Is mists of pandaria the greatest raiding expansion ever released?

[lordjust]

How on earth was wotlk great for raiding?
Ulduar and ICC, sure. But you also had Naxx reused, and TotC.. the worst and most unimaginitive multiple boss raid in the game.

I think for a lot of people it isn't about how good the encounters are or how the raid was designed but more about how they experienced raiding and WotLK was the most pleasing experience for most people.

Vanilla was OK. Very simple fights and the real problem was just to get the right gear with the right resistances for enough people and get enough people. BC was good but again encounters were simple and only some encounters stand out.

WotLK was special because you had both, 10 and 25 man difficulty with 10 man being significantly easier than 25 man. That allowed you to pug 10 man raids and everyone could start raiding 10 man. I remember how tradechat was flooded with people looking for raids and it took 10 minutes at most to find a group. Back then it was harder to find a dungeon group.

Cata was OK but with it destroyed pug raids and with MoP and LFR it's the same. Sure the encounters in Cata and MoP are better and all but raids in general are less accessible to people as back in WotLK because you need more time to find a group via LFR.

[Keoren]

If 5.4 delivers, Mists of Pandaria will have been the most consistent raiding expansion as far as the quality is concerned. It easily competes for the position of the best raiding expansion. I don't have many complaints outside of the raiding metagame. The heroic content has been very good for the most part.

Of course, all this is partially affected by the type of raiding a person enjoys. The 10-man model in Wrath of the Lich King, for example, offered a model that isn't readily available anymore.

[mistahwilshire]

Yes. By far better raiding than Wraths nonsense.

[Deleted]

So far, yes. Tier 14 was fun and diverse and I have no problem seeing MSV as a raid that will be remembered as an example of what a great raid should be. Throne of thunder, apart from its linear boss sequence, has a lot of variety and smart encounter design throughout the whole thing.

Make SoO good and we have the winning expansion in terms of raiding. People can hate all they want now Mists will be remembered as awesomesauce in a few years.

[Varyk]

Wrath was the golden age imo. MoP is probably 2nd.

Vanilla is definitely the worst, raiding in general just improved every expansion.

[Deleted]

All answers in this thread are based off nostalgia, when you had the best time raiding.

Every time I enter a TBC raid for some reason or another, all I think is that "I'm glad I wasn't around for this, the artwork is hideous". That's just me.

[Snowcharm]

Wrath is king because you could of found a PUG @ anytime and non-shared lockouts and lore and Hard Mode Toggles (Ulduar).

MoP & Cata got LFR (Cata at end of xpac) and it's gonna bloat even more because of Flexi raids.

So nope MoP is not the greatest. It might be good but it doesn't hold a candle to Wrath.

[Solidsteel]

Tier 14 flat out blew in my opinion. MSV was average at best, ToES was aesthetically pleasing but I found the fights to be terribly boring. Lei Shi has to be in the running for worst boss in WoW. HoF was absolutely awful. I do like ToT and depending on how SoO is I think MoP could be anywhere from second to fourth when it comes to raiding expansions behind WotLK raiding which was amazing. This is all subjective of course.

[Cebel]

Tier 14 was mediocre at best, and Tier 15 is one ofthe worst raids, made to date.. Unless SoO is truely epic, which Blizzard promised for Tier 15 but didn't deliver, then MoP is worse raiding-wise than WotLK and Cata combined..

Raiding-wise, there have been nothing close to TBC....

What kind of crack pipe are you smoking? Coming from somebody who achieved a world 3rd kill on heroic sha of fear, and US 5th kill on Heroic Lei shen, this expansion as far as raiding goes, as been the best expansion as a whole. Was tier 11 better? Sure. Was Ulduar better? Absolutely. But not by a large enough margin to carry their respective expansions. If SoO is just as strong as ToT and Tier 14, this will by far and away be the most consistently good raiding expansion to date. The only thing dragging MoP down in my eyes, has been the pvp imbalances, and Charms of Good Fortune ( because they force players to do dailies/grind mobs, lets not kid ourselves, it is mandatory for anyone who wants to min/max, as if you dont do it you're essentially leaving 3 bosses alive every week. )

[FuxieDK]

What kind of crack pipe are you smoking? Coming from somebody who achieved a world 3rd kill on heroic sha of fear, and US 5th kill on Heroic Lei shen, this expansion as far as raiding goes, as been the best expansion as a whole. Was tier 11 better? Sure. Was Ulduar better? Absolutely. But not by a large enough margin to carry their respective expansions. If SoO is just as strong as ToT and Tier 14, this will by far and away be the most consistently good raiding expansion to date. The only thing dragging MoP down in my eyes, has been the pvp imbalances, and Charms of Good Fortune ( because they force players to do dailies/grind mobs, lets not kid ourselves, it is mandatory for anyone who wants to min/max, as if you dont do it you're essentially leaving 3 bosses alive every week. )

Bragging about your race for world firsts, doesn't make your oppinion any more valid..
If anything, it only makes it more pathetic, that you need to bring it into the discussion..

Entire Cata raid scene was better than Mop.. Yes, they lasted a bit too long, but they were better raids..
Ulduar and ICC was better than MoP raids..
Kara, SCC, BfMH, TK:Eye, BT and SWP was better than MoP..

