Okay. Blizzard needs to really make Warlock Tanks a 100% reality

[Thelxi]

Tbh shamans should get a tanking spec before locks. It will probably happen eventually but it will take a looong time especially since we just got a big special rework this expansion.

[chaotus]

Tbh shamans should get a tanking spec before locks. It will probably happen eventually but it will take a looong time especially since we just got a big special rework this expansion.

I do sort of agree, I main a warlock but jesus the shaman tank needs a comeback.

[Mormolyce]

If they wanted you to be full time tanks they would:

1) Make it baseline, not a glyph.
2) Remove Demo's ability to be a DPS spec.
3) Create tank cloth for only you to wear.

If anything they should consider nerfing or removing the glyph entirely. It was intended as a niche ability but clearly a certain segment of the community stubbornly refuses to understand the concept of niche and to this day insists they should be turned into fully fledged tanks despite the fact that doesn't make a scrap of sense and they wouldn't like the changes necessary to make it work.

or we could have Warlock tanking become a reality through the glyphing interface that trades damage for survivability passively so it's not super op in pvp but viable in pve.

How about a glyph that turns my Rogue's Assassination spec into a healing spec? And I get to be a competitive DPS spec as well.

Oh wait, that's stupid.

---------- Post added 2013-06-18 at 01:39 AM ----------

Tbh shamans should get a tanking spec before locks. It will probably happen eventually but it will take a looong time especially since we just got a big special rework this expansion.

That would be the end of Enh as a DPS spec. I reckon Enh shamans might be a tad pissed about that.

You might see it in the future if Blizzard decides to make every class able to fill every role. I doubt it though, as that goes against the core of WoW's class system.

[Deleted]

Soooo why not make Hunters tanks too! They have pets that can tank and stuff! And maybe rogues with stacked avoidance they would be best tanks evarrrrr!

About warlocks tanks: you would lose Demonology as dps spec, why would you want that?

[Deleted]

Oh dear... This again. Just like a boomerang made of mud, this always comes back, is always sticky to wade through, and people will be hurt. Gonna list off my usual reasons.

1) Most obvious: Warlocks are currently a full DPS class. That means that the Developers intended those who played it to only be concerned with one subject: DPS. Those who rationally chose the class chose it with the full knowledge that they can only DPS. Those who chose Warlocks without knowing about roles (For record, warlocks were my first class) are at NO disadvantage and were FREE to reroll once they realised they wanted to tank. Those who know that and want Warlocks to tank despite the wishes of others, the current state of the class, and the developer's wishes, are trying to impose their will on others and make the class not what the Devs can balance, but what they want. To me "I love Warlocks" does not mean "I love Warlocks, i want to change them to suit my vision!". A slippery road therein lies, and we all know what happened to the last Warlock who fell from grace because he got too greedy with his singular vision of Warlocks without listening to others.

2) Warlocks are not physically sorted to tank. I'm gonna split this into three reasons: Glyphs and specs, Talents, , Demons.
2A) Glyphs and specs: Ok, this one is easiest. We are NOT able to get a fourth spec, and we WILL NOT be able to use a glyph to swap between tank and DPS. Firstly, GC is ON RECORD as saying they are not going to add a fourth spec to classes. Not going to happen. Druids are the exception that proves the rule (since their fourth is just their inherent roles since Vanilla, we were NOT tanks in vanilla, at most we were ok offtanks which is like saying that we weren't bulletproof glass, we were glass that managed to avoid a single bullet). As for the glyph to swap between DPS and Tank, it's utterly rediculous. If they wouldn't allow Feral to swap between tank and DPS in MoP when a tank/dps tree would have all the former Cata talents of both, why would they allow Warlocks? Finally, they are NOT going to replace Demonology with a tanking spec. Xelnath tried this in MoP and he got the same response from devs and realised he made a mistake, they told him "Eh, it's good but it's not a warlock". Furthermore, ranged capable tanks are hard to balance, especially ones with DPSing pets (more on that later).

