Mythic Butcher (resto shaman)

[Deleted]

Hello everyone! I have a few questions regarding mythic butcher

What talent choices would you recommend? I'm thinking AS/idc/CotE/EM/Cond/EB/HT

I'm however not sure if CBT would be the better option for that fight (with that i would pick Totemic Persistence instead of CotE)

In regards to glyphs, i am really not sure what to pick besides Healing Wave, there doesnt seem to be any amazing glyphs imo. I do realize that many love riptide glyph, but i'm having a hard time finding the proper use for it (running echo on alot of fights). Should i just pull myself together and use it?

I intend to keep ES on tank, HST on cd, HR on melee, EB on cd and CH/riptide the group with stacks, supplement with HS/HW

Any tips, tricks or suggestions from my fellow resto shamans?

[stomination]

Hello everyone! I have a few questions regarding mythic butcher

What talent choices would you recommend? I'm thinking AS/idc/CotE/EM/Cond/EB/HT

I'm however not sure if CBT would be the better option for that fight (with that i would pick Totemic Persistence instead of CotE)

In regards to glyphs, i am really not sure what to pick besides Healing Wave, there doesnt seem to be any amazing glyphs imo. I do realize that many love riptide glyph, but i'm having a hard time finding the proper use for it (running echo on alot of fights). Should i just pull myself together and use it?

I intend to keep ES on tank, HST on cd, HR on melee, EB on cd and CH/riptide the group with stacks, supplement with HS/HW

Any tips, tricks or suggestions from my fellow resto shamans?

Prbly depends on your raid group. I end up using projection since I move the spirit link to where it can hit both groups.

[Alltat]

In regards to glyphs, i am really not sure what to pick besides Healing Wave, there doesnt seem to be any amazing glyphs imo. I do realize that many love riptide glyph, but i'm having a hard time finding the proper use for it (running echo on alot of fights). Should i just pull myself together and use it?

Opinions seem to differ a lot in regards to that glyph, but in my experience it's not really ever worth it. There are theoretical situations where it should be great, but in practice you just end up spending a lot of GCDs doing very little healing in the hope that future High Tide synergies will maybe make up for it. You also lose out on the life-saving aspect of Riptide, as unglyphed Riptide on a low health target does a nontrivial amount of instant healing.

Spiritwalker's Focus has some value on Butcher for continuing to heal during Bounding Cleave. But overall, resto glyphs are all terribly underwhelming. That's just how it is.

[Deleted]

Opinions seem to differ a lot in regards to that glyph, but in my experience it's not really ever worth it. There are theoretical situations where it should be great, but in practice you just end up spending a lot of GCDs doing very little healing in the hope that future High Tide synergies will maybe make up for it. You also lose out on the life-saving aspect of Riptide, as unglyphed Riptide on a low health target does a nontrivial amount of instant healing.

Spiritwalker's Focus has some value on Butcher for continuing to heal during Bounding Cleave. But overall, resto glyphs are all terribly underwhelming. That's just how it is.

Hmm, that is a good point, thanks!

Is there anyone on this forum that has healed M Butcher and can tell me if they spammed CH to the end of days or how much they weaved HS/HW in? Thank you!

[aiko464]

You cannot spam Chain Heal until Butcher goes into frenzy, you need to have about 70% mana at the point he goes into Frenzy since you need to heal alot at that point. If you start spamming Chain Heal before that point you most likely be oom or close to it. I was mainly using Healing wave for the first part of the fight with some Chain Heals. But at the start there is more then enough time to heal people up together with your other healer to not spend crazy amount of mana.
For the rest, please stop using Echo it is really not worth it. The 5% haste from AS is just so much better in the long run and I can even see some use in EM on certain bosses when their are intervals of high dmg but you should stop using Echo, if you feel like you want to have more riptides up then you should go for the glyph, Echo is not the answer to this. And in general Riptide's instant heal is really just not that good. For me Riptides main use is just boosting my Chain Heal potential. Which comes to the 2nd point. Use High Tide, CBT healing is not high enough to make up for the extra Chain Heals from High Tide. Atleast not on Butcher.
Also I used Primal Elementalist for the last minute of the fight to boost healing since I was fine on mana and at that point you do not have the time to cast Elemental Blast anyhow. But this is up to you to find out what suits you best.

