The incoming nerf to healing in PvP

[Tyrannica]

With the incoming nerf to healing in PvP are there any plans to compensate Ret Paladins who rely on self healing for defense?
No, we felt healing in the game in general needed to be reduced. (WarcraftDevs)

Just noticed it on the front page.

Thats a pretty big change, just thought, why not play finally a ret, if my dk cannot get ashbringer, not even the corrupted one, and i will have some fine self heals,too, i guess i rather try the demon hunter now, who is more about mobility and preventing incoming dmg similar to a rogue.

This must be better in a world with reduced healing in pvp. However, i wonder if they keep their promise and in the end not much happened and the heal nerf is just a small one, and not noticable.

I think, many will agree, that full dedicated healers were always too powerful in the pvp environment. I played in all of MoP an rdruid. And he felt too powerful in comparission to a dd. Especially with less gear on and especially with lower skill at hand. A nerf was long overdue.

I wouldn't mind pvp settings with only dd specs either.

[Deleted]

Is this true?? If so about fucking time- healing is good but self heals are such bullshit. Get a guy down to 5% only for him to get back up to nearly full in one bubble, stun or LoS. Then they just whittle you down, sure if i had "two lives" i could beat you again. Colliseum is a nightmare if you don't have self heals then watching two healers fight it out for half an hour only to roll for the win is just a joke

[Iannis]

Uh, missed something here. I thought they already reduced healing in pvp by 15%? Or has that not gone through yet?
This upcoming nerf is for WoD or Legion?

[Tyrannica]

Is this true?? If so about fucking time- healing is good but self heals are such bullshit. Get a guy down to 5% only for him to get back up to nearly full in one bubble, stun or LoS. Then they just whittle you down, sure if i had "two lives" i could beat you again. Colliseum is a nightmare if you don't have self heals then watching two healers fight it out for half an hour only to roll for the win is just a joke

i agree the selfheal of a bubbleknight feels like BS, but, remember, what else can that ret provide? Or is iconic for? If that is removed i do not see a reasion to play this spec. So, i have not a problem with this at all. In wotlk palas were really powerful, even better heals and bubbles, but insane burst dmg, too. He is easy today to deal with.

Fully dedicated healers are the main concern for many pvp situations, especially in bgs. like your team got no healer? too bad. And i played one, and its really op in comparission to a humble melee, no matter how good he is handled, a healer has much more impact. Played a lot arenas and rbgs with rdruid still too powerful, rating does not change this at all, actually i felt even more powerful.

How can heal specs stay op and tanks stay usless with debuffs? not that i would like to see more tanks in pvp, but with a class that got a tank spec i must view this as a waste if i would play only pvp? Demon hunters are again a class without heal, but a tank spec.

is this fair, not it isn't.

- - - Updated - - -

Uh, missed something here. I thought they already reduced healing in pvp by 15%? Or has that not gone through yet?
This upcoming nerf is for WoD or Legion?

no idea, i found that on the front side at the news. An oversight would be useful to stop this confusion.

[Thallidomaniac]

How can heal specs stay op and tanks stay usless with debuffs? not that i would like to see more tanks in pvp, but with a class that got a tank spec i must view this as a waste if i would play only pvp? Demon hunters are again a class without heal, but a tank spec.

Tanks in PvP are only fun to play for the player themselves, and are not fun to deal with both as a teammate and as an enemy. But yes, more nerfs to self-healing would probably push tanks further out of viability. Prot Warriors would suffer quite heavily in particular, as Warrior self-healing was never the greatest when Second Win(d) got changed in WoD.

[Tyrannica]

Tanks in PvP are only fun to play for the player themselves, and are not fun to deal with both as a teammate and as an enemy. But yes, more nerfs to self-healing would probably push tanks further out of viability. Prot Warriors would suffer quite heavily in particular, as Warrior self-healing was never the greatest when Second Win(d) got changed in WoD.

my point was not whatever it is fun for you or the other players if you play a tank spec, but that a tank spec in any given class just takes away options if you want to play rated pvp as the devs of this game wiped out tanks in rated pvp. The demon hunter will also just be another class with 1 spec less to use, while sometimes classes can have 2-3 options how to play their class in rated pvp. This needs to be reviewed.

I would remove all tank specs anyways from this game and replace the tanking mechanic with something else, as its a waste of a spec for a class. I mean there are some mmos that work without dedicated tanks and its just a burden in pvp.

[Patife17]

Healing got nerfed 15% in PvP like....2 weeks ago or so.

[Reveries1]

thread should be locked as its misleading and these changes went out already.

[Theed]

MMO Champion slow as always on tweets. Change has been ingame for 2 weeks or something. Feral and especially Enhance still need at least a 30% nerf to instant heals. (Maelstrom Weapon and Predatory Swiftness heals)

[Itisamuh]

I wish they would leave self only heals alone (as in, heals that can ONLY be cast on yourself, such as recuperate) but nerf the crap out of heals that can be thrown at others, even when used on yourself. Healers have been way too strong for a long time, and just make too much of a difference.

[Theylor]

Nerf heals across the board by 60%, reduce burst damage bonus by 50%, increase Hp by 50%, increase mana cost of all healing spells by 250%, remove self heals from pure dps classes and make hybrids have to cast their healing spells.


pulled all this stuff out of my ass in a few seconds.

did a better job than the incompetent blizzard crew making millions.

