All I know about modern native americans now is that they live on reservations which are rife with poverty, alcoholism and are more susceptible to diabetes.
If they gave warnings every time someone did something wrong, no one would ever get banned. Getting infracted/banned is a way of making sure that posters know the rules. That's why bans here aren't permanent -- they're intended to inform you of the rules so that you won't make the same mistake in the future.
A warning might work for some people, but the vast majority will treat a warning like most everyone else does: as a pass to break the rules again.
Speaking of which, discussing moderation is not allowed on these forums. You could be infracted for your post. Maybe you should consider this a warning.
Last edited by Belloc; 2013-04-22 at 08:10 PM.
Grand Crusader Belloc <-- 6608 Endless Tank Proving Grounds score! (
Dragonslayer Kooqu
'Twas a cutlass swipe or an ounce of lead
Or a yawing hole in a battered head
And the scuppers clogged with rotting red
And there they lay I damn me eyes
All lookouts clapped on Paradise
All souls bound just contrarywise, yo ho ho and a bottle of rum!
A lot of people like to ignore it, but there were almost certainly more Native American tribes killed by Native Americans, over time, than by anyone else. Sure, they may have been a spiritual people, generally speaking, but their way of life involved war and murder as a regular thing.
You can lament the loss of living in harmony with the land, but don't even begin to suggest that the Native American way was better. If it were better, it'd still be the way. They had just as much evil in them as today's people do... we just don't talk about it because it's irrelevant.
And since you described the world today as warlike, violent, and dying young... well, you should probably do some research into history before you start comparing today's world to the world years ago.
Dying young? 1000 years ago the average life span was around 24 years. 100 years ago it was around 40-50. Nowadays it's up to around 70.
Warlike? A few countries, maybe, but most of the world is at peace. Go back 100 years and you'll see a lot more war. Go back 1000 years and you'll see even more.
Last edited by Belloc; 2013-04-22 at 08:18 PM.
Grand Crusader Belloc <-- 6608 Endless Tank Proving Grounds score! (
Dragonslayer Kooqu
Indigenous People of North America. Not Native Americans.
'Twas a cutlass swipe or an ounce of lead
Or a yawing hole in a battered head
And the scuppers clogged with rotting red
And there they lay I damn me eyes
All lookouts clapped on Paradise
All souls bound just contrarywise, yo ho ho and a bottle of rum!
And what does "indigenous" mean? It means, "native." I don't think anyone in here, aside from you, cares to be that politically correct.
---------- Post added 2013-04-22 at 08:21 PM ----------
I agree with you. Spicy's post (warlike, violent, dying young) was one huge assumption, all of which was completely incorrect.
Grand Crusader Belloc <-- 6608 Endless Tank Proving Grounds score! (
Dragonslayer Kooqu
'Twas a cutlass swipe or an ounce of lead
Or a yawing hole in a battered head
And the scuppers clogged with rotting red
And there they lay I damn me eyes
All lookouts clapped on Paradise
All souls bound just contrarywise, yo ho ho and a bottle of rum!
Actually, in all fairness, no the Native Americans were not peaceful primitives. They could be downright brutal to each other long before the Europeans came along. The idyllic peaceful unspoiled America was a myth that started after the European invasion so our ancestors felt better about what they did. We were "saving" these people.
In fact, the native peoples use of deforestation and farming had a significant impact on the land before the Europeans ever touched it. http://www.baylor.edu/mediacommunica...ry&story=90379
That fabric softener teddy bear...oooh I'm 'a hunt that little bitch down.
The words "Native" and "American" used separately might have that meaning, but used together, they refer to the indigenous people of the Americas. Disparate words when used together often take on entirely new meanings. Just like "hot dog" isn't referring to a canine with a high temperature gradient, "native american" isn't referring to someone of European descent who was born in Kansas.
'Twas a cutlass swipe or an ounce of lead
Or a yawing hole in a battered head
And the scuppers clogged with rotting red
And there they lay I damn me eyes
All lookouts clapped on Paradise
All souls bound just contrarywise, yo ho ho and a bottle of rum!
Grand Crusader Belloc <-- 6608 Endless Tank Proving Grounds score! (
Dragonslayer Kooqu
They weren't massacred just because white people are evil. They were also massacred because a huge part of their culture was about raiding, murder, slavery, and general violence all around, and settlers just couldn't live next to them without getting killed all the time, or having their property raided and their horses and cattle stolen (a crime punishable by death). Well, that, and because they were too disorganized to resist. Not because they were weak, note, but disorganized. They weren't strong as a result of living in peace and harmony with each other. They could've maybe have defeated the settlers if they had united, but the tribes never did (to any significant degree; Tecumseh tried and failed), because they were too busy hating on each other, just like every other group of people in every other place.
That's not to say their destruction was inevitable, but stupid people on both sides did too many stupid things too many times, and when one guy killing another guy can spark a war if the event isn't handled properly, it's no wonder there was a lot of killing going around.
They also didn't live in harmony with nature - or whatever - anymore than we do; their arrival in the americas heralded a mass-exctinction in species diversity of much the same magnitude as what happened when the white man arrived. They were living 'in harmony' with the current animals around in exactly the same way that we live 'in harmony' with the animals currently around us - that is, the ones that are still around. The reason they didn't have beasts of burden - for example - wasn't because there were never any animals around that could've served that purpose, but because they drove every single one of them to extinction without realizing, or caring about, their utility.
They weren't any better or worse than anybody else was back then.
"Quack, quack, Mr. Bond."
Still many populations on reservations, and plenty of individuals spread outside of them as well. Are they everywhere? No. They're quite a small minority now, so it makes sense that you may not have personally met a Native American, especially if you're only counting full-blooded. No they don't all live 'on the res', but many who leave tend to stay somewhat close and it's certainly where the population clusters are. And those who do leave tend to be more open about mixed marriage (or even just a few generations ago, were being forced to lie about their heritage, like my ancestor).
Find the tribe closest to you. You'd probably be surprised at their presence. I know one of the ones close to us (owns several of the big border casinos) has quite the government structure.
Depends on tribe mostly. As I understood, there were some peaceful tribes. Right now we're mashing all native americans in a bunch, but even when talking about the USA native americans there's lots of tribes, and even from some of the big ones I think there were 1-2 that were more pacifist.
If we go into the entire Americas, we have some violent guys, the aztecs for example... but we also have some less violent guys, like the Inca Empire who weren't really more violent then general european nations (as far as I know, could be wrong).
Now, being honest, while there were some pacifist tribes, there were also warlike ones that lived from war... it's not different from european nations in a way... except when you go to the scale of tribes (rare, I admit) that killed people and drank blood out of their skulls(some native USA tribe, can't remember name) and took their hearts out to make the sun rise (aztecs).
There were good tribes, and there were bad ones. Just like in Europe, there were countries hellbent on conquering everyone and others that stood in their place just making friends.
Last edited by mmoc994dcc48c2; 2013-04-22 at 09:26 PM.