Megaera 10 man

[Aegle]

I've got some logs here. The tanks aren't part of my core group, so unless it's "your tanks sucked therefore you didn't get a kill," I don't care too much about them.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/owv349f9lkietq6q/

I'm unsure of what we're doing wrong. By the end of attempts, all 3 healers were out of mana. We were using mana tide on cd and had two spriest hymns. We usually wipe around 6th-7th head, and we're saving lust for the 7th. Since I'm a healer, I'm hoping that we're just ooming because dps needs to be higher, but I don't want to ride my dps too hard if that isn't actually the issue. Dps ranges from 504 on my newest recruit to 515 in my more seasoned players.

Could I get some opinions or thoughts please? Thanks!

[Halifax]

Your raid's DPS is "a little" low, but absolutely not enough that improving it will suddenly give you a kill with no other changes. The fight is easily doable with the level of DPS your raid is pulling.

The first thing that jumps out at me on your log is looking at the damage taken breakdown page. Everyone in your raid is taking an exceptional amount of damage from Acid Rain (the AoE thing that the Green Head in the mist tosses), and this is likely the reason you are OOMing.

My best suggestion would be to try the following: Don't kill any green heads. Alternate Blue/Red/Blue/Red/etc. This is how my group do it, and after a few attempts of dealing with Acid Rain, we killed it on our 2nd attempt after making this change.

By the end of the fight you will end up doing a lot of running around with the ice beams which will lower your dps/healing by a bit, but it will drastically reduce the amount of healing needed. On your longest attempt, most raid members took almost as much damage from Acid Rain as they did from Rampage. That's a lot of mana your healers need to spend!

Also note that on the 6th/7th heads the tank who is tanking the Green head will be taking a fuckton of damage, expecially after the 2nd Rot Armor, so make sure they have their biggest cooldown (Icebound/Shield Wall/Fort Brew/etc) available for this, and it becomes a mostly non-issue.

[korrable]

Your raid's DPS is "a little" low, but absolutely not enough that improving it will suddenly give you a kill with no other changes. The fight is easily doable with the level of DPS your raid is pulling.

The first thing that jumps out at me on your log is looking at the damage taken breakdown page. Everyone in your raid is taking an exceptional amount of damage from Acid Rain (the AoE thing that the Green Head in the mist tosses), and this is likely the reason you are OOMing.

My best suggestion would be to try the following: Don't kill any green heads. Alternate Blue/Red/Blue/Red/etc. This is how my group do it, and after a few attempts of dealing with Acid Rain, we killed it on our 2nd attempt after making this change.

By the end of the fight you will end up doing a lot of running around with the ice beams which will lower your dps/healing by a bit, but it will drastically reduce the amount of healing needed. On your longest attempt, most raid members took almost as much damage from Acid Rain as they did from Rampage. That's a lot of mana your healers need to spend!

Also note that on the 6th/7th heads the tank who is tanking the Green head will be taking a fuckton of damage, expecially after the 2nd Rot Armor, so make sure they have their biggest cooldown (Icebound/Shield Wall/Fort Brew/etc) available for this, and it becomes a mostly non-issue.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. My own raid group was having a lot of trouble trying to go red/green/red/green/red like some strats had it, but the fight is much more doable if you use a strategy that goes blue/red/glue/red/green/blue/red. This way you only have to deal with the annoying bu not a huge problem beams, and the cinders damage doesn't get insanely high because you'll only have 2 stacks on that head at the end of the fight.
After wiping massively on this for a few weeks, we one shotted it last night using the above strat.
We also save and use heroism at 20% on the Last blue head (6th) because it carries over into the rampage and makes healing that a lot easier. (Plus have everyone else throw what they can out.. NOT at the same time though!)

[Tibeus]

I've got some logs here. The tanks aren't part of my core group, so unless it's "your tanks sucked therefore you didn't get a kill," I don't care too much about them.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/owv349f9lkietq6q/

I'm unsure of what we're doing wrong. By the end of attempts, all 3 healers were out of mana. We were using mana tide on cd and had two spriest hymns. We usually wipe around 6th-7th head, and we're saving lust for the 7th. Since I'm a healer, I'm hoping that we're just ooming because dps needs to be higher, but I don't want to ride my dps too hard if that isn't actually the issue. Dps ranges from 504 on my newest recruit to 515 in my more seasoned players.

