Even More Bad News for America's Atheists

[Stonecloak]

And I know many like that as well... All atheists. My grandmother was a jehovas witness and she worried about us not being allowed to join her in paradise all the time. When I was born, she told my parents to at least let her ensure that I wouldn't be killed off in the cleansing...

Both sides have well rounded people, and both sides have crazy's. Though I imagine seeing more Christian crazy's because it's the most publicized religion.

[Sunseeker]

Well that's nice to hear. I usually see the opposite though.

It's why I REALLY like the city I live in. Most of the folks here, while white, christian conservatives, are not the sort of raging loonies you hear about.

[dusselldorf]

And I know many like that as well... All atheists. My grandmother was a jehovas witness and she worried about us not being allowed to join her in paradise all the time. When I was born, she told my parents to at least let her ensure that I wouldn't be killed off in the cleansing...

I was raised a jehovahs witness. I don't classify that as a legitimate religion because it's too much like a cult. They control everything down to what facial hair you're allowed to grow, what people you're allowed to talk to (including family members), how many squares of toilet paper or towels to use when using the restroom (no shit, that was in a talk at a local congretation), what medical treatment you're allowed to have, what education you're allowed to pursue, what holidays you're allowed to acknowledge or celebrate, and finally they encourage parents to disown their own children if the child wants to leave the church after being baptized. These standards are all imposed by a group of men in Brooklyn New York for which the average member is unable to distinguish from god. It's sad. If you disagree with any of the teachings in the monthly publications or given from the platform, (which have changed constantly since the organization's inception, involving numerous end of the world Armageddon predictions on specific dates that never happened), you're not having a disagreement, you're "turning your back on Jehovah" and are considered "mentally ill" and diseased, or perhaps the most outrageous, you're using "independent thinking." Independent thinking is known to most people as simply "thinking."

[Queen of Hamsters]

Both sides have well rounded people, and both sides have crazy's. Though I imagine seeing more Christian crazy's because it's the most publicized religion.

I tend to feel like people choosing to know rather than believing are always the well rounded ones.

[TrumpIsPresident]

This thread is going places.

Ya but its a religion bash thread, MMO-C GOT's favorite type of thread.

[Kraenen]

I laughed at the notion that only census data is applicable. I don't know what point you're trying to prove. You increase the size of your random sample and it decreases the odds of getting an extreme event that greatly skews the picture the data draws. I'm not sure what you mean "why 'your' poll trumps anyone who wasn't polled." Nobody who wasn't polled got trumped. Someone who doesn't understand statistics enough to understand the odds of an extreme event with a proper sample size saying only census data is applicable got trumped.
It's arbitrary to use 95% instead of 99% or 90% or 1%. The math used to generate that number is not.

I didn't say anything about census data. I say "trumped" because you acted as if the sample and its stats measures were enough that you didn't need to care about anyone who wasn't polled.

I'm really just trying to make the point against someone who thinks with 100% certainty, and after reflection it doesn't seem like this is you. So, I apologize if I came off as rude to you personally.

[rayden54]

That is the funny part they never once think expecting us to go might be disrespectful to us at all.

There's a very big difference. You going to church is nothing more than an inconvenience to you. Asking them not to is like telling them to literally go to hell.

[Fexus]

I was raised a jehovahs witness. I don't classify that as a legitimate religion because it's too much like a cult.

What is the difference between a "legitimate religion" and a cult?

[Eldar45]

Anyone who is willing to believe things without proof, especially fantastic, extraordinary things, demonstrates a lack of critical thinking ability and in the case of religion a dangerous bent towards "magical thinking", which is how you'll wind up with people murdering others in the name of their god, but it's totally ok and a good thing because that's what god wants and more importantly "they're in paradise now". No, they're dead. You killed them, you monster.

I take it someone you know died because of religious reasons?

Christians are commanded not to kill in the name of God.

I have my proof. You may not see my proof as proof, but it is still something that makes me believe in the Judeo-Christian idea of God.

[Queen of Hamsters]

What is the difference between a "legitimate religion" and a cult?

They all seem the same to me. All man made, with no evidence to back their claims up but plenty of evidence speaking against them

[dusselldorf]

What is the difference between a "legitimate religion" and a cult?

A cult employs illegitimate mind control techniques. One of the most basic tests is whether the organizations asks its members to disown family members and whether people are free to leave. If you've never experienced it, (or if you have), I'd recommend this book. The author was a former member of the Moonies and went on to get a PhD and write about his experiences.

http://www.amazon.com/Combatting-Cul.../dp/0892813113

It's good reading for anyone.

[Queen of Hamsters]

I take it someone you know died because of religious reasons?

Christians are commanded not to kill in the name of God.

I have my proof. You may not see my proof as proof, but it is still something that makes me believe in the Judeo-Christian idea of God.

What proof do you have?

[usiris]

Guys were getting a bit off topic and into religion bashing.

[Kraenen]

What is the difference between a "legitimate religion" and a cult?

Mainly in how open they are. Cults are more secretive and exclusive while a religion that has 'legitimized' itself will be open to the public. That's my best guess at least.

[Mercadi]

If a cult grows to have n millions of people, it becomes a religion.

[Stonecloak]

Anyone who is willing to believe things without proof, especially fantastic, extraordinary things, demonstrates a lack of critical thinking ability and in the case of religion a dangerous bent towards "magical thinking", which is how you'll wind up with people murdering others in the name of their god, but it's totally ok and a good thing because that's what god wants and more importantly "they're in paradise now". No, they're dead. You killed them, you monster.

Chill. For the record I will not be labeled. As no ideology defines what I think or believe. To respond now it's obviously not meant for everyone. I'm not saying your wrong. I'm saying I've been a part of both sides of the spectrum and have met some really good intelligent Christians. Even though I don't believe in it. Most of these guys I speak of anyway seemed to know what to take seriously and what to not. You sound like your referring to zealots. Yea zealots are bad in any ideology. Even atheist Zealots.

[Stonecloak]

Mainly in how open they are. Cults are more secretive and exclusive while a religion that has 'legitimized' itself will be open to the public. That's my best guess at least.

I've heard people refer to Christianity as a cult. I think it does fit into the definition.

[Mormolyce]

http://www.balancedpolitics.org/edit...inst_polls.htm

Ah but we were just talking about sample size, not whether there's bias in the study or if polls are good for policymaking.

[dusselldorf]

Ugh, agnostics ARE theists, agnosticism is a super-type, not a theological position. You have either Gnostic or Agnostic Atheists and Theists. Anyone who claims Gnosis is full of crap, otherwise there would be no need for faith and everyone would believe (gnostic theism) or religion and spirituality would be gone for good (gnostic atheism). You can't disprove or prove something you can't test.

By definition, the supernatural is untestable. A person can absolutely be an agnostic but not an atheist, because an atheist has an active believe about the existence of a god, whereas an atheist is open to the idea but has not arrived at any conclusion, which is really the only logical choice for something that is untestable.

[Mormolyce]

What is the difference between a "legitimate religion" and a cult?

Perspective.