spriest need a nerf?everyteam have a spriest.

[Nicola]

Are you ignorant or have you just never pve:d before? PvE is not just about pure DPS. You bring a shadowpriest because maybe you need utility in PvE. Mass Dispell is something unique to shadow that no other class has, and it's needed on some fights, for instance wind lord. Halo and VE are used to help healers on healer-heavy fights.

Blizzard has stated that they dont want to nerf mass dispell because they like shadow having something to bring to the table in pve. If utility didnt matter in pve youd just stack warlocks or whatever is highest dps on meters. Its about preventing homogenization.

Just saying, but disc and holy also have mass dispel... And be honest, are there ever moments in PvE where you are just spamming mass dispel?
If not, what's the deal with placing a small cooldown on it for example to tone shadow down in PvP?

[Korgoth]

LifeSwap and Mass Dispel need to go. A shadow Priest brings comparable damage, defenses and CC as any other DPS, yet also has the ability to dispel and lay on hands their healer. That is the problem. It's too much. A DPS should not have Dispel, or an instant full heal.

[Lassira]

Just saying, but disc and holy also have mass dispel... And be honest, are there ever moments in PvE where you are just spamming mass dispel?
If not, what's the deal with placing a small cooldown on it for example to tone shadow down in PvP?

...Mass dispel has a cooldown.
And spriests would be almost just as strong even without mass dispel.

Main problems with spriests:
Other casters aren't really viable at high ratings. Your choice in caster is spriest... or mage. This is naturally going to cause spriests to be overrepresented. I think a buff to warlocks, ele, and balance druids would even them out some.
Lifeswap is really, really good. Probably too good.
Fear+psyfiend is excellent peels rivaling warlock. Probably too good considering their utility.

I'm more worried that blizz will do a kneejerk reaction nerf and overnerf them when probably only 1-2 things need to be addressed.

[Hand Banana]

Very high dot damage? Well, excepting DP Spriest dots hit like a wet noodle. Gone are the days where used our dots to chisel off health. Spriest dispel protection is still fairly weak compared to other classes which offer that. Very high burst? Well, you can accuse many other classes of that with the windows between Shadow's burst periods being longer and requiring more ramp up than those other specs. More utility than other classes combined amounts to Mass Dispel and off healing both of which cost Shadow a ton of mana which need a a multi dotted spread of VT to sustain. I'll give you top-tier survivability but for someone who says "it's painfully obvious who doesn't have a clue about PvP right now" that isn't a good track record.

Who else has dispel protection besides warlocks and spriests? And comparing spriests dots to the other dot casters like boomkin and afflic lock yea, their dots hit harder. If you dont think burst with or without insanity is high you havent seen an spriest played right. My 66.5% resil disc can drop from 100 to 20% in a silence from an spriest alone. Its true that shadow has some ramp up time, but it has the survivability and offheals to not have a problem with it. In nearly every arena I have done against spriests they are highest or just about highest on damage with tons of healing OFC. Same for bgs if you dont care for arenas; usually they are top 3 on damage but generally have 0 deaths due to immortality.

If you think MD is their only utility thats a joke in itself. MD, lifegrip, purge, life-swap, purge-covers, shackle against dks, fear ward. That isnt counting all the heals/hots/shields since healing isnt considered utility in my definition. Or the cc with fear/psyfiend and the longest duration silence on the shortest cd (for 5 second silences).

[Snuggli]

Are you ignorant or have you just never pve:d before? PvE is not just about pure DPS. You bring a shadowpriest because maybe you need utility in PvE. Mass Dispell is something unique to shadow that no other class has, and it's needed on some fights, for instance wind lord. Halo and VE are used to help healers on healer-heavy fights.

Blizzard has stated that they dont want to nerf mass dispell because they like shadow having something to bring to the table in pve. If utility didnt matter in pve youd just stack warlocks or whatever is highest dps on meters. Its about preventing homogenization.

I didn't say remove any utility, I said nerf.

Removing glyph of mass dispel would destroy Spriests defensive dispel in PvP (you would have to worry about faking with a longer cast, by which time it would not be worth it), but would have almost no impact in PvE.

Adding a 2s cast time to Psychic scream would hurt Spriests a lot too. Wouldn't impact Spriests in a raid environment at all.

