Sorry, explain to me how PvE gear will be superior to PvP gear in 5.3 again? Oh, you mean just for World PvP, something nobody but you cares about because it's impossible to balance. That's right.Originally Posted by RantingDeleth
That what it comes down to, your entire argument, that in the perfect situation a fully geared player with Thunderforge Gear gemmed out for PvP, with a PvP spec and setup to PvP jumps you 1v1 out in the wilderness while you mine ore in Northrend. Yep, in that case you might lose, life is hard sometime though.
---------- Post added 2013-05-01 at 02:32 PM ----------
But there still is gear progression (at least their will be next season). They're going to up the iLevel next season, so you will still need Conquest/Honor gear. The irony over the (faux) anger over this entire system is for the people who already PvP, it won't actually change much. What it will do is allow new people to play without being globaled or destroyed in a single CC. Not sure why people are so against that.
---------- Post added 2013-05-01 at 02:40 PM ----------
You aren't seriously comparing the imbalance of low level PvP to lvl 90 PvP are you? Come on, even you can see how ridiculous that is. A healer can crit heal for 3 times their HP, a crit Shield Slam will kill someone 2 times over. Low level PvP is not even in the same league of imbalance that lvl 90 is, and saying it's the same is beyond ridiculous.
Yes, you can exchange Justice in for Honor, but he it's clear by his post that he also PvEs, so he probably changed that Justice in for PvE pieces. This was that persons first attempt at PvP. Also, you don't get that much Justice for leveling in Dungeons, in fact you get 0 JP for most of them, instead you get a random Blue up until Wraith (or could be TBC, can't remember off hand).Originally Posted by meathead
Last edited by Siddown; 2013-05-01 at 07:50 PM.
But they're likely not at the same experience level. They both encounter each other, and the more skilled player wins, which is exactly as it should be. That's a step towards decent balance. "lol I'm geared and you arent, pwned noob" is not.
Nearly every other good PvP game on the market realizes this very basic fact and takes it into account... after this long, you'd figure that Blizzard would as well.
"Sorry, explain to me how PvE gear will be superior to PvP gear in 5.3 again"
let me say this again ok.ther are 3 froms of pvp in wow,instance =bgs ect, wpvp= like fighting while doing dailys, and dules.pvp gear MIGHT be best for only instance pvp,pve gear will be better for the other 2.that doe snot scream broken to you?o thats right who cares about fighting outside of arenas when your on a pvp server.
"You aren't seriously comparing the imbalance of low level PvP to lvl 90 PvP are you"
no,why are you?are you trying to say wow neglects 90 pvp more the they do low level pvp?or maybe i was just respoding to some1 question?keep trying to spin it.who cares about low level pvp right,what does it matter.who cares about wpvp right?who cares about dules right?aslogn as blizz makes sure 90 arena is balced along with rbgs all is well right?o wait a min,arena is a bad spot atm and fcers are goign to go by by from rbgs soon.looks like alot will miss out on low level pvp,wpvp,duels because you say who ares about them.
Yes, you can exchange Justice in for Honor, but he it's clear by his post that he also PvEs, so he probably changed that Justice in for PvE pieces.
o wait a mintue-so he pves also and wants his pve curreny for pve gear.ok i ge tthat,but what i dont get why does he not want to pvp to get his pvp gear?are the high skilled player in ramdons bgs to hard to kill?or is it to hard to sit afk and a flag/base and get free honor?
Okay, perhaps "progression" was the wrong word, Kreeshak had mentioned that he gets bored once he gets BiS, but that problem exists today and is nothing to do with the 5.3 changes. Could they add some sort of other progression? Sure, I'm all for it, but I just don't think it should be gear related.
but your forgetting a more experienced/skill/geared player does not always win.you have to factor in class balanced and op/up ness.should blizz fix that fist or your right that just be dumb to take time and fix class/skills in pvp.ever try to kill a blood dk as an arms warrior during s5 or any season for that matter?that right just avoided them,but what happens if u cant because your protecting a flag.o thats right clas balance is not an issues,its gear.
