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  1. #21
    PVE: with rising gear lvls i enjoy my rogue more and more. it was a pain in the ass and boring as hell when i dinged lvl 90 and now with 500-ish gs at least assassination is nice to play. i like it. cant tell anything about combat or sub though. in addition MFD is so f***** nice. i love it.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogaeu View Post
    in addition MFD is so f***** nice. i love it.
    Agree. Dailies as sub = Prem/SnD - Cheap - Garrote - pool - Evis - MfD - Evis. Longer to write than to actually kill a mob. It feels really, really awesome.
    Why worry about the future when you can just asfatatotl.

  3. #23
    If you enjoyed it in Wotlk, you'll enjoy it now. Rogues are one of the few classes that stayed pretty much the same over the last few years. If anything, just more quality of life changes which are always good.

  4. #24
    Greetings, glad you asked this of us I want to take some time to explain from my point of view. To answer the question I would like the class to be fun and it's not fun because of how the rest of the game is currently. this post intended both pvp and pve for discussion.

    I have my subscription canceled current.

    I read through, I saw a comment about the rogue being unchanged. A lot of players left in cata because of changes; however I think coming from a rogue rogue card draw perspective. The balance is not there. Insight into why I say this is on the energy bar; every other damage class spec has great resource management when you know how to pull the master build style; the way you like to game not macros just keybinds. Does not compare to another class close. Answer to this is adjustment to energy cost for the combo gen abilities. Or a added buff built into the mastery for reducing combo gen abilities excluding the energy costs for finishers.

    I write this because the inconsistency for treating all 3 specs the same for what they all can pull on raw gragh data relative to each other. combat and sub both have too high energy costs per combo point and i want to point out that the mechanic for combat having too much energy to spend should be looked at. the class would be efficient if ss and rs costed 20 energy instead of 40. Otherwise shuriken toss is replace cp gen for combat sub and assassination. a better consistent cp gen to supply the finisher'; Honestly I think a cp should cost 20 energy. the idea with a 0.0% reduction for abilities that require energy to supply cp' per mastery point excluding finishers given the three spec' for the a rogue give or take. would balance the experience and make it fun because all the other class damages have great resource management.

    "i rolled a monk and one chi is like a 5 cp finisher." chi is about 20 energy. I look at the rogue and all I notice is everyone that takes no interest in giving a second glance to think is experiance returned for money fun regardless of what goes on in game and why most players hate the players that play rogue' it's a problem that should be addressed; in all honesty with out changing the play style going into the mechanics of how the class work to make it equal to the other class' resource management with still using the energy bar. set so long ago.

    Assassination is able to keep up with the other class damages of the other two. I've seen a player in lfr doing 95,000 damage per second; most likely macros he was using from my point of view. I just use keybinds the computer is not doing my rotations for me macros are more efficient to supply consistent dps. i do not use macros. I find the class situational and an ability like dismantle could mess up another players macro if he/she is using a bcd ability wrote into the macro used into it so I play freestyle. I just apply it to another class damage and get a feel.

    Combat and sub both have the same problem resource in-efficiency is horrible. rotations ending with eviscerates after the ticks all up. not to mention combat eviscerate hits nothing as what envenom and sub eviscerate' do. gotta keep s&d running and feint for Damage reduction plus recuperate. this all demands of the player So I really don't get to eviscerate that much in my rotations because of the lack of energy compared to the other class' resource management; from an introspective extrospective point of view. (me looking at others having a great time and me left thinking does noone take a approach as to what is and what we all think?

    On shuriken toss it's great having a combo point cost 20 energy which is reasonably low and high cost, but then I transition into melee and bam no energy I do know how to pull my energy but this is frustrating when the plate or heal for example out heals or absorb' you by 120 percent of your damage and more I've seen do to this lack of resource consideration. I remember a rogue being the eyes and ears of the raid leader this is not how they are used anymore. I mostly get my point of view from reading and checking my recount addon. But here is the question. Do I take the time to write my own macros; which is new to me programming and then keep rewriting them when the game changes or just stay with what works for me currently freestyle keybinds? Id like to stick with keybinds. Which in turn because my rotations are not milliseconds away from registering my damage per second is not as high what the other elite players expect from me because they use macros.

