Is Pulverize necessary?

[Pale Cat]

Hello everyone!

I really want to play druid in WoD, but there is one thing I don't like. And that is Pulverize. Is it necessary to take this talent? From all the tests I've seen, Pulverize is superior to other choices. Thus the answer is simple: yes, it is necessary.

But I really hope I miss something. Thank you for all the answers!

[Deleted]

Pulverize is indeed superior to the other talents.

But unless you aren't 100%-Min/Max feel free to pick any other talent you like.

Arielle posted a comparison on http://www.theincbear.com/ , just scroll down a little.

[huth]

Hello everyone!

I really want to play druid in WoD, but there is one thing I don't like. And that is Pulverize. Is it necessary to take this talent? From all the tests I've seen, Pulverize is superior to other choices. Thus the answer is simple: yes, it is necessary.

No, it is merely better in most circumstances. If it was necessary, you'd be incapable of playing with the other two talents.

[Zephyrion1602]

I'm positive some fights Bristling Fur's reduction will be very useful, even if Pulverize is currently the general best option.

[Arielle]

Do you have to take Pulverize? No, nobody is forcing you.

Is it leaps and bounds better than the other two talents (excluding situations tailored to those talents)? Yes.

Will it stay that way? I doubt it.

[Deleted]

Why wouldn't you want to take pulverize? I'd rather have pulverize back than have to keep spamming lacerate.

[Braindwen]

Why wouldn't you want to take pulverize? I'd rather have pulverize back than have to keep spamming lacerate.

Possibly the minor but annoying DPS/RPS losses. Or how it nerfs multistrike as a stat.

Alternatively, you like incarnation and don't like how pulverize ruins it by dictating half your GCDs to you. Or you like the idea of one of the other 2 talents and wish they were at least "not terrible" in comparison.

Or you're just not that big of a fan of 12s maintenance buffs that are so strong you really shouldn't let them drop.

Finally, you may realize that pulverize is about as interactive as making a /castsequence macro out of your lacerate button (it's more than that... but not by much), so you realize that it's really no more "exciting" than the rotation without it. Or you're like me and consider the rotation to be "boring" after a few weeks no matter what it is, so a simple option that's "not terrible" would be nice.

[Dreyen]

Pulverize is way up there in power, other talents don't even compare in general, outside of fights where you can abuse them.

I personally dislike pulverize... it prevents us from going all-out aoe, it's a troublesome maintenance buff. I would've prefered if they just made it not consume lacerate and have us refresh every 12sec. There would still be skill in using it just before it runs out and not too early (loss of rage) or too late (loss of uptime)

[trifrost]

Which output more dps? Doing the 3 x lacerate 1 Pulverize combo continously or just keep spamming lacerate and only Pulverize to to refresh the buff when it is going to drop?

[Dreyen]

Which output more dps? Doing the 3 x lacerate 1 Pulverize combo continously or just keep spamming lacerate and only Pulverize to to refresh the buff when it is going to drop?

Good question, you'd have to math it... but in general fights with aoe you want to use trash as much as possible, which means using pulveirze at the verylast second.

[Arielle]

Which output more dps? Doing the 3 x lacerate 1 Pulverize combo continously or just keep spamming lacerate and only Pulverize to to refresh the buff when it is going to drop?

It's pretty much the same, excluding AoE as mentioned earlier.

I actually like Pulverize and find it fun now that it actually does something. Don't let someone else's subjective views of the talent change what you do or do not like to do. But the other two talents should still do at least something valuable outside of situations where they would be "required".

[Captainn]

It's pretty much the same, excluding AoE as mentioned earlier.

I actually like Pulverize and find it fun now that it actually does something. Don't let someone else's subjective views of the talent change what you do or do not like to do. But the other two talents should still do at least something valuable outside of situations where they would be "required".

Not to mention I can 100% see how much damage my face is taking when Pulverize isn't up. This early on, that talent is amazing. It huuuuurts.

[Dreyen]

It's pretty much the same, excluding AoE as mentioned earlier.

I actually like Pulverize and find it fun now that it actually does something. Don't let someone else's subjective views of the talent change what you do or do not like to do. But the other two talents should still do at least something valuable outside of situations where they would be "required".

I really feel like theres 2-3 class design teams that don't talk to eachother. Some say they want all talents to be equally used, but its very obvious some other specs are completly aimed at a mandatory talent with side talents for other roles. I mean, the whole druid community blatantly complained about pulverize and they have never done anything, except a minor nerf that is part of the tank squish...

guardian of elune is still a very minor damage reduction, just a good cheesy ability on some fights where you can reliably dodge a periodic ability. I did some napkin math and it's literally 3% damage reduction... on top of being spiky. Oh, also increases the rage you spend on savage defense, since you get to use it more, so less rage on maul/frenzied regen.
bristling fur is good for... oregorger i guess, or whenever you need frequent shieldwalls.
pulverize is sky-high in terms of defensive power. 15% damage reduction, smooths damage all the time, just has a minor impact on rage gen/ursa major bonus and significantly lowers your aoe damage. Compare this to warrior's gladiator talent, which is 5% damage reduction... theres a huge gap.

They need to make bristling fur add a passive bonus, GoE needs to last 4.5sec, or have a lower cooldown and cost less rage accordingly to your dodge bonus, pulverize needs to go down to at least 8-10%.. Preferably change pulverize to not affect aoe dps since this tier has nothing to do about tank DPS.

