"Threats like that have long lost their sway over us." Blizzard in regards to WW #'s

[echoSAW]

Any time the "silent majority" or in this case the group of players who will presumably quit playing because...reasons...is invoked, the argument immediately loses credibility. I think it's great that a "blue" said something like this. It will certainly not stop people from making the exact same type of argument again, but it needed to be said.

[TheTaurenOrc]

They've tried middle ground, they've tried reasoning, blizzard tried everything. But the community is relentless with threats of quiting. Your threats now fall on deaf ears.

If the subscription numbers are anything to go by they are not empty threats. Perhaps they should take them seriously. Also this was feedback on the least played class and spec, would think they would value it.

[LilSaihah]

If the subscription numbers are anything to go by they are not empty threats. Perhaps they should take them seriously. Also this was feedback on the least played class and spec, would think they would value it.

What feedback is there to value?

[echoSAW]

If the subscription numbers are anything to go by they are not empty threats. Perhaps they should take them seriously. Also this was feedback on the least played class and spec, would think they would value it.

Constructive, useful, specific feedback is one thing. Invoking the wrath of the silent masses is another.

[Seezer]

People have been saying they are not going to play ww because of the new changes to WW, the same is happening with other monk specs such as the mistweaver, I am appalled at blizzards stance against people just dropping the class. They don't believe people are serious? Is that why the monk is the lowest represented class in the game? It won't matter what they do if nobody is playing their class.

Why does Blizzard think it's okay to treat their fanbase like this?
I'd like to see them treat their stockholders like this if one threatens to take their money out of the company.

Here's the proof

https://twitter.com/Celestalon/statu...54213178888193

Are you really appalled? Are you that sensitive? They aren't talking to stockholders because stockholders don't have the same mentality as the average forum whiner who throws a temper tantrum when something doesn't go their way. Blizzard is tired of being held hostage to a whiney playerbase, and they aren't going to take it. I know it must be frustrating when you think that "I'll quit, and so will my friends list of 15k people if you don't do what we want" is going to get you what you want, and that blizz saying "threats have lost their sway with us" probably drives you insane. Because it's about control. Control freaks go apeshit when they realize they are losing control.

And if you really think that "THreats like that have lost their sway with us" is an insult or out of line, then you're just too emotional. Because that's a reasonable response.

[TheTaurenOrc]

What feedback is there to value?

Erhm did you read the twitter conversation? The bits where beta testers (the ones supposed to give feedback) compared the gameplay to other melee specs, and compared it to how monks were in the first Mop tier which blizzard acknowledged they needed improvement upon.

The whole attitude of this Celestion guy is awful, here there are beta players trying to give their feedback which is supposed to be the whole point, only to get a 'your wrong I am right' response with condescending overtones.

Oh hell who am I kidding, sometimes I forget where I am posting and expect an impartial view on Blizzard. Oh well.

[Buildapanda]

Erhm did you read the twitter conversation? The bits where beta testers (the ones supposed to give feedback) compared the gameplay to other melee specs, and compared it to how monks were in the first Mop tier which blizzard acknowledged they needed improvement upon.

The whole attitude of this Celestion guy is awful, here there are beta players trying to give their feedback which is supposed to be the whole point, only to get a 'your wrong I am right' response with conditioning overtones.

Oh hell who am I kidding, sometimes I forget where I am posting and expect an impartial view on Blizzard. Oh well.

Now that you brought that point up I'm even more apalled.

Blizzard invites these people to beta test and alpha test their game, then get mad when people say there is something gamebreaking wrong that it makes them want to quit.

Who's the emotional one?

[Seezer]

If the subscription numbers are anything to go by they are not empty threats. Perhaps they should take them seriously. Also this was feedback on the least played class and spec, would think they would value it.