    A bit about me I dip into all the professions to increase my odds of survival in the pvp part of the game, but then you apply it to another class practically can't take you out especially when you have macros mapped on the class with the profession' also as your playing. you have to know where I'm coming from here in order to know what I'm talking about. This really is a tangled situation for rogue rogue combination I've come to this conclusion on my own. I know rogues are supposed to be resourceful with out think how the game set now. What I see is a 1:00 1:30 second window for cooldown being realistic for all the abilities for this class. A tip here first rogue to enter combat to use ability is the winner and this is 1 minute window for opportunity to strike at another rogue/rogue. I learned this is arena; this is why I say this when it comes to rogue vs rogue. Does not matter what class combination you have as long as you are vs a rogue your rogue vs rogue. how much you know the class should determine is the winner on the pvp side of the game.

    I can network with other players be nice as possible I really do not get appreciated for being a great player bottom line. This is my rogue experience. Played rogue consistently for five years.

    thanks for reading
    Last edited by Thieves cant; 2013-04-04 at 11:36 PM. Reason: reword

  5. #25
    Herald of the Titans Kael's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    It sounds like you're mixing up stories of PvP and PvE in the same thoughts, but if I assume you're primarily talking about PvE:

    It sounds like you're keeping recuperate and feint up through every encounter at all times. This is not necessary or helpful, and will severely lower your DPS. You should feint when there is huge amounts of damage incoming in a predictable pattern, particularly if your healers can't keep up with it. Recuperate, in general, can safely be ignored for raids. This should drastically increase the number of attack-finishers (and DPS!) you get in raids. As combat in particular, this is necessary to maintaining DPS at all because every eviscerate/rupture lowers the cooldown of Killing Spree, Adrenaline Rush, and Shadow Blades. You'll find in high-end gear that Combat rogues are not energy inefficient, but really very very "spammy" and use pretty much every GCD (which is 2 GCDs/second, with the T15 4piece bonus).

    Macros and keybinds have little to do with getting 90% of maximum assassination/combat DPS, so I don't recommend switching tactics, no. If you're PvPing and trying to become higher rated, I'm pretty sure macros are necessary, primarily as keybind alterations (i.e. shadowstep arena player 1, shift-press to shadowstep arena player 2, ctrl-press to shadowstep arena player 3). As PvE, since the rotations are so static for both assassination and combat, and since macros can't read situational input ("if rupture is active, if SnD is active, if energy > 90," etc. etc. before outputting "use envenom"), the only thing a macro can do in PvE is put the right attack on the right target. If you've got questions about when to use which buttons in PvE, please feel free to browse this forum in its entirety, and in particular, see the "GUIDES!" thread stickied at the top. Coldkil's signature is a great place to start, and when you're at the end, the "Assassination: the Nitty Gritty" is a great place to continue finding out all the details of assassination DPS, in particular.

    Any "good" PvE rogue can walk into a raid without any macros at all and pull the same DPS (I hope), and using default buttons (1-7 even!). They would suffer greatly for utility, but I do think your concerns are partially misplaced, speaking of DPS and energy efficiency, when rogues are topping DPS charts all over the place as assassination, and combat can't get rid of its energy for half a fight.

  6. #26
    OK, I don't PvP.

    I do PvE as assassin rogue and I love the rotation and the tools of the rogue right now. I'm not loving the technical difficulties of ToT but that's another subject. The irony is that I love playing the rogue but am not particularly enjoying the raids.

    Outside, Marked for Death has completely transformed my rogue experience. I cannot quite explain how much I love this power. Five combo points is just... Kind of insane for a rogue outside. It is a pity, a mark-ed shame that we cannot have this leveling from 85-90 since it would make the experience feel so much better. I find myself doing dailies just so I can kill things. Just absolutely adore playing a rogue with this power.

    So I'm having a blast and became unbelievably happier with the rogue with just that one patch. Takes all kinds, I guess.

  7. #27
    Ive raided with a rogue since mid-vanilla, and its still the class I enjoy the most. I have tried out all of them, both in PvP and PvE over the years, but I always end up playing my rogue, no matter if its about PvE or PvP. So, yes, rogues are still 'fun' (as fun as anything can be in world of dailycraft), atleast I think so.

    EDIT: Ive been a raider to 99% since patch 2.0, before that I did PvP, now I only PvP once a month or something. Been playing mutilate since the day it was introduced to the game.

  8. #28
    I really enjoy them but I recommend playing them with an alt or main (e.g. Resto Shaman or Mage). Playing a different style and not restricting yourself to one may make Rogues a lot more fun!

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