[Deleted]

I wouldn't mind pvp settings with only dd specs either.

And turn the game into a retarded Call of Duty "who kills who first" fest?


What a great idea, have people level characters from 1 to 100, have them gear up, have them talent, glyph, make a few macros, have them queue up and have them die in 3 seconds.

At this stage the little heroes in DOTA and LoL have more survive ability than WoW characters. Its absurd.

[Lazuli]

Tanks in PvP are only fun to play for the player themselves, and are not fun to deal with both as a teammate and as an enemy. But yes, more nerfs to self-healing would probably push tanks further out of viability. Prot Warriors would suffer quite heavily in particular, as Warrior self-healing was never the greatest when Second Win(d) got changed in WoD.

Tanks only make sense as flag carriers in pvp, otherwise you should not be able to queue as one.

Oh and the pvevp battlegrounds

[Saberstrike]

Let's cut to the chase: Bring back 50% mortal strike already!

[Professor Expert]

The solution to PvP healing is not a blanket reduction in healing effectiveness, it's a targeted approach that relies on a simple, well-devised diminishing returns paradigm:

The Prof's Improved Battle Fatigue:

• When you are healed, you automatically get a stacking healing reduction debuff equal to 1/2 of the percentage of your total HP that the last heal recovered, but only if the heal was cast by a healing class.
• Duration of debuff can be tweaked, but let's just go with 10 sec.
• The duration gets reset whenever the debuff gains a stack that is 2% or more in a single heal. The point of this is to not break HoTs because they could potentially reset the debuff permanently and we do not want healing to be entirely ineffective.
• The debuff should be capped at a fairly high amount, like 75%, meaning that after a certain point heals to you will be 25% of their original potency, but it should never get to a point where you cannot be healed at all.

Examples:

- You are at 100% HP and you are over-healed by HoTs. No debuff.

- You are at 75% HP and a healer heals you to full, which means you gained 25% of your HP back in that heal. You gain a debuff that reduces healing effectiveness on you by (25% the amount of your HP recovered in the heal * 0.5) = 12.5%

- If your were healed from 75% to 100% over the course of several heals, the debuff would stack until it reaches 12.5%.

- Overhealing does not affect the debuff nor does overhealing reset the timer, but there is a potential issue with HoTs. If you have HoTs on you and are at 100%, take a hit, then the HoT ticks and heals you, the debuff would reset. This is why we require a heal to be 2% or more of your total HP to trigger a reset on the debuff ticker. Even though the duration does not reset, the HoT will still contribute to the amount of healing reduction. Note that if a HoT crits and is 2% or more of your HP, the debuff would reset.

- This debuff would not be triggered by or affected by healing from non-healing specs, however the presence of the debuff on you will reduce ALL incoming healing including self-heals.

What this debuff does is force healers to play tactically using well timed heals, not spamming heals and living forever. It naturally scales with group size, because in a small group like 2v2 or 3v3, healers will be healing the same target a lot more often thus causing the debuff to ramp up more quickly and reset in duration more often, but in a 10v10 setting, heals will be more distributed over multiple targets so the debuff would not ramp up nearly as quickly.

It solves the problem of healers in 2s and 3s without making them bad in RBGs or other large-group settings. The debuff does not affect pve healing at all. With some tweaks on the variables like its duration, the % healed required to trigger a reset on the duration and the max duration itself can be tuned based on the stated of the game.

If my version of battle fatigue were to be implemented, many CCs could be reduced in effectiveness, and have their CDs increased. That should be part of the deal with this debuff...because CC spam is still a big problem.

[Ryuushima]

bloodline champions had an awesome healing system, where you were actually healed back for gray health that slowly decayed and the cap of gray health would only be like 30% above what your real health is. So if managed well you could still keep someone up for quite some time but no more silly stuff where someone is brought to 5% hp and then back to 100%.

[Demsi]

Nerf heals across the board by 60%, reduce burst damage bonus by 50%, increase Hp by 50%, increase mana cost of all healing spells by 250%, remove self heals from pure dps classes and make hybrids have to cast their healing spells.


pulled all this stuff out of my ass in a few seconds.

did a better job than the incompetent blizzard crew making millions.

yeah no, that would be awful

[Deleted]

Nerf heals across the board by 60%, reduce burst damage bonus by 50%, increase Hp by 50%, increase mana cost of all healing spells by 250%, remove self heals from pure dps classes and make hybrids have to cast their healing spells.


pulled all this stuff out of my ass in a few seconds.

did a better job than the incompetent blizzard crew making millions.

That's hilarious. Sounds like you're pulling numbers from your rear-end, but go try that out on a private server and see how it goes for you. Guarantee you'd regret it instantly.

[therealstegblob]

While they always sort of make all these "we're re-balancing pvp and nerfing healing!!" promises at the start of expansions, they seem to be doing them this time around with a lot more zeal and self-awareness.

I doubt it'll make PvP much better, but with all these promises to do away with gear-based pvp, overpowerful sustainability and the whole thing, who knows what we have i store?

[Osmeric]

Healing is fine now, and I say that as someone who plays a holy paladin and resto shaman in PvP.