Throne of Thunder - World First Heroic Thread!

[oysterwjc]

Not entirely true. Considering the fact that clearing the full instance for our alts on normal 10 man takes us 3 hrs atm (mind, alts that were only 7/16 HC before TOT), clearing the instance, atleast on normal, should easily be doable by MAINS in HEROIC gear in 2 hours or so. Trinkets, tier pieces, anything that's still a T14 item will still see a good upgrade from a normal mode item, and from a thunderforged normal mode item.
Add on top of this the fact that if they're clearing like, 8-12 heroic in their main raid, they can easily take out the easier 10 man ones (Jin rokh, horridon, ji kun, qon) due to brutal overgearing.

i agree with that and i found something interesting
according to the raid leader of STYLE says, they foud leishen was so easy to kill with high ilv gear while farming 10H to gear up for 25H, so decided to scale 25 raid to 10 and managed to get the kill...lol

[Sarevokcz]

WoW EU and WoW Asia isn't even the same game.
What are we doing next? Comparing WoW to Guild Wars or Diablo?

You got it backwards, people accepting Asia raden 10man WF arent the ones cherrypicking random statistics in trying to disqualify them from the race. Just get over the fact, that WORLD first 10man raden belongs to Asian guild and WESTERN first 10man raden belongs to Paragon.

[oysterwjc]

They said it was because that was what the asian community asked for, so they did it.

obviously ppl wouldnt ask for 8% more HP, i think ghostcrowler just wanted to make it fair for western players somehow so he decided to scale 8 ilv up along with 8% HP up

[Deleted]

What the actual fuck is this non-sense ?
Mods don't have all knowledge in the world...

Wait, what? He's a moderator, not an asian hardcore raider O.o

He happens to also being an officer or leader in a quite competent heroic 25 raiding guild.
And to figure out how Asian guilds can cheese the gear now and do a hard encounter in 10 man, tuned the same way as our 10 man with 25 gear tuned for tougher encounters, is no rocket science either.
Yep he might have exaggerated by stating "farm both formats" so early in the tier, but that does not invalidate his opinion about the easyness to bring the 25 gear for a specific encounter in 10 man now, does it?
So on the principal he is right. The rest are details to derail the conversation.
And if wowprogress was so eager to depict the reality now, they should delete the 10/25 progress page for asian guilds. It is clear that the model they follow gives a serious advandage to 25s doing 10 content scewing the results.
In Asia there is only one race once more.
The 25 ppl race.
But unfortunately it is not "race for world first" anymore, it is "race for East, 25 ppl, first".

[ROllingBOnes]

They said it was because that was what the asian community asked for, so they did it.

Wait what?
Let's ask for different lockouts for 10 and 25 on EU as well then.
Pretty sure they're not going to do it for US and EU.
I guess Paragon should blame Blizzard for not getting WF.

[Deleted]

They said it was because that was what the asian community asked for, so they did it.

It's because of it's better business model there.

In Asia they pay for played time, not month in a time as I recall.

Now, when they do lockouts like this people raid more, thus, Blizzard earns more money. Simple logic.

And don't get me wrong. I'm not blaming Blizzard, I would do the same thing, just explaining this.

[Nekovivie]

They said it was because that was what the asian community asked for, so they did it.

Maybe the west community should ask for better loot and more lockouts too.

[Deleted]

Wait what?
Let's ask for different lockouts for 10 and 25 on EU as well then.
Pretty sure they're not going to do it for US and EU.
I guess Paragon should blame Blizzard for not getting WF.

They also said that it is unlikely to go for it in Europe and NA because the community is more divided regarding that.
In my honest opinion they should -finally- settle for one size in the middle and stop juggling things to one or the other direction every tier.

They screwed up with Cataclysm changes, they can't fix what is broken, time to move on.

[Deleted]

Gratz Paragon ^^

Do we have to wait till 5.3 for the video and second kill though? :<

[ROllingBOnes]

It's because of it's better business model there.

In Asia they pay for played time, not month in a time as I recall.

If it's true, it explains everything.
They should've made a separate lockout for heroic and normal as well for a higher revenue, allow getting loot from LFR regardless if you've killed the boss or not, or let the mobs in the Blossom Valley have a %0.00000001 chance to drop heroic TF items, then them chinese kids would farm their asses 24/7 and pay big money.
Free tip, Blizzard.

[Reyzzz]

If it's true, it explains everything.
They should've made a separate lockout for heroic and normal as well for a higher revenue, allow getting loot from LFR regardless if you've killed the boss or not, or let the mobs in the Blossom Valley have a %0.00000001 chance to drop heroic TF items, then them chinese kids would farm their asses 24/7 and pay big money.
Free tip, Blizzard.

Should just abolish both 10 and 25 to make a single raid size, and watch all the drama go away.

[ROllingBOnes]

Should just abolish both 10 and 25 to make a single raid size, and watch all the drama go away.

Who cares about drama, it's all about profit.

[Deleted]

Who cares about drama, it's all about profit.

Like it should be. It's their job anyway.

[TyrianFC]

If it's true, it explains everything.
They should've made a separate lockout for heroic and normal as well for a higher revenue, allow getting loot from LFR regardless if you've killed the boss or not, or let the mobs in the Blossom Valley have a %0.00000001 chance to drop heroic TF items, then them chinese kids would farm their asses 24/7 and pay big money.
Free tip, Blizzard.

Actually you are a good example of why Blizz has changed the 10/25 system in Asia.

its because the players there are more mature when it comes to thinking about and accepting duel 10 and 25 formats. Blizzard has said its much less controversial there. As opposed to in the west where - for example these very forums - nobody can even talk about the 10 vs 25 thing without getting into some kind of immature flame fest unable to agree on anything and unaccepting of all other formats and opinions that dont correspond to their own. And its like that on every western forum/server lol.

[Deleted]

Football example.. do you think that a team with Messi, CR7, Iniesta, etc. plays a different game than a team with asian football player #1-3 when both compete in the world championships? Eh, no.

[Deleted]

A 25 man guild going for a 10 world first kill with 10 ilvls higher than the fight is tuned for is not an achievement, and certainly not a world first 10. I'm pretty sure any 10 man in the world will agree with this. Many people might hate paragon, but you have to agree a 25 man trying to fish 10 world first with overpowered gear is kinda pathetic.

[Ryme]

Football example.. do you think that a team with Messi, CR7, Iniesta, etc. plays a different game than a team with asian football player #1-3 when both compete in the world championships? Eh, no.

It's not about the players, it's the game they play...

[Deleted]

It's not about the players, it's the game they play...

Applying the same logic, should we now start revoking Method and Paragon their kills if a guild managed to spent less time/less tries to kill a boss?

[ROllingBOnes]

Actually you are a good example of why Blizz has changed the 10/25 system in Asia.

its because the players there are more mature when it comes to thinking about and accepting duel 10 and 25 formats. Blizzard has said its much less controversial there. As opposed to in the west where - for example these very forums - nobody can even talk about the 10 vs 25 thing without getting into some kind of immature flame fest unable to agree on anything and unaccepting of all other formats and opinions that dont correspond to their own. And its like that on every western forum/server lol.

Right, and all asian players are tibetan monks that never whine on forums , are all mature and emotionally balanced.
Oh please...

[Nekovivie]

Football example.. do you think that a team with Messi, CR7, Iniesta, etc. plays a different game than a team with asian football player #1-3 when both compete in the world championships? Eh, no.

Sure, but then the world rankings gives Asian teams 6 points per win, and European teams 3 points per win. That's essentially the advantage they're getting now. Double.