[5.4 Guide] Arms PVE

[galvin]

That's the problem I was having Mortalomena. Was trying to make use of slam, sweeping strikes and CS. But was so raged starved. I should of stuck with OP probably would of done better on galakras. I don't have t16 tpc.

[Bigbazz]

2 set will fix it, you wont always just be able to endless spam, but for example I'm using 2set (normal legs, LFR chest) with a 510 weapon and average ilvl 521 non optimised gear, pulled 380k dps on Tortos LFR last night. Now I'm not saying this as some kind of bragging as I'm sure someone will come along and double it or something.

But puts it into perspective how strong the 2 set is, top 3 attacks were Deep Wounds > Slam > Bladestorm. With colossus smash up and the 2 set you're really taking the rage strain off your char, it isn't complete spamage but it feels like it opens it up to being a much more realistic playstyle than trying to do it without the 2set.

It's all about the 2 set, it really is that good.

[Darkfriend]

You guys getting ragestarved in continuous cleave/AoE fights? Keeping SS up coupled with Slamspam really drains my rage Dont have the new 2set bonus but have the old one.

They really should make Overpower consume no rage as it feels superstupid to just stand there autoattacking with OP charges up.. Just cant use them cause its better used for Slams.

2p is absolutely huge for arms AoE.

[Toiran]

When playing Arms, I place my face on the keyboard and roll. AmIdoingthisright?

Yup, I pressed Bladestorm last night and did 1 Million DPS:
http://i.imgur.com/I6q2TXA.jpg
(Alright, I took the SS right after it had hit 1 Million and it popped down to 995K DPS, ssshhh)

Seriously, AoE is just ridiculous.

Single target is far more interesting because it's not as mind numbing, I've played Fury for the last X amount of years as a high end raider and only went "casual" Arms on my return to WoW during MoP, which was a week and a half ago...I got bored with the changes to Fury, went arms, haven't looked back, I'm only at ilevel 506 since I only started again a week ago so my dps isn't great yet, but it's competitive enough to be in the top 5, usually top 3 on every LFR i've done thus far.

Rage gain can suck though, mainly why I didn't stay Fury, no rage no fun no big numbers.

I do have a question for everyone though, what do you personally weigh more on in prio after the standards, haste or mastery? They have a 0.01 stat weight difference and I was wondering if people stick to that and go mastery above haste still, or if they go haste and leave mastery and go on.

Personally for me it's everything for crit, when it can't be crit, it's mastery then haste sort of left out at the bottom of the barrel. (Obviously being hit and expertise capped)

One more thing, every warrior I have come across in LFR, has been Arms, these weren't the case of what it used to be when Arms was less viable - some pvp guy in pvp gear, they were fully pve, decent players, where as according to everything, fury should be ontop, yet from what I've seen, and from playing both, Arms at my stage at least, is far ahead of Fury.

[Bigbazz]

Yup, I pressed Bladestorm last night and did 1 Million DPS:
http://i.imgur.com/I6q2TXA.jpg
(Alright, I took the SS right after it had hit 1 Million and it popped down to 995K DPS, ssshhh)

Seriously, AoE is just ridiculous.

Single target is far more interesting because it's not as mind numbing, I've played Fury for the last X amount of years as a high end raider and only went "casual" Arms on my return to WoW during MoP, which was a week and a half ago...I got bored with the changes to Fury, went arms, haven't looked back, I'm only at ilevel 506 since I only started again a week ago so my dps isn't great yet, but it's competitive enough to be in the top 5, usually top 3 on every LFR i've done thus far.

Rage gain can suck though, mainly why I didn't stay Fury, no rage no fun no big numbers.

I do have a question for everyone though, what do you personally weigh more on in prio after the standards, haste or mastery? They have a 0.01 stat weight difference and I was wondering if people stick to that and go mastery above haste still, or if they go haste and leave mastery and go on.

Personally for me it's everything for crit, when it can't be crit, it's mastery then haste sort of left out at the bottom of the barrel. (Obviously being hit and expertise capped)

One more thing, every warrior I have come across in LFR, has been Arms, these weren't the case of what it used to be when Arms was less viable - some pvp guy in pvp gear, they were fully pve, decent players, where as according to everything, fury should be ontop, yet from what I've seen, and from playing both, Arms at my stage at least, is far ahead of Fury.

I'd say it's because

1. Arms AOE is amazing and there are plenty of cleave/aoe fights, even if you play bad you will do awesome dps, even if you just thunderclap spam and no other abilities you will still do good AOE dps from deep wounds and the massive TC crits.

2. Arms is better single target in low end gear, you don't have the frustrations of waiting on enrage procs from crits, it doesnt matter that your gear is weak and your crit is low. I'm guessing people gave it a try to check the buffs and found that it was more enjoyable to play, less frustrating. The RNG factor (sudden death) is not nearly as gamebreakingly frustrating when it doesn't proc.


At LFR playing Arms is just better, most people who have the gear to for Fury to be worth playing are not running LFR.

[Deleted]

That's a very nicely presented guide, thanks!