[Pur1tas]

Opinions seem to differ a lot in regards to that glyph, but in my experience it's not really ever worth it. There are theoretical situations where it should be great, but in practice you just end up spending a lot of GCDs doing very little healing in the hope that future High Tide synergies will maybe make up for it. You also lose out on the life-saving aspect of Riptide, as unglyphed Riptide on a low health target does a nontrivial amount of instant healing.

Spiritwalker's Focus has some value on Butcher for continuing to heal during Bounding Cleave. But overall, resto glyphs are all terribly underwhelming. That's just how it is.

I think Glyph of Riptide is a lot stronger than you suggest here. While it does cost you some GCDs, you are not going to spread it through the whole raid but only on the active cleave group (if even all of them) costing you 3-5 GCDs (depending on cleave groups and the amount of players in it you decide to riptide). This is not to much to heal vs the cleaves before frenzy. During frenzy though I do not think there is a way to pull off using riptide on those groups, as you will need to spam chainheal while channeling CDs. I would suggest riptide glyph on almost all fights, as the initial heal is not that good even without the glyph and it boosts your chainheal with Hightide by a lot.

Last but not least I strongly suggest projection for Butcher in order to move spirit link in the middle so everyone gets hit by it. Considering the EoE change it might even be worth to use this talent during the fights, but as it will only come in 6.1 you will probably have downed him by that time.

[Alltat]

I would suggest riptide glyph on almost all fights, as the initial heal is not that good even without the glyph and it boosts your chainheal with Hightide by a lot.

I think you underestimate the initial heal. Going by logs, roughly half of the healing done by (unglyphed) Riptide is from the initial heal. Since it's instant, it's easy to pick low health targets and it tends to benefit a lot from mastery while doing almost no overhealing. Unglyphed, it generally heals for enough on a low health target (~30k noncrit) to stabilize them somewhat. Glyphing the spell reduces the total healing it does by about a third and leaves you without that quick short-cooldown life saving potential.

Last but not least I strongly suggest projection for Butcher in order to move spirit link in the middle so everyone gets hit by it.

Do you know if the issues with projecting Spirit Link have actually been fixed yet? It used to take a few seconds before the actual effect moved, even if the graphic was relocated immediately. If it's still glitchy and you miss half the duration if you project it, SLT is better used to mitigate Bounding Cleaves.

[Pur1tas]

I think you underestimate the initial heal. Going by logs, roughly half of the healing done by (unglyphed) Riptide is from the initial heal. Since it's instant, it's easy to pick low health targets and it tends to benefit a lot from mastery while doing almost no overhealing. Unglyphed, it generally heals for enough on a low health target (~30k noncrit) to stabilize them somewhat. Glyphing the spell reduces the total healing it does by about a third and leaves you without that quick short-cooldown life saving potential.


Do you know if the issues with projecting Spirit Link have actually been fixed yet? It used to take a few seconds before the actual effect moved, even if the graphic was relocated immediately. If it's still glitchy and you miss half the duration if you project it, SLT is better used to mitigate Bounding Cleaves.

I realize that the initial heal is huge but to be honest if the dmg incomming is so big that an unglyhped riptide makes a huge effect compared to the glyphed version I think you should rather cast a healing wave or surge. Overall the numbers you are putting out are quite irrelevant in my eyes, as I am not in the raid to top meters, but to keep the group alive during high dmg phases. The fact that I can spread riptides before these high dmg phases much more effectively if glyphed just seems to give me more throughput during this phase of high dmg. I understand that if you want to get higher in meters and compete with druids or maybe even discs the unglyphed version is better but to be honest I prefer to play with my fellow healers as a team and not to compete with them.

So while unglyphed version might give you some higher numbers during low dmg phases, as you can "steal" some heal from another healer, I do not think it will result in more effective healing or help you do your job better, which is group healing during high dmg phases.