MSI Mpower Z77

[Static]

How good is it, compared to the Sabertooth? I haven't used any MSI motherboard before. Been using nothing but ASUS/GIGABYTE but this time I want to try something a little different. I think it's very aesthetically-pleasing, but I don't know about performance, features and functionality.

What do you guys think?

[Toffie]

Both are overpriced for the average gamer, unless you wanna overclock past 5.0 GHz then theres no reason to spend more than 140 $ on a motherboard.

Excellent choices that got everything you would need:

Asrock Extreme 4
&
Gigabyte Z77X-UD3H

[Cyanotical]

Both are overpriced for the average gamer, unless you wanna overclock past 5.0 GHz then theres no reason to spend more than 140 $ on a motherboard.

Excellent choices that got everything you would need:

Asrock Extreme 4
&
Gigabyte Z77X-UD3H

well, you can't just take a daily driver chip and say "i wanna hit 5.2Ghz" it doesn't work that way, CPUs have a max clock they can reach that is stable with in voltage and temperature ranges and you can't go higher, for each chip it is different, depending on hundreds of factors from air temp to humidity when it was made

if you are planning on simply getting a chip up to a certain clock speed for the fun of overclocking, you will severely degrade it and it will no longer be useful

between the two main intel lines:
Sandy chips have a voltage wall, as you go up in clock speed, you have to increase the voltage, the limit is reached when adding voltage no longer increases stability, you can go past this, but you need to go up several levels in voltage and you will ruin the chip very quickly

Ivy chips have a thermal wall, this occurs when you reach a voltage point where passive cooling can no longer remove heat fast enough, and it's very short, a few milli-volts can mean the difference between 80C and overheating, to clock any higher you need to use an active cooling method such as phase change, dry ice or liquid nitrogen, phase change is the only one that can be used every day, but this only puts you back into a voltage limit, where again, usage at high voltage levels will kill your chip

when people claim they run 5Ghz daily, they are either at the voltage limit for safe use and have a very high grade chip, or they are not truly stable, or lying


as for motherboards, there are plenty of reasons to spend more on a motherboard, perhaps you want a specific feature, or a specific build quality, or a specific level of refinement, it's up to you

[Toffie]

I agree, but you would still need to look for something else if you decide to do some extreme overclocking.

[Deleted]

How good is it, compared to the Sabertooth? I haven't used any MSI motherboard before. Been using nothing but ASUS/GIGABYTE but this time I want to try something a little different. I think it's very aesthetically-pleasing, but I don't know about performance, features and functionality.

What do you guys think?

Any ~$200 Z77 motherboard is going to perform well and they're all going to be within same performance levels pretty much. Major thing separating motherboards are their features like Thunderbolt, dual LAN, better power designs etc.

[chazus]

better power designs etc.

I see better power designs on boards (6 phase, 8 phase with dump truck sized heatsinks, etc)... But despite that, I don't see a significant failure/return rate between $200 boards 'better' and $80 'budget' boards.

Personally, I don't see the point on paying $100 extra to prevent something likely won't fail... on a $100 part.

[n0cturnal]

I see better power designs on boards (6 phase, 8 phase with dump truck sized heatsinks, etc)... But despite that, I don't see a significant failure/return rate between $200 boards 'better' and $80 'budget' boards.

Personally, I don't see the point on paying $100 extra to prevent something likely won't fail... on a $100 part.

The power delivery design hardly matters until you are going for extreme overclocking.

[Deleted]

I see better power designs on boards (6 phase, 8 phase with dump truck sized heatsinks, etc)... But despite that, I don't see a significant failure/return rate between $200 boards 'better' and $80 'budget' boards.

Personally, I don't see the point on paying $100 extra to prevent something likely won't fail... on a $100 part.

I know, it was just one of many differences between the higher and lower end boards. Take a Z75 Pro3 or MSI Z77 G41, actually those have issue hitting stable overclocks beyond 4.2+- (which isn't considered extreme) and that is definitely because of the different power design but of course beyond a certain point (like 8+4 or whatever) it hardly ever matters.

My point is most Z77 boards are really close in performance but you pay for the features you want. SLI support, Thunderbolt, more/better SATA III connections, different audio codecs and there are many other things as I'm sure you know. I'm sure most of us agree that if you're on a tight budget then there isn't much to gain from buying a more expensive motherboard but that isn't to say that buying a more expensive motherboard is a waste. Not everyone enjoys having the cheapest possible hardware, there is some assurance in having a quality motherboard with the exact feature you want.

[n0cturnal]

I know, it was just one of many differences between the higher and lower end boards. Take a Z75 Pro3 or MSI Z77 G41, actually those have issue hitting stable overclocks beyond 4.2+- (which isn't considered extreme) and that is definitely because of the different power design but of course beyond a certain point (like 8+4 or whatever) it hardly ever matters.

