Ukraine

[Deleted]

Can you give substantial proof that this is what the majority of the country wants?

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You mean, the people who blasted a well known public figure (not an official, but a celebrity) with a fire extinguisher for voicing his thoughts that violent clashes were not the right way to bring about change? Your freedom loving rebels would have made Robespierre proud.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...ines-protests/

"But a November poll found slightly different attitudes: 45 percent said they wanted the EU deal, 14 percent said they wanted to join with the Russian-led trade union, and 41 percent said they were undecided or wanted neither. In other words, joining the EU is about as popular as not joining the EU, both of which are more popular than snuggling up to Moscow."

[ToxTheWrecker]

I felt so bad for the two Officers getting hit in the head with a firehouse end. They didn't even retaliate. :C

[Deleted]

Can you give substantial proof that this is what the majority of the country wants?

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You mean, the people who blasted a well known public figure (not an official, but a celebrity) with a fire extinguisher for voicing his thoughts that violent clashes were not the right way to bring about change? Your freedom loving rebels would have made Robespierre proud.

One again, sometimes blood must be shed. This guy was preaching, "peace", after multiple protesters were killed for peacefully protesting.

P.S. when I say opposition, I mean the people opposed to the current Government in general.

[Kasierith]

I felt so bad for the two Officers getting hit in the head with a firehouse end. They didn't even retaliate. :C

If the police officers dare to defend themselves, the chances of being killed will increase significantly. It's pretty standard riot control; either defend yourself through nonlethal means, or don't defend yourself at all, otherwise it will turn from injuries to a bloodbath.

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One again, sometimes blood must be shed. This guy was preaching, "peace", after multiple protesters were killed for peacefully protesting.

P.S. when I say opposition, I mean the people opposed to the current Government in general.

Yes.... they hurt their own side because they don't agree with their violent methods. If you don't see how that is messed up, I don't know what to say; a revolution born in blood and not ideals is going to brew nothing but bloodshed.

[ToxTheWrecker]

If the police officers dare to defend themselves, the chances of being killed will increase significantly. It's pretty standard riot control; either defend yourself through nonlethal means, or don't defend yourself at all, otherwise it will turn from injuries to a bloodbath.

I realize that. It's some quality control to hold yourself back during those attacks. Firehose would definitely be on the list of retaliatory responses.

[Deleted]

If the police officers dare to defend themselves, the chances of being killed will increase significantly. It's pretty standard riot control; either defend yourself through nonlethal means, or don't defend yourself at all, otherwise it will turn from injuries to a bloodbath.

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Yes.... they hurt their own side because they don't agree with their violent methods. If you don't see how that is messed up, I don't know what to say; a revolution born in blood and not ideals is going to brew nothing but bloodshed.

I didn't agree with attacking the guy, but you have to pretty naive if you believe these protests would still be happening "peacefully."

Btw, this wasn't born in blood. It was born as a peaceful protest that was against the President's choice to side with Russia.

[Kasierith]

I didn't agree with attacking the guy, but you have to pretty naive if you believe these protests would still be happening "peacefully."

Btw, this wasn't born in blood. It was born as a peaceful protest that was against the President's choice to side with Russia.

And it should have stayed that way. Once a group of rioters starts attacking their own members for daring to be peaceful, there isn't really a peaceful resolution that can come from it.

[Deleted]

And it should have stayed that way. Once a group of rioters starts attacking their own members for daring to be peaceful, there isn't really a peaceful resolution that can come from it.

If they tried to remain peaceful, there would be no more protests. For fucks sake, the police were cracking down on them when it was peaceful. At the end of the day this will all end in peace, as all revolutions do.

[Cybran]

That poor defenseless riot police. What did they ever do to deserve being beaten by protesters. Maybe the 40 abducted people or the sniper cartridges found on top of governmental buildings?

[traen]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/kiev-b...191541233.html

Should the U.S. and the EU start doing massive sanctions against their Government? This shit is getting way out of hand.

You clearly don't understand what's going on there.

There is an angry mob that does not really know what they want.
There is VERY polite government that DOES NOT ALLOW POLICE TO INTERVENE! That's probably the most strange thing about it. The mob attacks, police can't do anything about it because they don't have the order to strike back. Encouraged mob attacks even harder.

The mob does not have a leader, they don't have any plan or any sanity in their actions. They just want to destroy and break everything. They are not actually going to rebuild something. They assume that after they force the current government to leave some great leader will miraculously appear out of nowhere and bring their country to prosperity. Also for some crazy reason they assume that we'll invite them to EU and that the only reason why they are still not in EU is because current government is oriented on alliance with russia.

