The players are dumbing down the game more than blizzard

[Galluccio]

The players are dumbing down the game more than blizzard.

Don't know what to reforge? Click the button on Mr Robot and it's done for you.
Don't know what gems to use or what enchants to use? Got that fixed for ya. Mr. Robot has it done. And, it even shows you what materials to use.

Can't stay out of that fire? Guess what? There's an "app" for that. It will tell you to get out of the fire.
Don't know when to stop attacking during defensive stance. Well, if you hit the boss that app will tell you to stop.

Don't know the correct rotation? No need to think. Just go online and someone will walk you through it.

Same thing with boss strategy. No need to think about how to beat a boss. Just go online and watch a video or read someone's notes on how to beat a boss.

The players have dumbed this game down so far that you don't even need to think to play the game. And, people say blizzard dumbs down the game... people need to look in the mirror as a community.

[Arthas242]

<--- doesn't use add-ons

except for one and while it;s a unit frames mod, i only use it so i can see a 3D portraits! *i actually got so blizzards raid UI still works while the unit frames only work solo/target/5man party

and to be honest if character protraits were 3d in blizz ui i would be 100% blizz UI

<---haz green fire and normal mode garrosh

did i say that i also am a clicker?

and i think i have only used mr robot once, other wise always done it on my own except maybe reading what stats are the best on the wow forums

so we do not all dumb it down!

[HippopotamusMaximus]

I use raid mods like DBM to keep track of boss abilities, not doing so would be downright irresponsible as a good raider, otherwise I decide which gems I want to use and which enchants and reforging I want for my character, I get shit for it from the armory nazis on the official forums but I laugh at them and the fact that they don't understand the choices they make for their characters, they just do what some guy with spreadsheets tells them to.

If I could keep track in my head of 4-5 different boss ability timers I would, it's just that I can't.

[foxHeart]

<--- doesn't use add-ons

Addons give you more information so you can optimize your playstyle - they don't do things for you. Tracking CD's, buffs, and debuffs. You're gimping yourself.

did i say that i also am a clicker?

See above. Like keybinds are a crutch? lol

and i think i have only used mr robot once, other wise always done it on my own except maybe reading what stats are the best on the wow forums

So you fiddle around with stats and waste tons of gold reforging until you get it to your liking? Wasting gold and time.

so we do not all dumb it down!

Doesn't sound like you're dumbing things down, but doing things in an ignorant, sub-optimal way, tbh.

[Revi]

You clearly haven't done much raiding. Sure, you can look up how to reforge and gem, but all that does is save you the hassle of using a calculator. Reading about your rotation also doesn't help you actually play your class. It tells you the basics, but it's still up to you to maximize dps while coping with various boss mechanics, proccs and CDs. Most players know their rotation, yet there's a HUGE difference in performance among raiders.

Now.. Don't need to think about how to beat a boss? Looking up tactics isn't even CLOSE to actually executing them and handling the boss mechanics correctly, if it was all guilds would clear 14/14 heroic the instant the top guilds released kill videos. Guilds are STILL progressing through SoO, so that's clearly not the case.

Blizzard designs boss encounters with addons like Deadly Boss Modes in mind, they've stated this repeatedly. That's what they're balanced for. Sure it's completely doable without, but most people don't want to cripple themselves and their raid just to avoid dumbing down boss fights.

[Arthas242]

Addons give you more information so you can optimize your playstyle - they don't do things for you. Tracking CD's, buffs, and debuffs. You're gimping yourself.


See above. Like keybinds are a crutch? lol


So you fiddle around with stats and waste tons of gold reforging until you get it to your liking? Wasting gold and time.

Doesn't sound like you're dumbing things down, but doing things in an ignorant, sub-optimal way, tbh.

yeah cause i got green fire at a item lvl of 480 clicking, so i am so bad and sub optimal, i am still better then most people who use these add-ons. probably only people better then me is high end raiders/pvper's with more gear and time.

[Arthas242]

might i also add it's more fun then making a add on do all the work for you.


hell i remember telling a guild i had dbm (lied my way saying there end must be bugged when they said i didn't) to get in a raid and they were still died in the fire while i moved out without a add on telling me to move out.

[HippopotamusMaximus]

You clearly haven't done much raiding. Sure, you can look up how to reforge and gem, but all that does is save you the hassle of using a calculator. Reading about your rotation also doesn't help you actually play your class. It tells you the basics, but it's still up to you to maximize dps while coping with various boss mechanics, proccs and CDs. Most players know their rotation, yet there's a HUGE difference in performance among raiders.

Now.. Don't need to think about how to beat a boss? Looking up tactics isn't even CLOSE to actually executing them and handling the boss mechanics correctly, if it was all guilds would clear 14/14 heroic the instant the top guilds released kill videos. Guilds are STILL progressing through SoO, so that's clearly not the case.

Blizzard designs boss encounters with addons like Deadly Boss Modes in mind, they've stated this repeatedly. That's what they're balanced for. Sure it's completely doable without, but most people don't want to cripple themselves and their raid just to avoid dumbing down boss fights.

Raiding's easy as long as you have the gear for the tier you're on. I've been with guild runs who completed 2-3 boss kills on first night attempt and then with my main guild who would take 2 weeks just to kill the first boss, because stuff like "sorry guys, my old computer crashed, sorry guys, my cat jumped on my keyboard (for the millionth time), sorry guys, I wasn't paying attention, sorry guys, my kid was crying, sorry etc).

