Garrosh isn't corrupted. He's in control. (confirmed)

[Airwaves]

Holy shit. Blizzard tells you to your face that his not and people still argue that he is... I swear.

[Resentful]

Holy shit. Blizzard tells you to your face that his not and people still argue that he is... I swear.

That's the best part about it It's what makes this thread so entertaining.

[Sesto]

He embodies each of the sha's vices (hatred, fear, anger, doubt, pride, etc.) better than anyone else on Azeroth. Maybe there's just no need to corrupt a guy like that.

Doubt? Fear? I suppose it's arguable that he might have those emotions, but to say that he embodies them when he hasn't shown any signs of doubt or fear is going a bit far.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Yes, and Arthas USED Frostmourne. This is no different, well, except that it looks ten times dumber and involves a character who's ten times dumber than he looks.

The fact that you have any faith at all in Blizzard's writing team is what's really sad. They have never shown themselves to be creative or interesting writers. At best, they take tired old tropes and literally -- literally -- just reverse them and then try to present that as new and awesome. Their drow are the nature-loving tree-dwellers while their high elves are the wicked arcanists. Oooh! Edgy and amazing!

What's more, their track record in WoW speaks for itself. Practically every single major threat they introduce to this insipidly-written game has either 1) been corrupted or 2) was the one corrupting. If it wasn't wretched, boring, little sap like Arthas or Illidian, it was some asinine old god or demon with about as much depth as a strand of hair.

So why should anyone think otherwise? Why should anyone listen to anything a Blizzard employee has to say when they constantly lie out their asses?

They don't lie out of their asses and comparing Garrosh to Arthas is dumb. Garrosh doesn't lose his soul. He has his soul. Arthas lost it thus his humanity and whatever left of his values. Arthas get's a little lucky. Garrosh isn't.

[zhero]

You can be corrupted and in control.

Neither mean that the old god isn't using him.

[Trassk]

I'm very pleased they kept this to what they promised, that he wouldn't be manipulated by outside forces, that everything he's done is because of his own actions, and that he is just a bad orc.

And it is amusing to see his fans still try and deny this to the bitter end.

My argument is, as I've just said, what people don't want to accept is, though all this, since his introduction into wow in TBC, Garrosh has and always will be a malleable character with a weak inner core, someone who easily gives into the worst parts of ourselves, which is what lead to his undoing.

People have shown, how little they understand character depth in this. They literally took the outer bravado of this character and saw only that, not seeing there weak character under it all.

And that is why its now a massive surprise to them, when Garrosh follows a path of evil and self destruction, because that is what all weak willed people do.

[Wildmoon]

You can be corrupted and in control.

Neither mean that the old god isn't using him.

The old god you are talking about is dead. Old Gods could die just like anyone. It's just that their death cause bad things.

[Trassk]

Doubt? Fear? I suppose it's arguable that he might have those emotions, but to say that he embodies them when he hasn't shown any signs of doubt or fear is going a bit far.

doubt - his self doubt about if he's following his daddies footsteps.
fear - fear of either not holding up to his fathers mantle or following the same path his father did
anger - obvious, he's angry at everything
despair - we first meet him living in despair in nagrand
hate - he hates anyone who isn't an orc
violence - he wants to fight even without reason or cause, he just wants any excuse
pride - self forfilling and believing he now lives up to his fathers legacy.

Garrosh is every vice you can imagine, and that reason, he's the perfect host for Y'Shaarj's power.

[Bullettime]

They don't lie out of their asses and comparing Garrosh to Arthas is dumb. Garrosh doesn't lose his soul. He has his soul. Arthas lost it thus his humanity and whatever left of his values. Arthas get's a little lucky. Garrosh isn't.

Yup. Garrosh is more similar to Gul'dan than any of the other baddies.

[Deleted]

And that is why its now a massive surprise to them, when Garrosh follows a path of evil and self destruction, because that is what all weak willed people do.

While I agree with you about the idea of Garrosh being weak inside, I'm not exactly sure Blizzard initially intented to make Garrosh the villain he now is.

Initialy, he wasn't that bad, he even did some good. His path took such a drastic and sloppy turn that it's hard to believe it was planned from the beginning.

Even though I have to face and accept the reality, I still blame Blizzard and the community that influenced them for this weird development.

[Sesto]

doubt - his self doubt about if he's following his daddies footsteps.
fear - fear of either not holding up to his fathers mantle or following the same path his father did
anger - obvious, he's angry at everything
despair - we first meet him living in despair in nagrand
hate - he hates anyone who isn't an orc
violence - he wants to fight even without reason or cause, he just wants any excuse
pride - self forfilling and believing he now lives up to his fathers legacy.