But anyway, how would "massive sanctions" help to stop this crazy mob from destroying their capital?

[Tierbook]

Looks like Crimea wants to break away from Ukraine and either become its own country or join Russia

[Deleted]

You clearly don't understand what's going on there.

There is an angry mob that does not really know what they want.
There is VERY polite government that DOES NOT ALLOW POLICE TO INTERVENE! That's probably the most strange thing about it. The mob attacks, police can't do anything about it because they don't have the order to strike back. Encouraged mob attacks even harder.

The mob does not have a leader, they don't have any plan or any sanity in their actions. They just want to destroy and break everything. They are not actually going to rebuild something. They assume that after they force the current government to leave some great leader will miraculously appear out of nowhere and bring their country to prosperity. Also for some crazy reason they assume that we'll invite them to EU and that the only reason why they are still not in EU is because current government is oriented on alliance with russia.

But anyway, how would "massive sanctions" help to stop this crazy mob from destroying their capital?

Apparently you have no idea what you're talking about. The police killed three people that were peacefully protesting, and attacked many others. That is what has caused the people to rise up and shed blood.

The protesters are actually unified when comes to, "what they want". A new Constitution, Government, they don't want to be Russia's bitch, and they are sick of police brutality.

[Charge me Doctor]

Apparently you have no idea what you're talking about. The police killed three people that were peacefully protesting, and attacked many others. That is what has caused the people to rise up and shed blood.

Ok, lets just put an end to this bullshit. One side used home-made napalm, other side used fire arms, one side started tracking down families of other side, other side started kidnapping people from first side. It doesn't matter, these is no right and wrong guys, they all did horrible things, that's why it's called civil war. It's people who started this and people who suffer from it. People started it, people die because of it, who started first doesn't matter.

This whole situation is like rash on body, it will come off after a while, "перебесятся, и успокоются", Russia has it's economical and political interests in Ukraina, same does EU, that's why they invest money in Ukraina. The same way USA "wins" in economy from wars.
People who say that EU or Russia want Ukrainian production, well, i can't remember (after the end of USSR) anything except candies (yeah, they used to build rockets in USSR, but now this production does nothing in comparison to "back then" time). There is nothing to fight over. Ukrainian people mired in their own shit, due to their activity and/or inactivity.

And by the way, if you will find a picture with "14/88" or "1488" signs from Maidan, it's Nazis (can't quote but someone denied that they are there).

[Cybran]

This whole situation is like rash on body, it will come off after a while, "перебесятся, и успокоются",

http://www.dw.de/ukrainian-activists...ath/a-17388514

A photo that hangs near that sign offers a piece of evidence. A bearded man with clever eyes can be seen in it. Yuri Verbizky, a 50-year-old seismologist from the western Ukrainian city of Lviv, was found dead in a forest near Kyiv on January 22, 2014. His hands had been bound together with tape, and his corpse showed signs of torture.

That won't happen. The news just reported that there are 7 people killed with more and more bodies being found in the forest. The organizer of the "Automaidan" has been reported missing and the police has started a murder investigation.

[Tierbook]

There are rumors that 1400 Russian troops have arrived in Kiev to help the police

[Deleted]

the situation is a mess, its better that they resolve it internally
The people there elected a government, and that government doesnt want to join the EU - we are seeing the people who disagree with that, and are perhaps in the minority.

[Deleted]

I would be pretty pissed off if the "international white knight" came in France when we had riots everywhere.
Pretty sure the same applies to most countries that had trouble the last few years : it's their own battle to fight.

[Cybran]

I would be pretty pissed off if the "international white knight" came in France when we had riots everywhere.

Aren't there riots in France right now? Anti-abortion, anti-gay and anti-semites all rioting against Hollande? Who would want to support them?

[Tackhisis]

...the sniper cartridges found on top of governmental buildings?

Unused cartridges? :P

[Cybran]

Unused cartridges? :P

http://www.eurasiareview.com/2701201...es-south-east/

On January 26, protesters reported finding 7.62-caliber cartridges on the roof of Ukrainian House, a claim that would fuel speculation that police snipers have been involved in some protester deaths.

Human Rights Watch says it has recorded numerous instances of police beatings and kidnappings by unidentified assailants. Hundreds of protesters and journalists have been severely beaten or arrested in the past week, and a number remain missing, including the organizer of the Automaidan support network, Dmytro Bulatov, who has not been seen since January 23. Another opposition sympathizer, Yuriy Verbytsky, was found dead a day earlier after being abducted on January 21.

Other news stations report of a nurse that was hit in the leg by live munition and other medical personel being targeted by police.