Preventing PvP on a PvE Realm: No More "Accidental" Flagging

[Redpanda]

whats sad is when people see someone else getting ganked on the isle people will just ride past and not even help the person or try and kill the ganker. Countless times ive been farming coins and ill be in a popular path where people go and ill be killing someone and 5, 6, 7 people will run by and not even touch me. Kinda sad you pve realm kids are so soft. I enjoy going to realms like that because I can usually let my friend go about his way and I can go farm coins solo.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

And they're gone issue solved.

Until they come back to fight again and the cycle repeats all over.

[Deathgoose]

But defending your factions leaders isn't griefing, and I don't see how killing any NPC on the opposite faction is griefing. Sorry, but "slightly annoy people" =/= griefing.

I think he was referring to quest/vendor/AH/bank type NPC's. No one gives a shit if you kill the faction leaders and every guard in a capitol, but if you go into crossroads/goldshire/lowbie hub of your choice with your bored 5v5 arena team and kill every quest NPC that spawns just to fuck with lowbies on a PvE realm, when they rolled on that kind of realm SPECIFICALLY SO THEY DID NOT HAVE TO BE BOTHERED WITH WPVP, then the ones that are spawn camping are effectively griefing.

Quest/Vendor/Flight/etc NPCs should show as red but be untargettable on a PvE realm.
Guards/Faction leaders are fair game, because their death has little to no impact on unflagged players minding their own business.

[Jilor]

whats sad is when people see someone else getting ganked on the isle people will just ride past and not even help the person or try and kill the ganker. Countless times ive been farming coins and ill be in a popular path where people go and ill be killing someone and 5, 6, 7 people will run by and not even touch me. Kinda sad you pve realm kids are so soft. I enjoy going to realms like that because I can usually let my friend go about his way and I can go farm coins solo.

This is really true. I see people flagged for coins waiting for Huolon all the time on a pve server I play on with another 40-50 people around. One player will attack the flagged person and no one joins in to help out. But, that's their choice, on both ends. The coin farmer for baiting people in to the kills and the players who chose to skip out on pvp by going to a pve server. And nothing should force either one to change.

[Deathgoose]

whats sad is when people see someone else getting ganked on the isle people will just ride past and not even help the person or try and kill the ganker. Countless times ive been farming coins and ill be in a popular path where people go and ill be killing someone and 5, 6, 7 people will run by and not even touch me. Kinda sad you pve realm kids are so soft. I enjoy going to realms like that because I can usually let my friend go about his way and I can go farm coins solo.

You mean us pve realm kids that don't care about WPvP so we rolled on a realm that isn't dedicated to WPvP, and when we see WPvP happening, we ignore it as much as possible?

Mind = Blown

[DechCJC]

I'll never understand the issue. Even when leveling alts on high-pop pvp realms I rarely actually die; To accidentally flag yourself and die within those 5 minutes takes actual skill.

Immersion people, immersion; We're really starting to lose it, stop gettign rid of it.

Frankly, everyone that says they don't participate in PvP because 'they don't like it' just suggests to me that they're awful at it, sorry, but it does - Stop saying it. You sound like one of those guys that hates LotR and questions why it's so popular after watching 30 minutes of the first film. Not wanting to do bgs = Fine. Complaining that you die because YOU fucked up and got flagged and you were outplayed by the other person is just retarded (In fact, pve players even have the UPPER hand in world pvp, you REALLY have no excuse).

[rystrave]

I play on a PVE realm and, though I'm not a fan of PVP unless I que for it, the random surprise attacks from accidental flagging is kinda fun. I can seek out revenge and give them a taste of their own medicine, then go back to minding my own business. I would gladly partake in WPvP if it would happen more.

But during leveling though, it sucks, especially if your corpse is being camped.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I'll never understand the issue. Even when leveling alts on high-pop pvp realms I rarely actually die; To accidentally flag yourself and die within those 5 minutes takes actual skill.

Immersion people, immersion; We're really starting to lose it, stop gettign rid of it.

Frankly, everyone that says they don't participate in PvP because 'they don't like it' just suggests to me that they're awful at it, sorry, but it does - Stop saying it. You sound like one of those guys that hates LotR and questions why it's so good after watching 30 minute of the first film.

This isn't immersion. This isn't even close to fucking immersion so please. Don't make excuses.

[Deleted]

There was an youtube video of a lvl 60 Rogue flagged for PVP on a PVE realm (vanilla) using the furbolg disguise and pretend to be walking with the rest of the furbolgs in Winterspring to see if he would get attacked by a lvl 52 and it worked. Didn't laugh so hard in my life. Too bad I can't find the link.

[Azrile]

Besides smart healing, there were also a number of abilities that you can use to accidentely flag yourself.

It was obviously not working as intended because everyone knows there were a large number of players trying to trick other players into flagging. The purpose of PVE servers is that you consent to pvping, not get tricked into it.

Ironically, we are going to see a lot of crying come the other way when they implement this.. because just like they couldn´t find all the abilities that accidently flagged you, they sure as hell aren´t going to be able to find all the ways ´I´ as PVE player am able to help a PVP flagged player without becoming flagged myself.

In UO, we used to call it ´blue healers´.. There is no way they will allow direct healing of PVP flagged players, but something is going to slip by them.