I honestly am having a very difficult time understanding anything you wrote here. English might not be your first language, but whatever that language is, punctuation, sentence structure and capitalization are. I'll do what I can to try and get through this.
From what I understand you are saying there are three types of PvP:
1) BGs/RBGs and Arena
2) World PvP
3) Duels
And you are saying that the upper echelon PvE gear will be better than PvP gear in 2) and 3). The problem is, you are assigning each one of them equal weighting which is not remotely accurate. Duels are 1v1 which the game isn't balanced around anyway and the outcome of a Duel has no impact on the game other than a learning experience. So losing a duel outside damaging your epeen, means nothing. World PvP is impossible to balance around and therefore isn't even worth discussing in this context.
Your 1) is what Blizzard, and risking getting told I don't speak for the majority, what most people care about. So yes, Duels and World PvP might be rough if a fully decked out player attacks you in PvE gear, but that's how it is today as well, there is no change.
Here I'm lost. Clearly you ignored what I wrote or don't understand it. I'll summarize. You told us about how you leveld in TBC and did BGs, I said "well, low level BGs are ridiculously imbalance now, so they're not all that much fun for new players", to which you said "low level like the rest of wow PvP is unbalanced".
"You aren't seriously comparing the imbalance of low level PvP to lvl 90 PvP are you"
no,why are you?are you trying to say wow neglects 90 pvp more the they do low level pvp?or maybe i was just respoding to some1 question?keep trying to spin it.who cares about low level pvp right,what does it matter.who cares about wpvp right?who cares about dules right?aslogn as blizz makes sure 90 arena is balced along with rbgs all is well right?o wait a min,arena is a bad spot atm and fcers are goign to go by by from rbgs soon.looks like alot will miss out on low level pvp,wpvp,duels because you say who ares about them.
90 PvP is way more balanced than low level PvP is (or probably ever will be). You remembering fondly of your days back in TBC doesn't change that.
PvP has a barrier to entry that is just to high in the eyes of the developers. So in their eyes, they'd rather a player be able to enter a BG and not be completely useless the first time they enter, instead they'd going to make them just mostly useless in a hope that the player enjoys it enough to do some more.Yes, you can exchange Justice in for Honor, but he it's clear by his post that he also PvEs, so he probably changed that Justice in for PvE pieces.
o wait a mintue-so he pves also and wants his pve curreny for pve gear.ok i ge tthat,but what i dont get why does he not want to pvp to get his pvp gear?are the high skilled player in ramdons bgs to hard to kill?or is it to hard to sit afk and a flag/base and get free honor?
FWIW, PvE has a much higher barrier to entry, but they'e started fixing that as well with things like Raid Finder and removing Rep requirements on Valor gear back in 5.0.4
Blizzard is simply trying to make PvP more inclusive because its not as popular as PvE. This is the easy way to do this, it's not rocket science. Blizzard does this all the time in this game. They try and make unpopular choices more popular by making them more appealing (look at the Monk class in 5.2 for a great example of this).
S5 is over long over and none of that shit really matters now. Everyone didn't have trouble with dks in s5, they where strong, but they could be killed. The point and focus should be on todays PvP and the up-coming patch. As far as I can tell we will have a few pve items that are going to be stronger then some of the pvp. Even in instanced pvp some pve items will shine. It's really not a big deal they will either get fixed or everyone will get them. In wpvp you wont see very many ppl in heroic loot running around and the fun thing is: If they are in that 541 or whatever loot they most likely will not be better then you, providing you are a decent player. If you are some 1400s scrub you may lose to that pve geared player, but honestly at this point is it the gear causing you to lose or some heroic raider that more then likely understands how to dps? With the pvp power new and the slight healing nerf things are coming into line a little better, ppl are still getting bursted hard I really hope they fix that. I'm almost sure they blizzard with all the time and effort they put into fucking around with pvp gear will not allow socketed pve items pull a head of pvp items.