Could I get some opinions or thoughts please? Thanks!

We just killed this on Monday on our last pull we decided to pop hero half way through the second to last head because this is where we kept wiping, the last Rampage was no problem and we had hero for part of it. Once we got to the last head most of the raid died before the boss died but in the end we killed it. Also we didn't kill any frost heads because it was just too much of an issue for us, you should try this strat out

[Halifax]

Also we didn't kill any frost heads because it was just too much of an issue for us,

Their log shows that their biggest issue is Acid Raid damage, especially if healers are OOMing, and this would just make the problem worse. I'm sure it works for your group, but based on the data presented, it would not be a good idea for their group.

[Aegle]

I agree with this wholeheartedly. My own raid group was having a lot of trouble trying to go red/green/red/green/red like some strats had it, but the fight is much more doable if you use a strategy that goes blue/red/glue/red/green/blue/red. This way you only have to deal with the annoying bu not a huge problem beams, and the cinders damage doesn't get insanely high because you'll only have 2 stacks on that head at the end of the fight.
After wiping massively on this for a few weeks, we one shotted it last night using the above strat.
We also save and use heroism at 20% on the Last blue head (6th) because it carries over into the rampage and makes healing that a lot easier. (Plus have everyone else throw what they can out.. NOT at the same time though!)

That does make sense. I know we gave this strat a try a couple weeks ago, and it just went horribly wrong for us, so we went back to red/green. Is there anything else to reduce the damage from green? i.e. why is this viable for most groups, but for apparently you two and myself, it's a huge issue? Does killing blue more often mean my raiders are going to have more beams to commit stupid with? I know you can use it to put out the cinders on the ground, is this necessary/viable?

[Halifax]

That does make sense. I know we gave this strat a try a couple weeks ago, and it just went horribly wrong for us, so we went back to red/green. Is there anything else to reduce the damage from green? i.e. why is this viable for most groups, but for apparently you two and myself, it's a huge issue? Does killing blue more often mean my raiders are going to have more beams to commit stupid with? I know you can use it to put out the cinders on the ground, is this necessary/viable?

As for why red/green wasn't viable for my group; I'm not sure. I honestly just think our guys were not good at taking minimum damage from it by running from it. It looks like your group had the same issue, on your longest attempt you had one guy taking 4mil damage from it, when another took 2mil from it. So obvious room for improvement.

As for the blue thing, yes you will have a lot more blue beams at the end of the fight. This is a total non-issue for my group. Just make sure your ranged/healers are max range, and move straight back so that you don't end up cutting people off. After 1 attempt where somone accidentally cut off the path between the two rampage points, I don't think we've wiped since.

Putting out cinders with the blue beam is possible, we don't bother. The cinders vanish after a minute and honestly don't seem to get in the way. However, when you have the cinders debuff you can run over the ice patches on the ground, it'll remove the patches and you don't take additional damage. I don't know if this is needed, but we do it, and it helps to make more room for future ice beams.

[420rogue]

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/t...?s=7095&e=7476 is our logs from green/red strat. Our Acid rain damage is around 2 mil per person. So if someone is taking 4 mil dmg from it, they are basically standing in it

[Deleted]

Our dps is also a little low so the tanks would get 3 stacks and almost 4 stacks.. We almost made it in the last fase if it wasnt for a bad placed cinder last night.. With all the help on the forums about this topic (this helps a lot) we changed our strategy according to our group.. We are now doing a tank switch after the second breath while maintaining grgrgrg.. This lowers the tank damage in such an amount the healers can concentrate more on raidheals (3 healers).. We dont do blue cause its too long of an walk otherwise on tankswitch not because the blue beam is hard.. Its going down tomorrow thats for sure!

[Deleted]

How are you guys handling the first half of the fight (head 1-4), especially rampages? Reason I ask is that our healers (pally, druid and disc priest) went OOM around head 6 too, but we quickly found out that we were overestimating rampage damage. The first 2-3 rampages are quite low on dmg, so we saved a lot of mana by taking it fairly easy there. Looking at the healing done graphs, you guys seem to heal roughly as much every rampage, so I'm guessing you're in fact wasting mana with the first few.

We also had 1 healer focus on saving mana until head 5. At that point acid rains go off much more often, cinders start dealing a ton more dmg and tank dmg gets increasingly high as well. In effect you realistically only really need a third healer from here on out, so it's wise to have 1 full on mana at this point.