[Deleted]

I really feel like theres 2-3 class design teams that don't talk to eachother. Some say they want all talents to be equally used, but its very obvious some other specs are completly aimed at a mandatory talent with side talents for other roles. I mean, the whole druid community blatantly complained about pulverize and they have never done anything, except a minor nerf that is part of the tank squish...

guardian of elune is still a very minor damage reduction, just a good cheesy ability on some fights where you can reliably dodge a periodic ability. I did some napkin math and it's literally 3% damage reduction... on top of being spiky. Oh, also increases the rage you spend on savage defense, since you get to use it more, so less rage on maul/frenzied regen.
bristling fur is good for... oregorger i guess, or whenever you need frequent shieldwalls.
pulverize is sky-high in terms of defensive power. 15% damage reduction, smooths damage all the time, just has a minor impact on rage gen/ursa major bonus and significantly lowers your aoe damage. Compare this to warrior's gladiator talent, which is 5% damage reduction... theres a huge gap.

They need to make bristling fur add a passive bonus, GoE needs to last 4.5sec, or have a lower cooldown and cost less rage accordingly to your dodge bonus, pulverize needs to go down to at least 8-10%.. Preferably change pulverize to not affect aoe dps since this tier has nothing to do about tank DPS.

From someone who loves pulverize, I dont care as to why someone dislikes it etc.... I want to use it.

Dont nerf it, buff the others to its level. But I'm going to keep picking a flat dmg reduction over atleast dodge anyday. Physical dmg isnt the issue I face as a bear, its magical dmg, and pulverize helps mitigate it, at the same time, I get another attack, which I enjoy... three dmg moves, and well yes maul, where only one is aoe anyway... variety sure helps.

Would wish for there to be an aoe function to pulverize, sort of like... if target is affected by trash the dmg is divided between up to 8 enemies within 8 yards... or such :P

Also thematically I think it should reduce dmg dealt by mobs instead of dmg taken by player, a move called pulverize makes little sense buffing your defenses.

Or just make it a baseline ability, and add something else.... In the end, dont remove pulverize, I love it.

[Cirque]

So I went bear today for the first time in forever and is it correct that you basically spend 3 gcds to get lacerate up, only to immediately delete the stacks you worked on for pulverize, after which you stack up 3 lacerates again, just to consume them ~7s after for pulverize again?

It's like... Like the old Lifebloom, imagine having that, and then having to use Swiftmend to consume them for some buff. Imagine the shitstorm if this were the case. FOUR GLOBALS, of which 3 are instantly useless because you consumed the stacks. Why is this kind of mechanic ok for bear?

[Dreyen]

So I went bear today for the first time in forever and is it correct that you basically spend 3 gcds to get lacerate up, only to immediately delete the stacks you worked on for pulverize, after which you stack up 3 lacerates again, just to consume them ~7s after for pulverize again?

It's like... Like the old Lifebloom, imagine having that, and then having to use Swiftmend to consume them for some buff. Imagine the shitstorm if this were the case. FOUR GLOBALS, of which 3 are instantly useless because you consumed the stacks. Why is this kind of mechanic ok for bear?

theorically the dps loss from losing the triple stacks of lacerate is offset by the high damage on pulverize.

Still lowers your aoe damage a shitton though.

[ElfinHilon10]

So I went bear today for the first time in forever and is it correct that you basically spend 3 gcds to get lacerate up, only to immediately delete the stacks you worked on for pulverize, after which you stack up 3 lacerates again, just to consume them ~7s after for pulverize again?

It's like... Like the old Lifebloom, imagine having that, and then having to use Swiftmend to consume them for some buff. Imagine the shitstorm if this were the case. FOUR GLOBALS, of which 3 are instantly useless because you consumed the stacks. Why is this kind of mechanic ok for bear?

This is actually my biggest complaint. The ramp up time to get this going is far too long, and can seriously kill you if you don't rush it. Otherwise I think Pulverize is fine, and I'd even prefer to see with the lacerate stacks, and just it's own spell. You could just macro it in with lacerate, as that's what we are doing anyway.

[Deleted]

Can you paste your lacerate/pulverizer macro?

[Deleted]

Possibly the minor but annoying DPS/RPS losses. Or how it nerfs multistrike as a stat.

Alternatively, you like incarnation and don't like how pulverize ruins it by dictating half your GCDs to you. Or you like the idea of one of the other 2 talents and wish they were at least "not terrible" in comparison.

Or you're just not that big of a fan of 12s maintenance buffs that are so strong you really shouldn't let them drop.

Finally, you may realize that pulverize is about as interactive as making a /castsequence macro out of your lacerate button (it's more than that... but not by much), so you realize that it's really no more "exciting" than the rotation without it. Or you're like me and consider the rotation to be "boring" after a few weeks no matter what it is, so a simple option that's "not terrible" would be nice.

What's your logic behind this statement?

[Tower]

I am not sure I enjoy pulverize so much. It is great for bosses dont get me wrong, I just dont like the whole idea of stacking a bleed just to wipe it out again. Its also really annoying for trash. This early on it feels like you need it for the trash packs, nothing worse than building up 3 lacerates then the target dies before you can pulverize. Maybe they should make it scale up based on how many lacerates you have up so you can at least get a little benefit from it on trash.