[Azgraal]

I see the need to have NPCs for "For The Alliance/Horde" to be made killable, but flagging is not needed for that even. They would simply be Red to opposing factions (Guards and Kings only). Every other NPC should get the same setting as child characters in the game. Auctioneers, boatmen, vendors, etc. None of them should be killable, not on PvE realms.

That simply ridiculous! If you're going into your enemy's capital city to kill their leader, that IS a pvp event, event though the goal is a npc. You want to simply stroll down to the enemy city, and just push through npc? There's tier raids for that.

City raids are meant to be PVP content. If you get what you're whining for why stop there? Why not make battlegrounds against npcs only?

Geez these people... Look. I am a PVEer mainly, i barely done anything noteworthy on arenas and rated bgs (you can check my armory) but even I can see the sheer stupidity of what you're suggesting. Preventing people from being flagged for pvp accidently while questing is one thing. Now if you're invading, say, Orgrimmar, the Horde will defend itself, the Horde players will kill you and mock you. PVP will happen on a PVP event.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Easy fix: You cannot attack flagged players without manually flagging yourself.

Boom, no more instigators that will randomly flag and cause you to right click them.

[-Superman-]

But defending your factions leaders isn't griefing, and I don't see how killing any NPC on the opposite faction is griefing. Sorry, but "slightly annoy people" =/= griefing.

The griefing takes place in Moonglade, or BootyBay, or during some other world event where some dimwitted asshat flags himself and parks on an NPC. Yes, I know I can zoom in and walk through the mount. Yes, I know I can show friendly nameplates only. But why, on a PVE realm should I have to tolerate PvP shenanigans from bored little shitheads with nothing better to do before mom calls them for dinner? If it were a PVP realm, I would be told to STFU and reroll on PVE. So... since it is a PVE realm, they should STFU and reroll on PVP.

[Redpanda]

You mean us pve realm kids that don't care about WPvP so we rolled on a realm that isn't dedicated to WPvP, and when we see WPvP happening, we ignore it as much as possible?

Mind = Blown

no i mean youre so apathetic that even when you have a chance to stop someone from killing someone else ie me just a hunter that is on his own. you would rather ride of and give me the chance to get someone else because chances are if im censured and the heat is on and ive been killed twice ill go back to my home server.

[-Superman-]

Frankly, everyone that says they don't participate in PvP because 'they don't like it' just suggests to me that they're awful at it, sorry, but it does - Stop saying it.

Yes, and we rolled PVE for a reason. You wanna PvP? Take it to a PvP realm. If it was "PvP happened on a PvP server", you people would tell us to stop QQing and reroll on a PvE. Well, sounds like an entirely different group of people needs to reroll or pay to transfer.

[Vecroct]

I've followed this topic for a while now as I've spent countless hours with my family hanging out on Timeless trying to get our achievements completed. I've seen first hand people being flagged for PVP by surprise by greifers hiding on timeless rares. I've saw my wife using her abilities and never clicking on the flagged person become flagged at least six time solely by using her rogue abilities which aren't supposed to cause her to become flagged.

Examples like this abound:
"I accidentally got flagged yesterday on Timeless Isle, for the first time in years. I was just minding my own business, killing Dread Ship then after the fight I suddenly get Death Gripped by some dude that has 200k more hp than me. Not 100% sure how I got flagged. If I had to guess, I'd blame my Glyph of Mass Exorcism. Even though AoEs like Whirlwind and Blizzard aren't supposed to flag you, I think a chaining type AoE like Exorcism might."

At this point it's beyond ludicrous to think that Blizzard foolishly believes the story people like to say - "Well you must have done something to cause yourself to be flagged, play better". People who can be considered pro's at this game and never fall for those tricks, become flagged on timeless while killing rares easily and often. It's clear that the mechanics of the fighting with the ability for multiple players to tag rares on timeless likely has some bug there which contributes to certain abilities flagging people differently on timeless than in other zones.

So kudos to Blizzard for taking action and addressing this in the next expac, even if the company line to tow is there are no problems and the players need to learn to play better. If that is what Blizzard thinks, then I would suggest they actually try playing their own game a bit more as it's not difficult to see this situation in action on the Timeless Isle on a regular basis.

[Azrile]

Honestly, I have been playing on pve realms for years, despising pvp but never ever had a problem with "accidental flagging". It doesn't even happen in the first place if you are not an idiot. This issue is blown out of proportions.

It really depends on what spec you play. There are abilities sprinkled around many classes that if you use, it will ´smart´ heal or damage someone who is flagged. I know as a bear tank there is something in my normal rotation, maybe a proc or talent that ´smart´ flags me without me targeting the flagged player.

But that is just a side issue, the real issue is that there are players, as noted in this thread, who go out of their way to try to trick players into flagging. Those players do not want to be flagged, so Blizz needed this solution. If I am tanking Hulen, or a Celestial as a bear, and the only way I can ´not´ flag myself is to only Mangle, well then obviously it is broken.

[ringpriest]

More hand holding. Perhaps the game should be renamed World of Mutually Consensual Conflict-Craft.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

More hand holding. Perhaps the game should be renamed World of Mutually Consensual Conflict-Craft.

Hyperbole.

[Gangplank]

I've always been on PvP realms, but I'm quite surprised how much this seems to be an issue for people on a PvE realm. So you tagged someone, big deal? Yeah, I get it, you don't wanna fight someone. But at the worst, it means you're running back from the gy. What's the cooldown on being flagged? 5 minutes? Go make a sandwich.