2B) Talents: Talents currently are balanced around dealing damage, evading enemies in pvp in a Damage Dealer capacity and general utility. This would not be balanced on a tanking capable class. Things like Unbound Will, Burning Rush, Archimonde's Vengence, and spells like Demonic Circle will make it hard to balance for tanks. Heck, on the issue of ranged, imagine a class that not only deals good damage from a range, but up close is a tank too. We'd be impossible for melee to kill. The only reason why we're able to stand against melee in DA today is because DA doesn't have any true mitigation abilities, just pure damage reducers which are binary (you either have ward, or you don't), we don't have block chance, we don't have the healing ability of druids/DKs (no Drain Life/Healthstone/Dark Regen doesn't count) and our spells cre casted (even in DA) so being silenced would be near certain death.

2C) Pets: We have Demons that deal damage. Sounds obvious but people forget it. Now, we have a tank that can escape very well, have demons pounding on someone, and can take a beating up close and personal.

3) Warlock tanks would take away resources from adding another class that could better utilize the tanking mechanics we get. I... Don't have much to say. Even using DA as an archetype you need a massive overhaul of the class from abilites to resource to mitigation (DA does NOT have good mitiagation, it has a two-charge shield and passive reduction, compare that to a Paladin with SotR, WoG, shield blocks along with their secondary plethora of heals). This could be used and better implimented in a new class in 6.0 without cannibalizing an existing, popular, class.

Crucial point: Once you've changed the toolset of Warlocks to enable tanking, you've not only created a nearly unidentifiable class to what it was previously, you've also ruined ideas you could have used for a brand new class that would draw in players, and you've alienated a far amount of your fanbase who, if they don't quit out of frustration, will probably reroll.

4) Adding a tank class does NOT increase the amount of tanks. Tank numbers peak because those who want to tank probably are already playing a tank-capable class. Yes we'd get people interested in tanking initially, but these people would be level 90 with no way to learn their spells before they're required to tank the 90-95 dungeons. We've seen from Death Knights that giving abilities at a high level and expecting them to work the same as naturally-given spells leads to highly uncoordinated and frankly inept tanks. The same, or worse, would come from Warlock tanks and the entire 5th expansion we would become a joke class on par with the "dumb knights".

5) Not all Warlocks want this. I'm sorry but... Why? What is the point? I mean honestly. Are you just trying to shoehorn in another role to Warlocks because you think you want to tank without rerolling, or is it a case that DA is a taste of sugar, which is nice, but devouring an entire bowl of sugar isn't. Surely the fact that Warlocks are a pure class, if you want to play a pure class you have four choices, Warlock, Mage, Rogue, Hunter. If you want to play tanking class, they exist. There even exists a class that can tank AND be a spellcaster. And if you say "Oh but I only like warlocks so therefore we need to tank because I want to tank and I only want to tank on a warlock" then.... No. I'm sorry but I'm going to say this because I've seen it a LOT in these threads: if you like a class for what it can do, why shoehorn in something it can't do. Because you tanked LFR? That doesn't mean we're tanks already. Try tanking Heroic, in same iLvl as a H capable Paladin or DK and tell me we're suddenly tanks with DA rather than DA being a nice tool given so that in bad situations we can be helpful, like you had in LFR.

If anyone can give me three logical reasons that Warlocks should be able to tank that don't involve the words "I don't want to reroll..." "Fourth Spec" "Dark Apotheosis makes us tanks already", "Gruul's Lair" or "Pures are outdated", I'll be happy because it'll mean this discussion will have progressed from this stagnant reptition of the topic every few weeks.

[Terielx1]

or we could have Warlock tanking become a reality through the glyphing interface that trades damage for survivability passively so it's not super op in pvp but viable in pve.

