, and talk to your RL again, asking for an honest and complete answer.

You could always consider migrating. I know it costs you money but if your current realm is not offering what you need, it's probably a worthwhile investment.

The logs people have posted - you're defending yourself. I do not say you lie and the logs tell true - of course, there's many circumstances that can screw your DPS over. Yet, are you sure your performance is not actually less good than you believe it is? Most people refuse to see that they're not really good, the majority of trials we failed suffered from that disillusion. In fact, any player who claims is good probably is not. It's only if you know you can constantly improve that you have a shot at being great, really. Anyway, just consider your overall performance.

i cant agree more,+1

[Libertarian]

It makes sense for garalon heroic. More than one melee is not optimal there.

Or any boss except the ones that require melee like protectors or will of the emperor.

@OP Also, ret is the least optimal plate dps to bring. DKs bring battle res, and warriors bring sunder. I feel like you are being selfish here by saying you will ONLY play ret. If my guild accepted that we would be nowhere. There are so many fights where having the right class / spec comp is ideal. We do not recruit people who only play one spec. Our disc priest, players shadow. Our hunter plays bm and survival. Our monk plays all three specs depending on fight. etc.

[kamuimac]

Oh about talking to him man trust me I talked to him so many times to have an honest answer either front of officers or privately with him in skype and I always get the same answer. This case in the guild is not only me also another ret, rogue, and warrior suffering from the same fate that I'm and I can tell you that they are not bad players at all some of them better than me pve and raiding wise.

Kk now were starting to get somewhere - as every guild yours is probably keeping sligthly bigger rooster for days when their core raiders cant come to raid - and u have been moved to the benched group cause others perform better/ have better raid awarness/ utility - this is something which happens when guilds recruit new memebers with more skills - if u say that there is more players like u - what is stoping u and them to talk to ur GM about that u want to recruit more people and start 2nd raiding team ? this way none of u would be benched and all be able to raid as much as u only want ? And this way u could make this group have as much meleee as u want - and then maybe ull see why its more convinient to bring more range then melee ....

[Velshin]

Or any boss except the ones that require melee like protectors or will of the emperor.

@OP Also, ret is the least optimal plate dps to bring. DKs bring battle res, and warriors bring sunder. I feel like you are being selfish here by saying you will ONLY play ret. If my guild accepted that we would be nowhere. There are so many fights where having the right class / spec comp is ideal. We do not recruit people who only play one spec. Our disc priest, players shadow. Our hunter plays bm and survival. Our monk plays all three specs depending on fight. etc.

Sorry to say this but as I said in my previous posts that I have been always playing ret pve only because my off spec is ret pvp. That was always the case for me since TBC. Raided in wotlk, and Cata heroic progress raiding with having only retri specs nothing was wrong with it no problem I got at all. There are some times where holy and prot were my off spec but most of the times my specs are ret pve and pvp. I believe choosing the spec you love the most + experienced with the most is not being selfish. Same goes for our raid leader he only plays blood dk tank and nothing else shall I call him selfish for not having off spec in raids of course not because this is the style he chooses to play and enjoy the most. Just because the class is hybrid doesn't mean = must have off spec or automatic benched. With your logic then I have to play another class which is a pure dps class in that case right? ok here is the thing what if the only spec and class in this game I enjoy is just retri and nothing else shall I quit? I know call me weird or something but that's just me tbh I only enjoy playing retri in this game.

---------- Post added 2013-02-03 at 10:50 AM ----------

Kk now were starting to get somewhere - as every guild yours is probably keeping sligthly bigger rooster for days when their core raiders cant come to raid - and u have been moved to the benched group cause others perform better/ have better raid awarness/ utility - this is something which happens when guilds recruit new memebers with more skills - if u say that there is more players like u - what is stoping u and them to talk to ur GM about that u want to recruit more people and start 2nd raiding team ? this way none of u would be benched and all be able to raid as much as u only want ? And this way u could make this group have as much meleee as u want - and then maybe ull see why its more convinient to bring more range then melee ....

If you read my first post you will know why another 10 man grp was out of the question because my current server is so dead in both sides Alliance and Horde. lack of players and activty in the server is so visible at the moment only one guild in our server who is close to kill sha of fear hc the rest are not even close. So yeah we tried to recruits a lot of ppl for second grp 10 man, we even managed to make it 25 for 2 weeks raiding then boom we lost a lot of raiders then back to 10 man again...after that a lot of ppl start to leave and now only one 10 man stable grp.

Also about saying then you will see why it's more convinient to bring more range than melee. Trust me I have been raid leader and gm for so many times in the past years of my wow career. I don't judge a player or bring him in my raid because of being range or melee I just judge him by his performance overall in his role no matter what class he is to be honest.

[Kalmah]

They are a burden on each encounter except maybe Garalon, where 1-2 melee might be cool thing to have. "Mobility" is a pvp perk, in PvE - it is ability to deal damage from range if needed and ability to stay on range from other people when needed. It is ranged who can basically negate or ignore many abilities or not suffer from them as much as melee in PvE

Okay, please tell me how you're better off having 0 melee rather than 2 melee on the following fights (all on heroic).

Feng
Zorlok
Blade lord
Garalon
Wind lord
Amber shaper
Lei shi
Sha of fear

That's half of the encounters this tier. You're saying melee are a burden on everything but Garalon. I'd say that for this list either it doesn't matter or you're better off with 2-3 melee.

The encounters I didn't mention I can see how melee could have some problems, but for most of them it's not to the point that you'd avoid bringing 1 or 2.