They've been taking them seriously the past few years. Bending to the will of the playerbase. And it has gotten them nowhere. And they've realized how whiney the playerbase is. And no matter what they do, the whiney playerbase will keep whining. So there comes a point where catering to the whining doesn't move the game in a good direction.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

If the subscription numbers are anything to go by they are not empty threats. Perhaps they should take them seriously. Also this was feedback on the least played class and spec, would think they would value it.

If a subscriber uses threats, that's their fault and Blizzard shouldn't tolerate threats at all. It does nothing to contribute. Yes they pay for the game but subscribers aren't entitled to act like jerks to any organization corporate or otherwise.

[Seezer]

Now that you brought that point up I'm even more apalled.

Blizzard invites these people to beta test and alpha test their game, then get mad when people say there is something gamebreaking wrong that it makes them want to quit.

Who's the emotional one?

Seems like you're the emotional one. If you're really appalled, then you definitely are overly emotional. The guy could have given beta like feedback. And Cales would have responded. But instead he threw the oh so common "Numbers will drop" threat. So be appauled. Put your forearm to your forehead while you do it.

[LilSaihah]

Erhm did you read the twitter conversation? The bits where beta testers (the ones supposed to give feedback) compared the gameplay to other melee specs, and compared it to how monks were in the first Mop tier which blizzard acknowledged they needed improvement upon.

The whole attitude of this Celestion guy is awful, here there are beta players trying to give their feedback which is supposed to be the whole point, only to get a 'your wrong I am right' response with condescending overtones.

Oh hell who am I kidding, sometimes I forget where I am posting and expect an impartial view on Blizzard. Oh well.

From what I see, there is a conversation between Cain, Celestalon and Kfir, which is constructive. Krystopher Decker then enters, threatens to quit the class, and then Celestalon gives the cited quote. He is not responding to the entire conversation with that remark, he is responding exclusively to Krystopher, who has offered no feedback beyond threatening to quit.

[RoKPaNda]

Erhm did you read the twitter conversation? The bits where beta testers (the ones supposed to give feedback) compared the gameplay to other melee specs, and compared it to how monks were in the first Mop tier which blizzard acknowledged they needed improvement upon.

The whole attitude of this Celestion guy is awful, here there are beta players trying to give their feedback which is supposed to be the whole point, only to get a 'your wrong I am right' response with condescending overtones.

Oh hell who am I kidding, sometimes I forget where I am posting and expect an impartial view on Blizzard. Oh well.

It's not that people aren't capable of being impartial. You're giving the benefit of the doubt to the small number of people complaining on Twitter about how WW feels to them. You're assuming that they're playing the class the way it's supposed to be played, but we don't know that. They could be doing something horribly wrong, and then the feedback should be that the rotation isn't intuitive. If people would post what they don't like about the class and spec, in a detailed, clear, and constructive fashion over a media that doesn't limit you to 140 characters, Blizzard has shown that they're willing to discuss it, go into detail on their thought process more, etc. Just throwing one's arms up in the air and saying "I QUIT AND SO ARE A BUNCH OF OTHER PEOPLE UNLESS YOU CAVE TO MY DEMANDS, FEAR MY IMPOTENT RAGE!!!!!!!!" is not constructive nor useful feedback and doesn't warrant discussion to be honest.

[Pann]

If a subscriber uses threats, that's their fault and Blizzard shouldn't tolerate threats at all. It does nothing to contribute. Yes they pay for the game but subscribers aren't entitled to act like jerks to any organization corporate or otherwise.

What threats? They tried to offer feedback only to be meet with the usual Blizzard knows best attitude. If Blizzard cannot deal with feedback that differs from their vision perhaps they should not have offered the game to the general public as a commercial product and made it as a hobbyist pursuit where only like minded individuals have access?

- - - Updated - - -

From what I see, there is a conversation between Cain, Celestalon and Kfir, which is constructive. Krystopher Decker then enters, threatens to quit the class, and then Celestalon gives the cited quote. He is not responding to the entire conversation with that remark, he is responding exclusively to Krystopher, who has offered no feedback beyond threatening to quit.