Other small but important pointers: starting with head 5, dispel cinders asap. Just let melee run to one of the nearby "hills" fairly close to the tanks. The tanks should be facing the heads almost completely to the right/left, so melee shouldn't get hit by breaths when they drop cinders. You're pally should spec into HoPurity and use it on the red tank (especially for 3 stacks), which will greatly reduce its dmg. I can also recommend saving a good healer CD for head 7 after a 2nd acid rain appears. At this point ppl often die on cinders because their hp has been greatly reduced by successive acid rains. This in turn often results in a clusterfuck because the cinder spawned in a group on death. This is also a perfect time for your spriests to use vampiric embrace for some extra raidhealing.

You should find head 6 much better to deal with if you greatly reduce traveltime for everyone. Dropping cinders closeby is 1 part of it, but you can also split the raid in 3 groups. We form a sort of triangle where every group has 1 healer. This is done so only 1 healer has to move for acid rain (the rest should be at least 20y away and can thus afford to remain still). Especially this last change made a great impact.

As for hero, we pop it around 30% on head 6. This way we have heroism for the entire duration of the last rampage, where ppl can already nuke head 7. This means we usually exit rampage with head 7 somewhere close to 50% (if I recall correctly).

[Aegle]

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/t...?s=7095&e=7476 is our logs from green/red strat. Our Acid rain damage is around 2 mil per person. So if someone is taking 4 mil dmg from it, they are basically standing in it

The 4 mil is from our longest attempt, which is a full 2:27 longer than yours. Looking at our numbers, the people taking most of the damage are standing closer to melee.. Maybe I'm just letting them stand too close together? The top is our warlock, but the next 3 are all healers.. and if we moved any more than necessary, a tank would drop. >.<

Our dps is also a little low so the tanks would get 3 stacks and almost 4 stacks.. We almost made it in the last fase if it wasnt for a bad placed cinder last night.. With all the help on the forums about this topic (this helps a lot) we changed our strategy according to our group.. We are now doing a tank switch after the second breath while maintaining grgrgrg.. This lowers the tank damage in such an amount the healers can concentrate more on raidheals (3 healers).. We dont do blue cause its too long of an walk otherwise on tankswitch not because the blue beam is hard.. Its going down tomorrow thats for sure!

Huh, I hadn't even thought about that. Our tanks were getting 3-4 stacks as well, with our dps. The beams seem like they'd leave a lot of room for someone to wipe me to stupid, maybe I'll try this before going red/blue. Thanks!

How are you guys handling the first half of the fight (head 1-4), especially rampages? Reason I ask is that our healers (pally, druid and disc priest) went OOM around head 6 too, but we quickly found out that we were overestimating rampage damage. The first 2-3 rampages are quite low on dmg, so we saved a lot of mana by taking it fairly easy there. Looking at the healing done graphs, you guys seem to heal roughly as much every rampage, so I'm guessing you're in fact wasting mana with the first few.

We also had 1 healer focus on saving mana until head 5. At that point acid rains go off much more often, cinders start dealing a ton more dmg and tank dmg gets increasingly high as well. In effect you realistically only really need a third healer from here on out, so it's wise to have 1 full on mana at this point.

Other small but important pointers: starting with head 5, dispel cinders asap. Just let melee run to one of the nearby "hills" fairly close to the tanks. The tanks should be facing the heads almost completely to the right/left, so melee shouldn't get hit by breaths when they drop cinders. You're pally should spec into HoPurity and use it on the red tank (especially for 3 stacks), which will greatly reduce its dmg. I can also recommend saving a good healer CD for head 7 after a 2nd acid rain appears. At this point ppl often die on cinders because their hp has been greatly reduced by successive acid rains. This in turn often results in a clusterfuck because the cinder spawned in a group on death. This is also a perfect time for your spriests to use vampiric embrace for some extra raidhealing.

You should find head 6 much better to deal with if you greatly reduce traveltime for everyone. Dropping cinders closeby is 1 part of it, but you can also split the raid in 3 groups. We form a sort of triangle where every group has 1 healer. This is done so only 1 healer has to move for acid rain (the rest should be at least 20y away and can thus afford to remain still). Especially this last change made a great impact.