[Deleted]

Who else has dispel protection besides warlocks and spriests? And comparing spriests dots to the other dot casters like boomkin and afflic lock yea, their dots hit harder. If you dont think burst with or without insanity is high you havent seen an spriest played right. My 66.5% resil disc can drop from 100 to 20% in a silence from an spriest alone. Its true that shadow has some ramp up time, but it has the survivability and offheals to not have a problem with it. In nearly every arena I have done against spriests they are highest or just about highest on damage with tons of healing OFC. Same for bgs if you dont care for arenas; usually they are top 3 on damage but generally have 0 deaths due to immortality.

If you think MD is their only utility thats a joke in itself. MD, lifegrip, purge, life-swap, purge-covers, shackle against dks, fear ward. That isnt counting all the heals/hots/shields since healing isnt considered utility in my definition. Or the cc with fear/psyfiend and the longest duration silence on the shortest cd (for 5 second silences).

Warlock dispel protection, even after the change to Shadow's, is still better. Spriest dots, except for DP, are comparable to a boomkins with afflic's dots hitting slightly harder. While insanity with three orbs does hit a truckload it takes three orbs and three full Mind Flays to maximize it damage, you telling me either you or your partners are n't waiting for that with an interrupt? I think I've managed to get all three of Mind Flay Insanitys twice in arena since it was implemented. Utility; MD-cost an absolute ton of mana to cast with mana returns from VT applications being a must; life grip, had this last xpac and I never really heard much complaining it but yea it's good utility; shackle against dks, very niche utility; five sec silence on 45 sec Cd compared to 24 sec CD lasting 4 sec which one would you rather have; which leaves fear ward and life swap with life swap being very useful and fear ward being the last reason to worry about Spriest' s "OPness". I'll grant you this xpac has too much CC with too much burst, but those across the board rather than a specific Shadow only problem. The reason you are getting all these Spriests MF:Iing to 20% is because of overall situation with casters.

[Deleted]

Just saying, but disc and holy also have mass dispel... And be honest, are there ever moments in PvE where you are just spamming mass dispel?
If not, what's the deal with placing a small cooldown on it for example to tone shadow down in PvP?

Being forced to have a priest healer out of the 2-3, where as shadow is one out of 5-7 for a 10man guild. As been said before, yes there is already a 15 sec CD on it as opposed to the regular 8 seconds on defensive dispells. Furthermore, yes indeed i have "spammed" it in PvE, as shadow. I'm always on dispell duty, even in the raids where we have a priest healer, since it saves them mana.

[Deleted]

I didn't say remove any utility, I said nerf.

Removing glyph of mass dispel would destroy Spriests defensive dispel in PvP (you would have to worry about faking with a longer cast, by which time it would not be worth it), but would have almost no impact in PvE.

Adding a 2s cast time to Psychic scream would hurt Spriests a lot too. Wouldn't impact Spriests in a raid environment at all.

A cast time to a melee range spell? Make it targetable and 1.5 secs and I might say your on to something.

[Deleted]

I didn't say remove any utility, I said nerf.

Removing glyph of mass dispel would destroy Spriests defensive dispel in PvP (you would have to worry about faking with a longer cast, by which time it would not be worth it), but would have almost no impact in PvE.

Adding a 2s cast time to Psychic scream would hurt Spriests a lot too. Wouldn't impact Spriests in a raid environment at all.

While i think the removal of the glyph which i'd be accepting accually, sound good on paper, they won't do good for shadow. Shadow is one of those that are the most susceptible for interrupts, since lack of movement. There are already tons of casts and shitty movement, that if you just stick a melee tunnel on the priest he is instantly shit. That is already the case. More hard-casts certainly doesn't help the situation.

For shadow to get more hardcasts you'd have to add some interrupt-protection, a blink/sprintlike baseline ability or some ranged slow, else you'd just get locked out even more. It sucks too hard not being able to dispers if you get interrupted channeling your insanity. This is why everyone says spriest is very easy to counter.

[nyc81991]

Shadow Priests and Frost mages both need nerfs.

But honestly I don't think Shadow really needs a damage nerf. Simply a nerf to fear. One place to start would be to make their psyfiend's fear half the duration of a normal fear. So roughly 4 seconds instead of 7.

I think that all forms of fear need to have a damage cap that they break on. I mean its pretty ridiculous when you get feared and it takes you half way across the arena and only breaks after half your health pool is gone. Only to get feared again or put in a deep freeze by a frost mage and killed within that time frame.

