[6.2] Demonology Warlock Guide

[evertonbelmontt]

@Almara
First tier 30% haste? Never gonna happen :P

@SacPact /DB

Both needs to be buffed a little. DB being 2min CD would be viable, IMO. Problem is that I can clearly see it being very strong on PVP, so it SHOULD be dispellable IF it gets buffed. Sac pact was good but now I feel the shield is just so weak... in MOP it was the best defense you could have on a lot of fights because of sac pact and 100% extra health each minute. I'd say put it back at 100% shield instead of 80.

[Jetjaguar]

Twins and Butcher are the only fight that come to mind that I'd think Soul Link would be suitable over Sac pact. Even Twins, the interrupting shout hits fairly hard with enfeebling up, so I don't think sac pact would be useless here. Kargath is whatever, really if you see yourself getting high stacks of the fire bomb debuff for god knows why, you can react and shield yourself.

I don't really understand how soul link is flexible. Active mitigation by definition means it's stronger "burst" mitigation vs something that is always up but not as strong, which is really what the decision of soul link vs sac pact comes down to. I would definitely be using Sac Pact on Brackenspore, Tectus, Koragh (if you're not soaking in the mid which is an unlikely scenario in most guilds) and Imperator. I can predict exactly where I will be taking extreme amounts of damage and how best I can mitigate that.

If I screw up Mark of Chaos but I have soul link I will probably be fine. If I screw up Mark of Chaos but I have sac pact, and I don't see myself about to screw up a super easy mechanic then I will probably die. That's why I don't understand how sac pact is a better learning talent. When you're learning a fight, you're probably not comfortable with mechanics so you're prone to screwing up. This makes soul link pretty strong because if you take damage you're not intending to take, then you have a nice buffer and maybe your teammates don't notice your screw up. Once you're experienced in a fight, you know where the damage is coming from, so you can actively prevent damage taken where it's important.

It's probably not a huge difference in the long run, but I feel like if you're taking passive over active mitigation and the passive mitigation isn't grossly overpowered (soul link in throne of thunder) then you're being lazy or you're just not confident in yourself to play defensively when it's appropriate.

[smana7]

Just want to ask if you are suppose to use felstorm on CD for single target.
If not, how many targets is needed to use felstorm?

Thanks.

[striderZA]

Just want to ask if you are suppose to use felstorm on CD for single target.
If not, how many targets is needed to use felstorm?

Thanks.

You should always use it on CD, although you can delay it if an add phase or something is imminent.

[FurtyIRL]

Twins and Butcher are the only fight that come to mind that I'd think Soul Link would be suitable over Sac pact. Even Twins, the interrupting shout hits fairly hard with enfeebling up, so I don't think sac pact would be useless here. Kargath is whatever, really if you see yourself getting high stacks of the fire bomb debuff for god knows why, you can react and shield yourself.

I don't really understand how soul link is flexible. Active mitigation by definition means it's stronger "burst" mitigation vs something that is always up but not as strong, which is really what the decision of soul link vs sac pact comes down to. I would definitely be using Sac Pact on Brackenspore, Tectus, Koragh (if you're not soaking in the mid which is an unlikely scenario in most guilds) and Imperator. I can predict exactly where I will be taking extreme amounts of damage and how best I can mitigate that.

If I screw up Mark of Chaos but I have soul link I will probably be fine. If I screw up Mark of Chaos but I have sac pact, and I don't see myself about to screw up a super easy mechanic then I will probably die. That's why I don't understand how sac pact is a better learning talent. When you're learning a fight, you're probably not comfortable with mechanics so you're prone to screwing up. This makes soul link pretty strong because if you take damage you're not intending to take, then you have a nice buffer and maybe your teammates don't notice your screw up. Once you're experienced in a fight, you know where the damage is coming from, so you can actively prevent damage taken where it's important.

It's probably not a huge difference in the long run, but I feel like if you're taking passive over active mitigation and the passive mitigation isn't grossly overpowered (soul link in throne of thunder) then you're being lazy or you're just not confident in yourself to play defensively when it's appropriate.

Butcher is actually I fight where I think Dark Bargain was the clear choice for progression (allowing you a free 8s of DPS after berserk). Soul link is good on ogrons for just about everything, be it enfeebling, arcane debuff, quake, etc. Brackenspore there is plenty of incidental damage and infesting spores lasts long enough/hits hard enough that soul link does as much or more mitigation.

As for whether it's a good talent for learning, well I guess that depends on your awareness. If I were to screw up mark of chaos I would most definitely be aware that I was in range of the explosion well in advance of it going off and generally that's when I would pop sac pact. I guess if you're completely unaware you're making mistakes than soul link might be better for learning but I like to use my CDs proactively instead of retroactively. If you're using sac pact efficiently it adds up to a lot of globals lost as well which is not insignificant. The whole reason ER is such a great glyph is because it's just infinitely more valuable to have that extra passive DR. Removing the element of human error is also not to be undervalued — everyone gets surprise gibbed from time to time and soul link almost removes that possibility.

I feel like the passive mitigation is grossly overpowered and you really underestimate how strong 30% passive DR is. Even saving healers that much extra mana on progression adds up to be very relevant. All that said I stand by what I previously said; sac pact is certainly a viable alternative if it's your preference, or you need to be soaking specific mechanics.