I hate the argument "just roll a tank", I have played all 4 tanking classes (pre-monk) at level cap at least a little bit, and have a druid dk and warrior at level cap atm all which can tank (and a paladin that's almost 90), but my warlock is still my favorite to tank stuff on because the mechanics are just more fun I think.

edit: another thing is, if warlocks were given the 6% crit immunity and just a slight bit more passive damage reduction, they'd be as viable as any other tank.

as fun as all you warlocks would have with that (myself included dark apotheosis ftw) wow really doesn't need another tanking class.. wow needs more ranged dps classes/specs, the game is so melee heavy right now in raid content that isn't melee friendly at all adding yet another melee to the mix would just be annoying and pointless, now if someone could suggest a way to make a warlock a range based tank then that would be a cool idea, maybe their voidwalker would be the source of their threat through the warlocks spells transferring threat to the voidwalker IE he is your shield and you could share damage and healing so that a healer healing the warlock would be also healing the voidwalker

[Deleted]

Please no. Warlocks have the most utility already, if we would get tanking spec aswell would just make us way too wanted. I'm currently seeing guilds all over the realms are looking for warlocks as they know they bring the best utility. Battle ress, gateways, healthstones etc.

I'm happy with what we have already, we are still able to tank adds on Megaera and other minor mobs, but that's enough.
Warlocks have been a "tanky" caster in this expansion but not tank, and I hope it stays that way.

[Deleted]

So I just popped into a Pinnacle of Storms on LFR

LFR

knew before opening whats it about

[Jessicka]

I feel that would be the best option, yes.

I think that's a huge ask, and I'm also a fan of the concept of a pure class. I wish there was room in the game for pure healers and tanks.

[Deleted]

Pretty sure I've tanked all kinds of trash on my mage in lfr. Any class infact can tank LFR trash its so faceroll.

[nightfalls]

You could just as easily say: "I like to have 4 DPS specs, or are you asking Blizzard for a 5th spec for everyone?"

The limit is where you want it to be, and where Blizzard feels it should be. I would be estatic to have a 4th spec for every class as opposed to another class.

Maybe warlocks are kind of an exemption to this rule (maybe) but to this day, I still feel pure classes are actually more hurt from having 3 DPS specs than not having a tanking or healing spec.

[Jessicka]

Maybe warlocks are kind of an exemption to this rule (maybe) but to this day, I still feel pure classes are actually more hurt from having 3 DPS specs than not having a tanking or healing spec.

Most players DPS, hybrids lack options to do that. I feel they're hurt by that, makes people reroll for something different.

[nightfalls]

Most players DPS, hybrids lack options to do that. I feel they're hurt by that, makes people reroll for something different.

Perhaps, but for the most part hybrid DPS specs in my experience tend to be more "complete." Not all (warriors), but most. All pures have basically 3 specs that do the same thing once you realize it, except in a way they limit each other ("oh, we moved silencing shot back to MM so MM can feel special")

[Baristan]

DA tanking is fun and unique.

The Dark Apotheosis tanking style is built around a few core mechanics:
1. Lot'o'health
2. Big self-absorb at the cost of fury
3. Demonic Fury generation (and corresponding huge fury pool)
4. Self Heals through Damage

.

that pretty much describes Blood DKs just with a different resource system.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big advocate of Warlock tanking. I got to try it out in the early MoP beta, when it still had crit immunity and it was amazing. My reasons for wanting it though are more superficial. I want a tank with a ranged off spec. And not have to be a damn hippie Druid.
This pretty much sums it up.

warriors - have no super powers. meh.
paladins - they are chaste church boys, their class color is pink and they like to wear gold. not my cup of tea
death knights - I used to tank on my frost DK, but now only blood can be tanks and I hate blood spec. it's a terrible, made up spec created by a bunch of blood elf twilight vampires that are the shame of the scourge.
druids - they are hippies. eww.
monks - so, you're telling me that a drunk panda can take a punch, but my ultra muscular demon form with magically hardened skin and magical shields made of anger can't?