And as a Paladin Mass Dispel is one of the most broken abilities in the game. "Oh you used your only major defense Cd thats on a 5min cd? Lol removed in 1 second".

[Deleted]

Shadow Priests and Frost mages both need nerfs.

But honestly I don't think Shadow really needs a damage nerf. Simply a nerf to fear. One place to start would be to make their psyfiend's fear half the duration of a normal fear. So roughly 4 seconds instead of 7.

I think that all forms of fear need to have a damage cap that they break on. I mean its pretty ridiculous when you get feared and it takes you half way across the arena and only breaks after half your health pool is gone. Only to get feared again or put in a deep freeze by a frost mage and killed within that time frame.

And as a Paladin Mass Dispel is one of the most broken abilities in the game. "Oh you used your only major defense Cd thats on a 5min cd? Lol removed in 1 second".

Fear is a joke these days. But I see it more a symptom of the overall CC problem in MoP than something which needs tweaked for Shadow exclusively. Burst as well.

[Nicola]

Being forced to have a priest healer out of the 2-3, where as shadow is one out of 5-7 for a 10man guild. As been said before, yes there is already a 15 sec CD on it as opposed to the regular 8 seconds on defensive dispells. Furthermore, yes indeed i have "spammed" it in PvE, as shadow. I'm always on dispell duty, even in the raids where we have a priest healer, since it saves them mana.

I'm aware of the 15 sec cooldown, I actually meant placing a real cooldown of at least a minute on it ( I don't consider anything below 30 seconds as a real cooldown ). Ugh whatever, my fault for not wording it correctly, I thought it would be clear enough what I meant, never mind actually.

Nonetheless, the current "cooldown" is way too short for shadow considering how strong the spell is. However, it's not the only thing you can change to tone shadow down. Offensive dispels is one thing I'm not too happy with, nor too happy with the burst and with the hybrid healing neither.

But as for now, since I'm not a priest, I'm not going to waste to many words on this to prevent everyone from getting on my skin, but many of these things can easily get nerfed without ruining PvE.

[Flaks]

They need to nerf Wizards and Magicians. Wouldn't mind seeing Necromancers get a bit of a buff too... Yes I know they're all EQ classes but it's about as pointless to talk a about balancing those classes as it is WoW PvP atm. If you check out the patch notes for the PTR you'll see that PvP is being complete overhauled. Let's all wait and see hmmm?

Haven't people been saying this since...hmmm...oh since vanilla wow beta. And without fail Blizzard manages to release the most fucked up imbalanced class changes to live despite hundreds if not thousands of folks talking about broken mechanics while testing is still going on.

---------- Post added 2013-03-25 at 09:32 PM ----------

Fear is a joke these days. But I see it more a symptom of the overall CC problem in MoP than something which needs tweaked for Shadow exclusively. Burst as well.

Completely agree. People keep on jumping on this class or that. But the underlying issues are there for literally every single class in the game. Its just some classes have even slightly more than others so people are more prone to jump on that instead of attempting to address the main issues.

[Deleted]

I'm aware of the 15 sec cooldown, I actually meant placing a real cooldown of at least a minute on it ( I don't consider anything below 30 seconds as a real cooldown ). Ugh whatever, my fault for not wording it correctly, I thought it would be clear enough what I meant, never mind actually.

Nonetheless, the current "cooldown" is way too short for shadow considering how strong the spell is. However, it's not the only thing you can change to tone shadow down. Offensive dispels is one thing I'm not too happy with, nor too happy with the burst and with the hybrid healing neither.

But as for now, since I'm not a priest, I'm not going to waste to many words on this to prevent everyone from getting on my skin, but many of these things can easily get nerfed without ruining PvE.

Far better in my eyes to buff the other casters. Trying to PvP with my boomkin was just downright painful, and my warlock being marginally better. Haven't leveled my shaman, but I really don't see too many elementals running about to fill me with confidence. Every caster is a mage or a Spriest not because they are so OP, it's because the alternatives are so crap. Nerfing my mage and Spriest to be equal to my boomkin isn't going to make me happy to go chicken, but to roll some melee. But MoP PvP goes beyond a couple of over balanced specs and a couple of under balanced ones; it's a dogs dinner all over the place which is why PvP is going through the biggest amount of change it has seen since TBC. If PvP could be fixed by a few nerfs to Spriest's I'd say bring them on.