What is left, which is worse than MoP? ToC for sure... Parts of Vanilla... Not much else..

[Giants41]

Wrath. Nothing will ever compare in my eyes

[Cebel]

Bragging about your race for world firsts, doesn't make your oppinion any more valid..
If anything, it only makes it more pathetic, that you need to bring it into the discussion..

Except it does make my argument more valid, because I've actually seen all the content, unlike many players on these forums. Saying that it brings nothing but patheticness to the topic is simply making you look more uneducated. Explain to me how seeing the most difficult form of this expansions raid content, at an extremely high level, NOT make my opinion more validated than someone who hasnt seen all the content, or has done it on a watered down, afk ridden, joke fest like LFR?

[mistahwilshire]

I guess people liked Wrath raiding so much because it was super piss easy and everyone cleared at least Normal everything.

Wrath raiding sucked with the only exception being hard-mode Ulduar. Even Normal Ulduar was lame.

MoP on the other hand has been amazing all around with the exception of about half of HoF.

[FuxieDK]

Except it does make my argument more valid, because I've actually seen all the content, unlike many players on these forums. Saying that it brings nothing but patheticness to the topic is simply making you look more like an uneducated clown show.

Go back to LFR. (inb4 banned)

World First raiders is a group of LESS THAN 0,1% of players.. Thus, your oppinion falls in the insignifigant category..
Consider yourself a glorified beta tester, if you want... But World Firsts's oppinion have no merrit for anyone except fanbois..

Blizzard take feedback from World Firsts regarding TUNING only, but not content..

[Vargur]

I loved Firelands, would've loved Ulduar and possibly a bunch of TBC smaller raids.
What I hated so far in MoP is all of HoF (especially HC/N Amber Shaper due to constructs) and HC Will.
Throne of Thunder is up there with the best of them, albeit Tortos sucks.

[anaxie]

From someone with some actual imput that matters on raiding. Having cleared all of TBC - Current. If they don't fuck up the Org raid it's going to just barely edge past TBC as the best raiding expereience this game has ever had. If you aren't capable of clearing hardmodes your opinions may vary. My only gripe is Thunderforge is annoying as hell and should be scrapped.

Guess I'll get thrown in same boat as Pixul but if you think T14 and T15 weren't excellent tiers hitting a sweet spot of Quantity and Quality i Have no idea what you are expecting.

As far as raiding goes
MoP 43 HEROIC raiding bosses and after timeless isle launches there will be TEN world bosses.
Cata 28 HEROIC raiding bosses
Wrath? If you count ONLY heroic bosses you have like 30. And only those 30 matter because lets be honest. Nobody was wiping to naxx bosses or the Non heroic Ulduar filler bosses.
TBC? Lots of raid content but this is when raiding was exclusive and it was a good thing. 5 man's were alot more enjoyable as a group experience back then as opposed to a chore.

Who is to say we won't see a special 5.5 mini bridge raid either? we have a long way till blizzcon and beta still takes a couple months. MoP just keeps getting better and better.

[Deleted]

Agreed. HoF did have some boring fights. But the klaxxi are generally so cool it doesn't even matter ^^'

[Cebel]

Bragging about your race for world firsts, doesn't make your oppinion any more valid..
If anything, it only makes it more pathetic, that you need to bring it into the discussion..

Entire Cata raid scene was better than Mop.. Yes, they lasted a bit too long, but they were better raids..
Ulduar and ICC was better than MoP raids..
Kara, SCC, BfMH, TK:Eye, BT and SWP was better than MoP..

What is left, which is worse than MoP? ToC for sure... Parts of Vanilla... Not much else..

Yes BC was good, but you're forgetting the absolute massive bugfest that was every raid upon its launch, thats why it ranks as the 2nd best expansion in my eyes.

How the hell can you even say cata raids were better? Outside of tier 11, firelands and dragon soul were awful.

Firelands - AKA 3 good fights: Baleroc, Major Domo, and Ragnaros ( heroic version only mind you ), oh and alyzrasor IF you were a fire mage.

Dragon soul - The "Fly south, to go back in time, to the present, up north" raid. Where the entire environment of the raid was rehashed, the bosses were unoriginal, boring, and consisted of rehashed boss models. Not to mention that spine of deathwing was literally the worst fight ever designed for the world of warcraft, followed by the 2nd worst designed fight ever in madness of deathwing. Then add ontop of that the year long wait to MOP that made it even more unenjoyable. ( Keep in mind Im not even including ultraxion trash in this description ). This raid is in many peoples eyes the biggest let down, and piece of shit raid to ever grace the game ( even worse than naxx 25/10, and TOGC ).

[threads]

MoP - good raids bad implementation. 3 difficulties, brick walls on the first or second boss killed a lot of interest for guilds.

Wrath remains the best in my opinion.

[Deleted]

World First raiders is a group of LESS THAN 0,1% of players.. Thus, your oppinion falls in the insignifigant category..
Consider yourself a glorified beta tester, if you want... But World Firsts's oppinion have no merrit for anyone except fanbois..

Blizzard take feedback from World Firsts regarding TUNING only, but not content..

TBH, I've noticed most of the serious raiders share his opinion; ulduar, T11, MoP as far as the best raids in wow goes.