As for hero, we pop it around 30% on head 6. This way we have heroism for the entire duration of the last rampage, where ppl can already nuke head 7. This means we usually exit rampage with head 7 somewhere close to 50% (if I recall correctly).

First: I roll SLT and HLT right after. I know it's not that much damage, but I spend this time using TC glyph to get some dps in on the boss without losing mana, and I won't have a better time to use these totems in the first 3 minutes anyway.
Second: Druid tranq's, we just light aoe heal.
Third: Pally pops his cds, I'm honestly not sure what he's using and how.
And we just rotate that way, ramping up as needed.

I'm hoping that having our normal tanks back will allow us to save more mana up, like you're saying. If we had done that tonight, no way tanks would've been up. We had started dispelling them sooner as the fight went on, but we might be able to push it a little more. My HLT should be up in time for 7th head OFUDGE moment, and I have at least ascendance available, I'd have to double check with druid. Thanks!

[Confucius]

we killed it with about the same dps that you had on your best try. It's more about managing cd's than anything else with your gear levels. I cant remember the kill order (because I'm a stupid prot warrior and I do what I'm told, cant think of my own) but basic idea was to rotate raid def and healing cd's on every rampage. Most important was to save dps cd's for the 5th rampage (obviously using them on first head etc but making sure all are up for 5th) and use hero as usual on 6th. Reason behind it was that although you lose some amount of dps on the last head but the 6th head will go down faster than saving your dps cd's for the hero. We were constantly dying on 6th head before we switched to that. first 5 heads are pretty much a joke. What you need to concentrate are the last 2 rampages and heads.

[lordsphinx]

Second: Druid tranq's, we just light aoe heal.
Third: Pally pops his cds, I'm honestly not sure what he's using and how.
And we just rotate that way, ramping up as needed.

What is the rest of your raid comp? Maybe we can help you better manage your CDs so you don't blow as much mana...

[Aegle]

What is the rest of your raid comp? Maybe we can help you better manage your CDs so you don't blow as much mana...

I linked logs in the first post. Although tanks are usually warrior/druid.
Resto shaman, holy pally, resto druid.
Spriest x2, hunter, warlock, rogue. I thiiink lock is demo and rogue is combat? I know the lock said he was switching specs after the first pull or two though, might have gone aff. Someone who plays those classes could probably find signature moves in the logs.

[lordsphinx]

I linked logs in the first post. Although tanks are usually warrior/druid.
Resto shaman, holy pally, resto druid.
Spriest x2, hunter, warlock, rogue. I thiiink lock is demo and rogue is combat? I know the lock said he was switching specs after the first pull or two though, might have gone aff. Someone who plays those classes could probably find signature moves in the logs.

Sorry I'm at work, and for some reason WoL is blocked but MMO champ isn't, but w/e...

OK, so here are the CD’s you have available:
Prot Warr: Rallying Cry
Feral Druid: Heart of the Wild + Tranq
Resto Shaman: Healing Tide, Spirit Link, Ascendance
Holy Pally: Devo Aura
Resto Druid: Tranquility
S.priest: Vampiric Embrace + Symbiosis Tranquility (#’s 1 & 2 for two priests)
Hunter: Nothing as far as I know, could be wrong
Warlock: Lock Candy
Rogue: Smoke Bomb

You have so many CD’s here, it’s not even funny. As a matter of fact, you should be able to use the rampage phases as REGEN phases lol. Here is how I would do it…

Rampage #1: Rallying Cry + Vampiric Embrace #1 (healers shouldn't need to cast anything here at all)
Rampage #2: Devo Aura + Vamp #2 (healers shouldn't need to cast anything here at all)
Rampage #3: Spirit Link + Feral HoW / Tranq (Light healing needed)
Rampage #4: Healing Tide + Smoke Bomb + Lock candies if needed
Rampage #5: Rallying Cry + Vampiric Embrace #1 + Symbiosis Tranq #2 + Ascendance
Rampage #6: Devo Aura + Vamp #2 + Sym Tranq #1 + Resto Tranq

The thing to remember is that for those last couple rampages, you don’t want everyone to pop everything at the beginning of the rampage, or you’re going to have nothing for the end. In my group, I will assign an order for people to pop their stuff, and then we just call it out. Example, on the last rampage Devo aura goes out right as it starts, Vamp 2 secs after, priest tranq 2 seconds after that, and resto tranq to finish (and top people off after it’s over…). Honestly, if these all get popped at the right times, I would be absolutely floored if anyone died to any rampages =)

[Halifax]

Sorry I'm at work, and for some reason WoL is blocked but MMO champ isn't, but w/e...