Have you guys played PvP on ptr right now? Hybrid duels are goind like forever... it`s just fucked up. Damage is so miniscule and heal is going to be so ridiculous, even with 45% heal reduce... dont even notice it
Watch this http://youtu.be/oSGH21K7czs
1v1 starts on 6:40 or so.
Hunters use to have a dead zone. So if you stuck to one you could stop all his damage. People casted more as well which means you could stop their damage. Now everyone just spam instants.
You're right except for 2 things.
1. My name is spelt "God" not "Loucious-sama".
2. I'm not a man, because man is inherently flawed. I am in fact a being so far beyond your comprehension that archaic constraints like flesh, blood, time and consequently, gender, have no meaning to me.
cut the shit and stop with the wise cracks ok kido?if you think im going to spend time and edit or even re read my post your nuts.i typed that thing up as fast as i could because i could care less if i miss spell a work or whatever.just keep on drinking the cool-aid-wows pvp is the best it ever been.no class os op'ed or un'ed,its like you said pvp gear is so hard to get.wow need more pvers to start pvping."know why?because wow is losing pvpers "
also i said i leveled from 80-85 in bgs in CATA,not BC.i also did the same in mop and for the most part wrath.two out of three types of pvp,pve gera will be better.go read the blues post,they more or less say just that.
"PvP has a barrier to entry that is just to high in the eyes of the developers"
thats a load of shit-you want me to keep telling you how easy it is to get honor gear?you might not be on a pvper sever or like to pvp,but some of us are and do.there should never be that big of a gap difference as there will be "pvp and pve gear".
"PvE has a much higher barrier to entry, but they'e started fixing that as well with things like Raid Finder and removing Rep requirements on Valor gear back in 5.0.4"
that called catering to the bads-i guess all the top pvers run raid finder all day right?wow has been put on easy mode and real issues that need to be fixed have been left untouched.
"Blizzard is simply trying to make PvP more inclusive because its not as popular as PvE"
this is also a load of shit.when the last time blizz had a tournament for pve?wow makes its game as an e-spot.blizz sell wow and a pvp game,you know the hole horde vs ally thing?pvp servers? also more people par take in pvp in wow then they do in pve.i can sit there and run bgs all day/night long.av is 40 vs 40 and they run not stop every day all day.but you can only raid with max of 25 once a week right?no question more people pvp then they do pve.
lmfao-yeah dks were not "that" op'ed in s5-the most unbalanced pvp season there has ever been.your right no class is op'ed now every one is even.your right no heroic geared pvers go out in the world to kill world raid bosses,none at all.you might want to change your server if you "dont see" herioc geared players on your realm.
Last edited by meathead; 2013-05-01 at 10:14 PM.
I think stuff like this pretty much invalidates anything you have to say.
As does stuff like this."Blizzard is simply trying to make PvP more inclusive because its not as popular as PvE"
this is also a load of shit.when the last time blizz had a tournament for pve?wow makes its game as an e-spot.blizz sell wow and a pvp game,you know the hole horde vs ally thing?pvp servers? also more people par take in pvp in wow then they do in pve.i can sit there and run bgs all day/night long.av is 40 vs 40 and they run not stop every day all day.but you can only raid with max of 25 once a week right?no question more people pvp then they do pve.
---------- Post added 2013-05-01 at 08:07 PM ----------
So how is upgrading your gear any different than getting BiS now? It's the same thing, just extended over more weeks. Personally I do think they need to add better rewards for top players to make people want to keep at it, but I'm not really sure making people grind to upgrade the same gear they already bought Malevolent then Tyranical is the way to do it.
Last edited by Siddown; 2013-05-02 at 12:13 AM.