If you're with prepared, dedicated, well equipped people raiding's easy and straightforward, it just takes a few attempts to get used to the timers and such, if you're with people who don't take it seriously it *feels* difficult and challenging, but for someone whose done raids for 6-7 years...it's just all "do this, do that, repeat, special phase, do this, do that, repeat."

[Dhrizzle]

yeah cause i got green fire at a item lvl of 480 clicking, so i am so bad and sub optimal, i am still better then most people who use these add-ons. probably only people better then me is high end raiders/pvper's with more gear and time.

Yeah but if you played properly (i.e. the way other people have decided you should) you could have got more green fire. Twice.

[Darknessvamp]

yeah cause i got green fire at a item lvl of 480 clicking, so i am so bad and sub optimal, i am still better then most people who use these add-ons. probably only people better then me is high end raiders/pvper's with more gear and time.

Just a question of interest, when you say you're a 'clicker' do you mean you solely use the mouse when fighting in raids or do you play using the hybrid 1, 2 and 3 damage keys and mouse debuff/buff/targeting control? If the former, I feel sorry for your raid teams dps loss.

[Arthas242]

Yeah but if you played properly (i.e. the way other people have decided you should) you could have got more green fire. Twice.

except no need unless i did heroics, and well i do not do heroics as i do not find them fun, normal mode i do(yeah kor'kron wolf) but honestly flex is easier time wise still. heroics just take to much commitment

- - - Updated - - -

Just a question of interest, when you say you're a 'clicker' do you mean you solely use the mouse when fighting in raids or do you play using the hybrid 1, 2 and 3 damage keys and mouse debuff/buff/targeting control? If the former, I feel sorry for your raid teams dps loss.

i use the mouse alone and WASD *i turn with my mouse*

also i am usually number 1 or 2 dps unless someone over gears me a lot

people forget GCD is what makes this possible, if there was no GCD then yeah hotkeys would be better by a long shot

[Halicia]

might i also add it's more fun then making a add on do all the work for you.

not fun for the 24 other people carrying you though.

if its a solo activity, more power to you for enjoying the challenge...

but its like playing baseball with a blindfold on... maybe you'll hit the ball sometimes if you're pro, but you'll have more hits with the blindfold off... and you're just letting your team down by forcing them through a more challenging game then they signed up for.

[Caliph]

i entered a normal SoO run yesterday @ nazgrim. average ilvl for entry was like 555. We wiped on nazgrim with an average 555 ilvl with still 20% hp on naz and like 6 mobs running around. No one popped hero, melee were running around chasing mobs, some idiots kept on dpsing naz during def stance.

I didn't think it could get worse but there's always a new low. 555ivl and the raid failed. needless to say me and the other top dps left along with a healer who cursed people out for standing in the fire.

yeah the game will get dumber cuz the players are dumb.

[foxHeart]

yeah cause i got green fire at a item lvl of 480 clicking, so i am so bad and sub optimal, i am still better then most people who use these add-ons. probably only people better then me is high end raiders/pvper's with more gear and time.

You want a cookie? You clearly think using an ignorant and archaic playstyle is deserving of something.

[Arthas242]

not fun for the 24 other people carrying you though.

if its a solo activity, more power to you for enjoying the challenge...

but its like playing baseball with a blindfold on... maybe you'll hit the ball sometimes if you're pro, but you'll have more hits with the blindfold off... and you're just letting your team down by forcing them through a more challenging game then they signed up for.

i love how you assume i am being carried when i am usually the one carrying people unless they are heroic raiders

*or i am on a under geared alt* but strickly for my main i am still usually number 1 or 2 dps or course unless there's a guy decked out in heroic mode gear

[Arbiter]

might i also add it's more fun then making a add on do all the work for you.

It doesn't do the work for you. It allows you to time your abilities and cool downs better while being able to focus on the more important mechanics currently at play. I'm also assuming you solely DPS on any toon you play as in raids it's very important to have those addons as a Tank and even a healer.

i am still better then most people who use these add-ons..

LFR don't count.

except no need unless i did heroics, and well i do not do heroics as i do not find them fun, normal mode i do

So you don't like a challenge? When I go from heroic to normal I feel like I'm playing Retard Mode.

i use the mouse alone and WASD *i turn with my mouse*

also i am usually number 1 or 2 dps unless someone over gears me a lot

Being number 1 or 2 while playing with a bunch of terrible players doesn't make you good. 100% FACT: You are under-performing because of clicking. You also haven't even mentioned what class you play. Tanking and Healer clickers will never be anywhere as near as good as a binder, and I know for sure a Fury Warrior could never play even decently while clicking.

i love how you assume i am being carried when i am usually the one carrying people unless they are heroic raiders

*or i am on a under geared alt* but strickly for my main i am still usually number 1 or 2 dps or course unless there's a guy decked out in heroic mode gear

Guarantee you couldn't outdps on me on any of my normal geared toons.

[Deleted]

<--- doesn't use add-ons

<---haz green fire and normal mode garrosh

did i say that i also am a clicker?

Because the pinnacle of accomplishments in WoW is green fire and Garrosh N.

[Arthas242]

LFR don't count.

i don't do LFR anymore since flex,

flex and normal only

LFR just makes me want to punch my self in the face

[Tower]

Reforging is stupid first of all and adds nothing to the game besides a gold sink. Using AMR is basically so you make sure to stay within hit/exp caps while maximizing your secondary stats. As far as boss strategies, rotation advice and addons....those have always been a part of wow since vanilla so I'm not sure where you are going with that one.

[Annarion]

People don't like to do work when they're playing a game? Quelle surprise!