No Krystopher Decker does not.

[Tastyfish]

Monks are the lowest represented class in the game cause unlike DK's you start at level 1 and they haven't been out for 6 years.

TRUTH rite here.

I don't get the MW threats. I can 2 heal normal with a holy priest and top charts.. I enjoy nifty moves like Disarming the Earth shaman guy, among others. I don't see how it's so horribly gimped.. lol will play it in WOD. lol Maybe too many people think they have to dominate something, and are not content to be support, 2nd or 3rd.

[Darsithis]

How about a non-douchey and condescending response instead. You know some middle ground.

Blizzard has done that for years but it starts to wear thin. Besides, it's hardly adult and mature to say "if you don't do what I say, I'm going to quit and I'm going to tell all my friends to quit! Make my changes!"

What threats? They tried to offer feedback only to be meet with the usual Blizzard knows best attitude. If Blizzard cannot deal with feedback that differs from their vision perhaps they should not have offered the game to the general public as a commercial product and made it as a hobbyist pursuit where only like minded individuals have access?

It's their vision. Feedback != have to do what the feedback suggests.

[Deleted]

Because their fanbase treats them like that. If you don't want Blizzard to treat you like a child don't act like a fuckin' child.

^This. It's the only appropriate response.

[Deleted]

Oh hell who am I kidding, sometimes I forget where I am posting and expect an impartial view on Blizzard. Oh well.

Please stop, you're embarrassing yourself.

[Pann]

It's their vision. Feedback != have to do what the feedback suggests.

Where did I have to say that they have to act on the feedback they receive? No business has to act on customer feedback but it is never a good idea to completely ignore it. And whilst it might be Blizzard's vision it is our money that allows them to create it and let's not pretend that Blizzard are not quick to abandon their vision once the money starts drying up.

[Kuntantee]

Why should they listen to it? How is threatening Blizzard going to bring about the right changes? Who would respond well to "we'll all stop playing!" every time someone doesn't agree with the smallest change. Good on Blizzard for standing up to dicks.

Did you even read that tweet? It's not a threat. This is resistance against feedback, nothing more.

Blizzard has done that for years but it starts to wear thin. Besides, it's hardly adult and mature to say "if you don't do what I say, I'm going to quit and I'm going to tell all my friends to quit! Make my changes!"

I am not sure if that guy is right or wrong but he just stated a natural implication of bad decisions during beta. If you fail to design class in a way player base wants, people won't play it.

It's their vision. Feedback != have to do what the feedback suggests.

This is true as long as there are players who thinks that "vision" is fun. If monk numbers start to drop, do you think they will stick with their vision?

[Xar226]

Why does Blizzard think it's okay to treat their fanbase like this?

Probably because their fanbase consists of a high percentage of whiny children who deserves to be treated that way.

If you have a problem with the WW spec, or any other spec, it's very simple: Articulate your issues and why they are a problem. If you have a good solution, offer it up. "Revert every change you've made" isn't going to fly, ever. Neither will "EVERYTHING YOU DO IS WRONG I'M GOING TO QUIT," nor should it ever.

If you act like an adult and present your argument maturely, you will be heard. That does not mean you will get your way, but you will be heard and considered. If you start a pissing contest, insulting people, threatening to unsub or stop playing a class, then you're going to be dismissed exactly the way this person was dismissed and deserve every bit of it.

I'd like to see them treat their stockholders like this if one threatens to take their money out of the company.

Their stockholds don't cry like children. They buy or sell as they think is appropriate. If they want a serious influence on goings-on, they try to get a strong enough equity position to be listened to, then they send a mature letter outlining their goals -- exactly as a WoW player should. If one of them sent a letter saying "if you don't do such-and-such I'm going to sell my stock!" then "you're perfectly welcome to sell your stock" is exactly the right response.

TL;DR: Act like an adult, get treated like an adult.