OK, so here are the CD’s you have available:
Prot Warr: Rallying Cry
Feral Druid: Heart of the Wild + Tranq
Resto Shaman: Healing Tide, Spirit Link, Ascendance
Holy Pally: Devo Aura
Resto Druid: Tranquility
S.priest: Vampiric Embrace + Symbiosis Tranquility (#’s 1 & 2 for two priests)
Hunter: Nothing as far as I know, could be wrong
Warlock: Lock Candy
Rogue: Smoke Bomb

You have so many CD’s here, it’s not even funny. As a matter of fact, you should be able to use the rampage phases as REGEN phases lol. Here is how I would do it…

Rampage #1: Rallying Cry + Vampiric Embrace #1 (healers shouldn't need to cast anything here at all)
Rampage #2: Devo Aura + Vamp #2 (healers shouldn't need to cast anything here at all)
Rampage #3: Spirit Link + Feral HoW / Tranq (Light healing needed)
Rampage #4: Healing Tide + Smoke Bomb + Lock candies if needed
Rampage #5: Rallying Cry + Vampiric Embrace #1 + Symbiosis Tranq #2 + Ascendance
Rampage #6: Devo Aura + Vamp #2 + Sym Tranq #1 + Resto Tranq

The thing to remember is that for those last couple rampages, you don’t want everyone to pop everything at the beginning of the rampage, or you’re going to have nothing for the end. In my group, I will assign an order for people to pop their stuff, and then we just call it out. Example, on the last rampage Devo aura goes out right as it starts, Vamp 2 secs after, priest tranq 2 seconds after that, and resto tranq to finish (and top people off after it’s over…). Honestly, if these all get popped at the right times, I would be absolutely floored if anyone died to any rampages =)

If you actually look at the logs provided, it doesn't appear as though they are having an issues with Rampage. They are using cooldowns properly for Rampage. They are having trouble with slightly low dps, and people taking too much damage from Acid Rain. So much so that some people are taking almost as much from Acid Rain as they are from Rampage.

And yet almost all of the advice people are giving is with regards to rampage, which they are already doing right lol

[Aegle]

If you actually look at the logs provided, it doesn't appear as though they are having an issues with Rampage. They are using cooldowns properly for Rampage. They are having trouble with slightly low dps, and people taking too much damage from Acid Rain. So much so that some people are taking almost as much from Acid Rain as they are from Rampage.

And yet almost all of the advice people are giving is with regards to rampage, which they are already doing right lol

The first thing this guy said in this post was that he's at work and WoL is blocked, he couldn't have seen the issues we were having. About half of the advice we've gotten is more regarding strategy and order, plus there are probably some cds he listed that I can tell people specifically to use throughout the fight.

[lordsphinx]

I also think that proper CD management during rampages can save the healers a TON of mana, and make the end of the fight easier where the sh!t hits the fan. The healers in my group are not amazingly geared by any means, and we do the GRGRGRG strat, yet they are at at least 80% mana when we start in on the 6th head. This allows for more inefficient healing to keep people alive when things go wrong.

[BGHunter]

For our raid team GRGRGRG was really bad experience. AoE dmg from green just became too much. What we do to this rotation of heads is to kill one BLUE head to tune it down a bit. When we go for GRGRBRG, we have a nice kill. Also for heal, make sure the strongest CDs are used on 5th and 6th rampage with some DPS dmg reduction/heal CDs. From our healers tip is to use CD on every rampage, 1-2-3 are weak, but CDs are to save the mana.

[Danger0ss]

Here is the log from our first Mag kill last night. We were hitting a wall non stop until we went 4 heals (Pally,druid,disco,punchy monk). The overall DPS didn't drop as much as we thought it would and it was a thousand times easier. You have higher dps and hps than our group so I would guess its an order issue. We switched order last night also avoiding killing green as much as possible I think it was b,r,b,g,r,b,r,g or something.

Here is the log worldoflogs.com/reports/hd8tofk2ay0pxvcn/dashboard/?s=14486&e=15094