This doesn't have to be limited by the motherboard though. Tweaktown managed to clock their 3770k to 4.6GHz stable on a Z75 Pro 3 as example. Even the MSI Z77 G41 has been known to clock over 4.5GHz with its very limited overclocking options.

Anyway what I was trying to say was that a cheaper power design doesn't have to cause issues which results in a higher return rate and even the really cheap ones can be fine for moderate overclocking.

[chazus]

even the really cheap ones can be fine for moderate overclocking.

Which, to me, is sort of the point.

We overclock to get more bang for the buck. So why spend MORE money purely to increase your performance by a very marginal amount? Anyone who wants to do 'extreme overclocking' is likely going to be spending 2000+ in the first place, making motherboard price moot regardless. It always strikes me silly when people go get $200-300 motherboards, with the intent to do 4.4-4.6... Effectively defeating the price/performance index inherently. >.>

[Deleted]

i got the board myself and i must say im glad i picked this one over another gigabyte board.
also something i think people missed is that msi guarantees that the board can hit 4,6 clocks on an ivy chip which is a pretty neat thing to know for sure a board isn't going to be holding you back.
this board is pretty much in the lower part of the top tier of overclocking clocking boards. (and very well priced considering ROG board prices)
only thing that was abit tricky for me was getting used to the bios layout but that isn't so weird considering i've spend 5 years in gigabyte bios.
got any more specific questions else OP?

[Deleted]

Which, to me, is sort of the point.

We overclock to get more bang for the buck. So why spend MORE money purely to increase your performance by a very marginal amount? Anyone who wants to do 'extreme overclocking' is likely going to be spending 2000+ in the first place, making motherboard price moot regardless. It always strikes me silly when people go get $200-300 motherboards, with the intent to do 4.4-4.6... Effectively defeating the price/performance index inherently. >.>

No offense but I think we get your point already but honestly I get a little annoyed that you keep saying it's silly. Not EVERYONE is after some specific price/performance. Yes when you're on a specific budget and trying to get the best performance for your money then it makes sense to pick a "cheap" motherboard. You keep ignoring the rest of the points I'm making though, overclocking isn't THE only thing people care about. Maybe you pay a little extra for a specific brand you trust, better warranty... I'm not going to repeat myself listing all might different features one might want. Knowing that you got something solid and exactly what you wanted with a good warranty feels good even if it means you had to skip one or two dinning out that month

None of the regulars on this forum (that I know of) ever recommends a $200 motherboard when people ask for help with their $700-1500 builds unless they specifically ask for it for some reason.

even the really cheap ones can be fine for moderate overclocking.

That's what I mean when you pay a little extra you know it's going to be fine (of course you can never be 100% sure) whereas the cheaper boards it can be hit or miss sometimes and some people don't mind pay $30-50 extra to feel sure.

[Deleted]

As many has said before, any board will do for the average gamer. All the mPower really does is making surethat you wont get a mobo that is going to crash if you touch the bios. And the sabertooth is military so it got a longer warranty for pretty much the same reason as the mpower. You wont get a shitty mobo but if you do they will cover for it.

I do understand that some dont wanna buy from the bottm (g41/pro3) or anything like that. But I cant really recommend going for the most expensive ones if you dont reaaaaaly like the look of it. Like the Asus ROG boards. I wouldnt gimp any other component just for a good looking mobo tho.

[Static]

Thanks everyone for your input. Greatly appreciate it.

@shroudster: Think I'm about to choose this motherboard. I got one last question if you don't mind, that is regarding the LAN chipset. I noticed that the Mpower uses a Realtek 8111E. How good is it compared to, say, Intel 82579V that is on the Sabertooth? I mean do I have to worry about this in the first place?

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Probably won't notice the difference.

[Deleted]

Thanks everyone for your input. Greatly appreciate it.

@shroudster: Think I'm about to choose this motherboard. I got one last question if you don't mind, that is regarding the LAN chipset. I noticed that the Mpower uses a Realtek 8111E. How good is it compared to, say, Intel 82579V that is on the Sabertooth? I mean do I have to worry about this in the first place?

it's fine good low ping on pretty slow connection even.
http://speedtest.net/result/2605833401.png

[Static]

it's fine good low ping on pretty slow connection even.
http://speedtest.net/result/2605833401.png

Good stuff. I'll be picking one around Tuesday, along with the other parts. Should also mention that I'll most likely purchase a Lightning GTX 680, mostly to fit well with the color scheme.

[Faithh]

Most important feature for an overclocker is just that you have load line calibration. Some low end tier boards are doing great for clocks like 4.4G orsomething but once you go higher you get to a point you have a huge vdro(o)p which is fairly annoying while LLC can compensate this.

Both boards would take that chip to 5GHz aslong as the chip allows to do that.