I confess, though, I don't understand it: the distinction between inside CS and outside CS rotations. I only have arms as a soloing spec on a somewhat neglected tank alt, so I am probably missing something completely obvious. Can you explain it in simple terms please? I was thinking that since CS is top priority in the outside of CS priority queue, using it would immediately put you into the inside CS queue. Thus I can't understand why the queues are different. Help, please!

[Archimtiros]

Is it misleading? Maybe I'll see if I can re-write it and make it more distinct, sorry. CS is always your top priority. Generally speaking, the only time you want to delay CS is when you are:

A) Using Thunderclap to apply multi target Deep Wounds
B) Completely out of rage and want to Mortal Strike before the CS for rage

So you do want to have the CS debuff up as much as possible. While it is up; you want to follow the first rotation which is (without the 2 set bonus) Slam and Mortal Strike as much as possible.
When CS is not active, and you can't put it back up you want to maintain rage by only using Mortal Strike and Overpowers. The Overpowers are cheap, make your MS come off CD faster, and will give you a decent chance to proc another CS reset. Slam should only be used when rage capping.

When you have the 2p, there is an alternate rotation, which I need to re-write since the current listed one is out of date. I'll do that today I promise!

- - - Updated - - -

Guide is updated for the 2p rotation (see advanced section near the bottom). I'll get a new picture up tonight. Still looking for a way to pretty the guide up a bit more and make it easier to navigate, but let me know if anyone has issues understanding anything and I'll try to clear it up.

[Woodgnome]

Didn't Collision determine that OP beats Slam outside of Recklessness already (due to it's DPR allowing more HS's to be used)?

[CollisionTD]

Didn't Collision determine that OP beats Slam outside of Recklessness already (due to it's DPR allowing more HS's to be used)?

Yeah, he just hadn't updated the guide for it.

[Deleted]

Even inside CS?

[Archimtiros]

Read the guide. Updated it for a reason.

Also, I don't make updates as soon as something is found, whether by Collision or others. Firstly, we have a history of making quick assumptions and later determining that it was wrong. Secondly, I like to take a bit of time for myself and others to test things to be sure. SimC is a program and a useful one but it still doesn't give the input and feedback that a live player can. This helps me write in a way that beginners and less advanced players can hopefully understand. We have a very good group of Warriors that test information and ideas, that work in conjunction with all of Collisions outstanding mathematics to bring you the best, most accurate information possible.

[Deleted]

Regarding the 2-peice rotation, what sort of DPS gains are we talking about percentage wise?

[CollisionTD]

Regarding the 2-peice rotation, what sort of DPS gains are we talking about percentage wise?

1-2%, it's extremely minor.

[Deleted]

According to GC (and obviously twitter) people would kill for 1-2% dps gains!

[Angelicat]

Hey guys, I just picked up an evil eye of galakras. I'm currently using the brutal talisman of the shado-pan assault and heroic ji-kun's feather. Which one should I replace? It seems obvious but just thought I would ask. I am a little over hit cap if it matters.

[Jakesterwars]

Talisman is the choice to swap with. Feather is really good right now with the change that happened for 5.4.

[Angelicat]

Talisman is the choice to swap with. Feather is really good right now with the change that happened for 5.4.

Oh really? I thought it was worse because my main is a caster, and when they did that to breath of the hydra, it became one of the worse trinkets we could get. Good to know, thanks.

Kind of related question, but does that mean feather is better than most trinkets in SoO?

[Woodgnome]

Read the guide. Updated it for a reason.

Also, I don't make updates as soon as something is found, whether by Collision or others. Firstly, we have a history of making quick assumptions and later determining that it was wrong. Secondly, I like to take a bit of time for myself and others to test things to be sure. SimC is a program and a useful one but it still doesn't give the input and feedback that a live player can. This helps me write in a way that beginners and less advanced players can hopefully understand. We have a very good group of Warriors that test information and ideas, that work in conjunction with all of Collisions outstanding mathematics to bring you the best, most accurate information possible.

Fair enough, was just wondering.

[Jakesterwars]

Oh really? I thought it was worse because my main is a caster, and when they did that to breath of the hydra, it became one of the worse trinkets we could get. Good to know, thanks.

Kind of related question, but does that mean feather is better than most trinkets in SoO?

Compared to the two trinkets you currently have, yes. Feather is better than most trinkets until around normal Eye/Thok's Tail. Skeer's trinket has been messed around with and I only saw it a slight gain on single target fights replacing Gaze HTF. Of course I'm taking data from another warrior for the Skeer trinket.

Ultimately, you'll be going for Thok/Eye for the most part at end level gear. Fusion core is good for multi-target fights with consistent adds in range and up for long periods of time. I'll be using Feather until I get rid of my Gaze and another trinket drops.

-Edit-

Dealing with LFR trinkets obviously it is a toss up because I don't run LFR to really care for those trinkets. Flex trinkets will be easily swapped over too because of the item upgrades boosting it up to 548.

[Angelicat]

Sorry if this is a noob question (last one, I promise!) but I tried searching the guide and didn't see it.

In an unlimited rage situation outside of CS, should I just be spamming slam and ignoring MS for enrage procs or should I stick with the normal rotation and just spam HS with it? This is assuming that I can slam indefinitely and HS more often than not (I.E. zerker stance on thok's p1 when he's spamming screeches)