[Nicola]

Far better in my eyes to buff the other casters. Trying to PvP with my boomkin was just downright painful, and my warlock being marginally better. Haven't leveled my shaman, but I really don't see too many elementals running about to fill me with confidence. Every caster is a mage or a Spriest not because they are so OP, it's because the alternatives are so crap. Nerfing my mage and Spriest to be equal to my boomkin isn't going to make me happy to go chicken, but to roll some melee. But MoP PvP goes beyond a couple of over balanced specs and a couple of under balanced ones; it's a dogs dinner all over the place which is why PvP is going through the biggest amount of change it has seen since TBC. If PvP could be fixed by a few nerfs to Spriest's I'd say bring them on.

I don't think it's a good idea to buff all other casters to the same level shadow is on currently. It's better to tone shadow down a bit and buff the other classes a bit, trying to seek a balance between buffing and nerfing.
For PvP, it's easier to nerf than to buff without affecting PvE.

[Deleted]

I'm aware of the 15 sec cooldown, I actually meant placing a real cooldown of at least a minute on it ( I don't consider anything below 30 seconds as a real cooldown ). Ugh whatever, my fault for not wording it correctly, I thought it would be clear enough what I meant, never mind actually.

Nonetheless, the current "cooldown" is way too short for shadow considering how strong the spell is. However, it's not the only thing you can change to tone shadow down. Offensive dispels is one thing I'm not too happy with, nor too happy with the burst and with the hybrid healing neither.

But as for now, since I'm not a priest, I'm not going to waste to many words on this to prevent everyone from getting on my skin, but many of these things can easily get nerfed without ruining PvE.

Yeah if you'd put a 1min cd on it, you might aswell remove it all along, or make it only take off bubble/iceblock. It would not work for PvE at all, let alone PvP judging its needs at current state. Proposing anything like that clearly shows you don't play a priest. I'd wish you tried one, at least in PTR before doing QQ.

As for the burst, it's much easierly counterable than alot of other classes. I believe swifty posted up a vid showing how much burst other classes have, 2 mages speccs in top 3. You could check it out if you still think priest burst is over the top. Hybrid healing has already been adjusted(read:nerfed) 3 times, and offensive dispells is held by alot of other classes, spellsteal being the strongest.

None of the things are thereby doable, so i stand corrected.

[blackyfrost]

Meh, that is not true. They are a couple classes with low numbers that would be considered "OP" by most people. What really matters is what % of the class does well in relation to the overall population of their own class, not how large the population actually is or what % is successful in comparison to other classes... if you catch my drift. Population alone means nothing.

it's 100% true and always has been. top pvpers don't play their toon no matter what

last season you think reckful was on his rogue? fuck no

[Deleted]

L2P issue.

Psyfiend was nerfed to the ground.
Fear breaks immediately after direct DMG or a few DOT ticks.
Shadow burst has a very high ramp up time and is stationary. You can nullify Spriest dmg by walking around a corner or just dispelling it.
If there's no Mage to babysit the priest, DKs/Warriors/Rogue/Enhancer are a hardcounter.

[Deleted]

Already been posted but this cracks me up every time I watch it



SPriest are OP because they have everything a class in PvP needs and more:
- Defensive capability = Best of all casters, solid passive DR and Dispersion
- Offensive capability = Excellent sustained and excellent and reliable burst
- Utility capability = Best of all casters. Mass Dispel, Life Swap, good CC, Life Grip, offheals, shields, offensive dispels

As much as Spriest players wouldn't like to admit...you're basically a rogue in 4.3. You have very few weaknesses and too many advantages relative to other classes and more specifically, other casters.

Does Shadow need a nerf? Probably...but other casters need buffs like Boomkins and Ele Shamans. Even after the huge amount of buffs Ele got in 5.2, they still aren't anyway close to being as good as a Spriest. Frost Mage could do with advocating casting frostbolt more or by smarter use of CS and reducing instant cast damage as a result.

[Deleted]

You have very few weaknesses

Lol, yeah you know, just the normal stuff, CCs, dispells, interrupts, LoS, mobility, kiting, any melee-tunnel. Basic stuff, nothing to worry about

Seriously though have you even played one? If not i strongly suggest you do, before you paint it up like that, like priests are some supergods. There are plenty of replies to this post explaining what to do against a priest if you would just read the thread. And yes that truly is laughable that vid because it's true, priest have never been strong and suddenly when they are, 1500rated butthurt ppl scream NERF because they are not used to it. A class that never is strong don't deserve to suddenly be strong!