I guess the only difference is getting BIS in 6-10 weeks versus say 30 weeks.So how is upgrading your gear any different than getting BiS now? It's the same thing, just extended over more weeks. Personally I do think they need to add better rewards for top players to make people want to keep at it, but I'm not really sure making people grind to upgrade the same gear they already bought Malevolent then Tyranical is the way to do it.
I already feel slightly bored having (almost) BIS while I remember I was more excited having a goal, a reward to play for during the previous season.
You know, editing the name of someone in order to insult them is low, very low. I was for a moment tempted to do the same but instead I'm just going to laugh at you trying to claim the moral high ground in any further discussion. What you are doing is pretty pathethic.
First of all you should learn to actually read what people are writing, apparently reading comprehension isn't your strong point. The sentence "worse than before before compared to" does not say it will be worse in general in instanced PvP. Merely that it slowly but surely changes in unfavor of PvP gear and that is a fact. Or do you want to argue the point that PvE gear will gain 25% resilience and PvP gear will lose about 1/3 of it's PvP power? Both of these are changes in favor of PvE gear.
And yes for SOME pieces especially offset or to take some desirable set bonuses PvE gear will be at the very least equal or better. The vast majority of PvP power is coming from the weapon alone anyway, the less will be quite insignificant compared to gaining a set bonus for example.
The second part of your argument is a pretty pathethic attempt to ridicule my post, especially the part about "Northrend" acting as if it was outdated and to show just how "unlikely" it will be. Gaining the 522 items isn't hard, you can buy those per valor points and coming 5.3 even those will be ilevel 530 compared to ilevel 496 sets.
It's a 34 ilevel difference we're looking at here, that's a huge difference in brute strenght and a hell of a lot of difference in stats. Hell someone in that gear is going to have around 80-100k HP more alone and that is now with about the same resilience a PvP player has.
And World PvP does happen, actually quite often. I so far couldn't complete the quests on the Isle of Thunder on my server once without being attacked at least once and very often with me attacking other players several times over.
It's about about "you might lose" or "life is tough" (what kind of insane troll response is this anyway?) but about PvE gear being inherently better for a PVP ACTIVITY and that simply should not be the case. Ever.
I'm not quite sure why a PvE troll like you thinks he has any kind of right to call ANYONE out on anything. Let's just sum up your behavior in this thread alone:
1. You're editing people's names in quotes to ridicule and aggravate them.
2. You're constantly trying to infuriate people instead of actualy arguing the points they bring up "life's tough".
3. You so far have neither proven nor backed up any of the things you claimed, when someone disputed your points or criticized them you instead choose to just forget about them altogether.
4. Your only goal in this thread seems to be to make people angry, nothing else whatsoever.
Last edited by mmoc5e6c40f22c; 2013-05-02 at 12:31 AM.
Originally Posted by High Overlord Saurfangi7-6700 @2.8GHz | Nvidia GTX 960M | 16GB DDR4-2400MHz | 1 TB Toshiba SSD| Dell XPS 15
The reward was that if you had higher rating you would get more cap and it would have mattered.
With this system you can cap at 1300 rating and have the very same gear than someone who would cap at 2200 rating.
And the million dollar question is why would anyone bother to get rating for?
---------- Post added 2013-05-02 at 07:20 AM ----------
It does take effort to raise your cap so you progress fast.It doesn't take any effort whatsoever
I don't understand why people wouldnt want to get the crafted PvP gear first when starting from scratch. Heck My new PvP toon is only 76 and I've already got my hands on 5/8 parts of the Crafted Dreadful Gladiator's Vestments ready to go! =D I'll probably still get my ass handed to me repeatedly while I get honor and eventually conquest gear and learn how to PvP lol)
People play (and pvp) for gear because it is a sense of progression in pretty much every rpg I have played in the last 15-20 years. I understant there are fotm rerollers which I have no sympathy for. I agree that late starters should have a means to catch up but since they are a minority there shouldn't be so drastic changes that penalise the very essence of progression.
I will repeat I have a gut feeling that PVP activity will drop after getting BIS gear.