[Poochy]

Just thought I'd add that GC has said warlocks aren't tanks and will not be able to queue as tanks. Plenty of devs/blizz have said 4th specs aren't happening, or at least no time soon, because of the consequeces, balance, relearning your and other classes, weren't initially designed that way, and etc. Druids got a 4th spec because that's what feral could do, it had both the kitty dps talents and the bear tank talents, they just split it up to make the 4th, they were naturally there. And druids are designed to be versatile, warlocks are not.

Warlocks control demons, use dots, drains, curses, and etc., range down people while avoiding damage themselves, do not have any melee abilities, and wear cloth. Blizz has already said they don't like things like plate int, where it's only used by 1 spec, which would be exactly what you're asking. If you ask that they could just convert the current stats on a warlock to something, the other reasons still apply. Warlocks have no melee abilities, are not designed around being tanks, blizz is not just going to change Demo into a tank spec (they aren't going to redo it again), blizz isn't adding 4th specs, blizz does not agree with warlocks being tanks, warlocks are meant to avoid damage by being far away and using demons, and etc.

People play dps to be dps, changing a pure to a hybrid would be a big change that would probably not go well, especially because warlocks have already had (as GC said) 30% of the changes during this expac, they've gotten enough of the limelight. Some people play pures so they don't have to worry about tanking or healing, I know I like my pure. I can do any of the other 2 specs without having to radically change gear or anything. Blizz has already said more tanks haven't increased the amount of people tanking, making another tank, especially to warlocks, would be a loss. Besides, people see and love Demo as it is, a dps spec.


TL;DR
Read this, GC already answered this thread basically in the past:

Failarius ‏@Failarius 18 May

@Ghostcrawler GC Warlocks are more than capable of tanking MoP heroics now, any chance warlocks will be to Queue as a tank?

Greg Street Greg Street ‏@Ghostcrawler 18 May

@Failarius No. They aren't a tank spec. If you want to tank with your friends, go for it.

[nightfalls]

People play dps to be dps, changing a pure to a hybrid would be a big change that would probably not go well

And most people forget that changing a pure to a hybrid doesn't stop you from dps'ing at all.

[FurtyIRL]

If I wasn't so attached to demonology I'd almost love to see metamorphosis be akin to bear form for druids. Almost.

To be honest though I like warlock the way it is. I'm happy enough DA gives us some chuckles from tanking heroics etc. with friends. They didn't have to give us anything.

[dejec1989]

Tanking warlocks before tanking shamans? please...

[Seezer]

Holy shit I mean this in the nicest possible way and I know opinions are subjective, but that's the most terrible idea I think I've ever heard proposed to WoW, ever.

COme on dude. He's being funny. He wasn't being serious. I thought it was hilarious XD

---------- Post added 2013-06-19 at 05:34 AM ----------

I don't have an interest in tanking as any of the existing tank specs.

I would tank in an instant if it was possible as a Warlock.

That's because it would be new. That's it. People who are interested in tanking are interested in tanking because of the specific type playstyle. Leading the way. Making locks tank so ppl who don't really want to tank can tank with something new is pretty weak.

[Deleted]

So I just popped into a Pinnacle of Storms on LFR when I noticed there was one tank and a pair of mobs separating us from Lei Shen. What do I do? Switch out my specs a bit on my Demonology Warlock and give them a hand. The other tank agreed and we pulled. I did what I could to keep her protected with Fury Ward on the Thunder Lord while the other tank kept the Lightning Guardian at bay. In the end, we were able to successfully down both mobs. And great timing, the new tank comes on in.

Seriously. I really think Blizzard needs to take Warlock Tanking seriously and implement it as a legit tanking spec for a future patch/expansion.

From my personal point of view, I would vote to return shaman tanking rather than lock. If Worlocks could tanking then they should also do the hunter.