Garrosh is every vice you can imagine, and that reason, he's the perfect host for Y'Shaarj's power.

This is only guessing though. We don't see fear or doubt anywhere, and he has no reason to despair anymore. Like I said, it is arguable that he has these vices, but to say for a fact (without actual proof) is just dumb.

[Deleted]

I don't see the problem.
Kosak say that he's using the Sha, not directly the Old God, even if the Sha are a manifestation of it.

Think about that the last Sha that has been freed is the Sha of Pride and Garrosh has an humongous ego and pride about Orcs and himself, the Sha tend to amplify the emotions that are already within the host persons.

Also there's a difference and is that Pride is a very "rational" emotion.

Anger, Violence, Fear, Despair, Doubt that are represented are not. When peoples are affected by those Sha they become irrational tending toward those emotion violence and anger provoke aggresstion. Despair and doubt cause depression, lose the will to live and become suicidal.

Pride is easy to rationalize ("I'm doing the right thing", "I'm doing it for my people", "I will not let my people starve into the desert no matter the cost") and it makes you easily blind to the truth and that's exactly why Pride it is so dangerous, so subtle.

Garrosh will be in control the whole time because he already is egotistical and prideful and what's worst he already has perfectly rationalized everything. He's doing the "right thing" in his mind the Sha or the old god have no "need" to corrupt him, they will glad fully lend their power.

[Trassk]

While I agree with you about the idea of Garrosh being weak inside, I'm not exactly sure Blizzard initially intented to make Garrosh the villain he now is.

Initialy, he wasn't that bad, he even did some good. His path took such a drastic and sloppy turn that it's hard to believe it was planned from the beginning.

Even though I have to face and accept the reality, I still blame Blizzard and the community that influenced them for this weird development.

But thats the point of pride, and what Shao hao taught.

Garrosh, as it began, was nothing, a weak willed simpering man child with no direction. He never developed anything at his core because he was always living in the shadow of his father.

No he didn't start evil, but really, neither do the psychopaths you read about in the news, they all begin as people with weak personalities that give into vices and eventually do horrible things.

[Deleted]

Doubt? Fear? I suppose it's arguable that he might have those emotions, but to say that he embodies them when he hasn't shown any signs of doubt or fear is going a bit far.

It's related to his father.

[Deleted]

Another example of "corrupted person" that simply got more power is Cho'Gal.

Cho'Gal was schizophrenic and mad, but *he was* in control.
C'thun simply lend him some powers, with old god powers comes mutations but Cho'Gal was not corrupted he was already mad and he already was worshipping C'thun of its own will. No need to corrupt him.

C'thun: Hey Cho? what about a bit of enanchement?
Cho'Gal: I don't see why not
C'thun: you will get a bit of mutation is that ok?
Cho'Gal: I'm already ugly as sin, carry on.

[Mormolyce]

It's ridiculous that this was even a heated political issue on the forums.

I want you to look at that eyeball-corruption ridden model that was on the front page and tell me Garrosh will be in full control of himself at that point.

I didn't realise being covered in blue goo makes you mind controlled.

P.S. Y'Shaarj is dead. Dead dead dead dead dead.

[Deleted]

It's related to his father.

Doubts and fear about his father have been erased when Thrall showed him how Grom freed the Orcs. From that moment on those emotion have been exchanged with pride. At that point Garrosh understood that the father repented for his sins, and he became a hero in his eyes no more the guy that damned them

---------- Post added 2013-06-18 at 01:54 AM ----------

P.S. Y'Shaarj is dead. Dead dead dead dead dead.

By canon is impossible to actually make an old god dead dead dead unless you want to also make the planet go boom. That's the reason they got imprisoned.

[furriusmurrius]

I know when I use hammers I fuse them into my shoulders and skin and allow them to rip eyeball holes in my discolored flesh.

[Sesto]

By canon is impossible to actually make an old god dead dead dead unless you want to also make the planet go boom. That's the reason they got imprisoned.

I really hate it when people state fan theories as canon.

[KrakHed]

A while ago, it was discussed with the devs and christie golden, after she wrote Tides of War, the difference between someone like Jaina and someone like Garrosh, in that at her core, Jaina was a strong, solid person despite the horrors she endured, where as Garrosh at his core as a very weak, malleable person.

Perhaps this is whats reflected in this current situation, that at his core, Garrosh is so weak and malleable at his center, its easy for old god corruption to take control of him, having him think he's in control of it.

Well, my idea is that the Old God corruption isn't taking hold of him, but he is an ideal host for its power because the Heart finds him emotionally appealing.

It likes him for his personality, not for any intellectual reasons. Because it's a Heart.