[Brusalk]

Personally I find I am generating enough fury to spend it in line with my DBolt dump phases... usually am not too far behind. Excess fury seems like it would be a waste, imo. You also will be generating more fury just through free HoG procs off Corruptions with the set bonus.

HoG (Shadow Flame + HoG) does contribute like... 10%(is this normal?) of my damage, though.

edit: speaking strictly single target, of course.

This definitely seems like something that needs some more playing around with. Unless someone with greater math skills than myself could piece it together.

It's not like excess fury just goes to waste. You convert it into more damage with ToC or Demonform Soulfire. There's no rule stating that you have to use each and every bit of all of your fury you ever get in a fight only on Doom and Demonbolt.

[Deleted]

You should always use it on CD, although you can delay it if an add phase or something is imminent.

From what I've been reading here and there I think it's better to save the felstorm and drop it on a Demonbolt fase because it will benefit from the Dark Soul's mastery gain.

[Gaidax]

From what I've been reading here and there I think it's better to save the felstorm and drop it on a Demonbolt fase because it will benefit from the Dark Soul's mastery gain.

That's what I am thinking exactly, I personally use it with DS OR when adds are up.

[Zevoa]

That's what I am thinking exactly, I personally use it with DS OR when adds are up.

There's no discernible difference between using Felstorm on CD in a single target situation and delaying it for use while Dark Soul is active; you're eventually going to lose out on casts of the CD and the overall damage contribution is negligible at best. However, in multitarget scenarios it's an entirely different situation.

[Xorn]

That's what I am thinking exactly, I personally use it with DS OR when adds are up.

This is what I do as well. I try to save it for multiple targets, however if none are present, I use it with DS. It's a lot more noticeable of a damage gain with the Wrathguard, but I think it should still be fine with the Felguard.

[Tyrean]

So I was heavy on haste/mastery gear but I have been switching out some of my haste for multistrike. I have liked the difference, but listening to you guys discuss the BRF gear makes me wonder if I was just not leveraging my haste correctly. I would end up delaying some demonbolt dumps because dark soul was not up when demonbolt came off CD, but it is sounding like there might be a point when you reach enough haste to do dumps in between dark souls... I think at one point my haste was so high because I was affliction main spec that I was at 30 second demonbolt debuff... Maybe I should try playing with 3 bolt dumps with no DS in between 4 bolt DS dumps?

I really liked the haste because it just made everything faster which was more fun. My damage went up though when I moved some of that haste in other stats like multi and crit though, but it makes sense to me the damage increase was just because I was not using that haste very well.

[Deleted]

with 4pt17 what's the good way to use hog ?

get 2 charges and 5sec or less for the 3 or get 1 charge and 5 or less for the 2 ?

[Deleted]

Any1 else noticed the recent switch in stat priority for demonbolt demo? my current single target weights are mastery>crit=ms>haste>Versa. where it used to be mastery>Haste.

[Count Zero]

Any1 else noticed the recent switch in stat priority for demonbolt demo? my current single target weights are mastery>crit=ms>haste>Versa. where it used to be mastery>Haste.

May be that you hit a certain threshold of haste and/or are lacking in crit and ms

[FurtyIRL]

May be that you hit a certain threshold of haste and/or are lacking in crit and ms

Yeah, early expac there isn't really a clear stat priority because we have so little stats. While it's clear Mastery is our best stat, the value of your other secondaries is going to shift around a little depending on how much you have of each. For example, if you have a lot of crit but almost no haste, then haste is going to sim as a very valuable stat. Once we have enough secondaries to dampen this inflation effect a little the stat hierarchy will be a lot more clear. Since there is no reforging it's not a huge deal; just aim to get gear with mastery on it and you'll do just fine.

[Woz]

Yeah, early expac there isn't really a clear stat priority because we have so little stats. While it's clear Mastery is our best stat, the value of your other secondaries is going to shift around a little depending on how much you have of each. For example, if you have a lot of crit but almost no haste, then haste is going to sim as a very valuable stat. Once we have enough secondaries to dampen this inflation effect a little the stat hierarchy will be a lot more clear. Since there is no reforging it's not a huge deal; just aim to get gear with mastery on it and you'll do just fine.

Pretty much. On my current character sheet I have roughly equal Mastery/Haste and Multistrike so my Crit value is really high. And it'll continue changing until all your stats are equal to one another.

[Deleted]

im fairly sure that down the road when we've gotten some extra gear that it will go back to mastery>haste>crit=MS

[FurtyIRL]

im fairly sure that down the road when we've gotten some extra gear that it will go back to mastery>haste>crit=MS

Yeah, once you hit a reasonable amount of each stat it has a dampening effect on the inflation.

[yeerk009]

Any thoughts on the new alchemy trinket in 6.1? (Stone of Fire)

Would it be better than BRF Heroic trinkets? Worth getting alchemy for?

[Noxate]

It's probably not a huge difference in the long run, but I feel like if you're taking passive over active mitigation and the passive mitigation isn't grossly overpowered (soul link in throne of thunder) then you're being lazy or you're just not confident in yourself to play defensively when it's appropriate.

I think for Soul Link my major problem is what it does to the demon besides that I think it's pretty strong. Taking it and eternal resolve for 28% passive DR on top of having Locks already have high health pools which makes it pretty hard to die. That gives you passively more survivability then many specs have with CD's pretty hard to ignore that.