[Pre-Beta] Vengeance Discussion

[Munkky]

Yeah it feels more Rogue esque though. It does a vapor like thing around you and you jump to the front of the enemy. I like the animation for it. Honestly, think Nightcrawler from X-Men, thats pretty much exactly what it is.

[Cooper]

So one would only ever use it if they are out of Infernal Strike charges, which would require using Infernal Strike more than once every ten seconds.

How good is a talent that does what a baseline ability does, except worse in every way? I mean, I can see the whole "Infernal Strike to a group of adds, Hunt back to boss" angle, but apparently one would only be able to do that once every thirty seconds, and even then it would still be better to Infernal Strike there and Infernal Strike back.

[Promdates]

Brand is basically Transcendence from monks.

[Delimit]

Brand is basically Transcendence from monks.

It's much closer to Shadowstep than Transcendence. (Transcendence being far more useful) The range definitely needs to be pushed out to 40 yards. If for some reason you've talented Abyssal Strike, you can actually Infernal Strike further than you can teleport. I would agree that it's a pretty redundant talent, since nearly every situation that you would want to brand teleport, you could just leap.

[Argeln]

So if Legion were to hit today - in which state would you testers say that Vengeance is as a spec compared to the other tanks? I'm really questioning rerolling from protection warrior, so I'd like to know how they fare against the others (not withstanding that there might be changes as we get closer to launch).

[Munkky]

As of right this moment they are middle ground tank wise, but in another patch or two Pallys are getting nerfed, monks are getting buffed, so its hard to say. If you had to rank them right now, I think its DH is roughly tied with Warrior at 3/4th best tank of 6.

[Argeln]

As of right this moment they are middle ground tank wise, but in another patch or two Pallys are getting nerfed, monks are getting buffed, so its hard to say. If you had to rank them right now, I think its DH is roughly tied with Warrior at 3/4th best tank of 6.

Allright, so not bad but not great either. The bigger question though (although highly subjective) is: Is it fun to play?

[Promdates]

Are you capping on Pain? If yes, cast Fracture
Are you capping on Pain, and need heals? cast Soul Cleave
Is Felblade off CD? If yes, cast Felblade
If none of the above, cast Shear.

[Delimit]

Fracture if you talented it.
Fel Eruption if you talented it.
Felblade if you talented it.

IMO, that's really the biggest issue right now. Beyond the survivability disparities between the top 2 tanks and everyone else that will hopefully be taken care of in a tuning pass.

[ueours]

Soul shard with players like ice mage and monks,Article or fractured souls have new resources as the warlock.

[Manu9]

Sometimes the little things are the things that are fun; Neltharion's dungeon's last boss has a few knockbacks, but as Veng it's not felt really, you have Brand, Felblade, and Leap to negate all of them. Just felt a bit nice because you as a tank made the melee life a bit easier as the boss had not moved, and so on.

[Delimit]

Fel Devastation Unleash the fel within you, damaging enemies directly in front of you for [ 10 + 1,100% 1,650% of AP ] Fire damage over 2 sec. Causing damage also heals you for up to 0 health. Vengeance Demon Hunter - Level 100 Talent. 300 Pain. 20 yd range. 2 sec cast (Channeled). 60 sec cooldown.

Fel Eruption Impales the target for [ 1,400% of AP 100;] Chaos damage and stuns them for 2 sec. Inflicts an additional 100% 0% damage against targets permanently immune to stuns. Demon Hunter - Level 30 Talent. 20 Fury / 200 Pain. 20 yd range. Instant. 25 sec cooldown. 35 sec cooldown.

Fracture Brutally slam your target for [ 500% [ 750% of AP ] Physical damage, and shatter two Lesser Soul Fragments from them. Vengeance Demon Hunter - Level 15 Talent. 400 Pain. Melee range. Instant.

Spirit Bomb Launch a nearby Soul Fragment at your target, exploding for [ 150% [ 75% of AP ] Shadow damage in a 6 yd radius. Damaged enemies become Frail for 10 sec, increasing your chance to shatter Lesser Soul Fragments from them with Shear. Vengeance Demon Hunter - Level 60 Talent. 30 yd range. Instant.

Immolation Aura Engulf yourself in flames, instantly causing [ 220% [ 330% of AP ] Fire damage to enemies within 8 yards and radiating [ 50% [ 75% of AP ] Fire damage every sec. Lasts 6 sec. Generates 20 Pain over 6 sec. Demon Hunter - Vengeance Spec. Instant. 15 sec cooldown.

Shear Shears an enemy for (250% 375% of weapon damage) Physical damage, and has a small chance to shatter a Lesser Soul Fragment from your target that heals you for 0 health when consumed. Generates 10 Pain. Demon Hunter - Vengeance Spec. Melee range. Instant.

Sigil of Flame Place a Sigil of Flame at the target location that activates after 2 sec. Deals [ 275% [ 412.5% of AP ] Fire damage, and an additional [ AP [ 150% of AP ;] Fire damage over 6 sec, to all enemies affected by the sigil. Demon Hunter - Vengeance Spec. 30 yd range. Instant. 3 sec cooldown.

Many of the icons have been changed.

[Cooper]

Was Spirit Bomb really doing that much damage that it needed a nerf? Huh.

[Delimit]

I was sad to see the Fel Eruption nerf, I really liked how hard it hit before. Fracture and Immolation Aura's damage feel excellent now. I ran a quick heroic to try them out:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...B#type=summary

[Orloth]

It is interesting that our damage was raised by 50% across the board with Spirit Bomb being the only exception (50% lower). I didn't think Spirit Bomb was even a dps increase. It's on the GCD right?

---

Yeah, that's a sizable chunk of healing. Probably would have been even better if your Demon Spikes uptime was better. Can you break down how much of that was from the ring and how much of that was from the artifact talent?

- - - Updated - - -

Have you tried the Cloak of Fel Flames yet?

[Delimit]

Eruption was nerfed too, it's no longer critting for 1.2m

Sorry, I was mistaken, I was looking at different logs for the leech ring. They were unlisted from a friend and I don't have a link anymore. That healing was all meta. I did end up breaking it down between runs though, and it was roughly half-ish of all leech healing done (I had a DS/Meta crossover throwing off the exact numbers). I'll grab a public one tomorrow to verify.

On the one I linked, I was wearing the cloak. 20% is 20%, but it was hard to tell if it was doing much in that dungeon. I might give it another try on Ivanyr tomorrow, I think that the majority of the damage there is magic, and I already have logs to compare it to. Given our magic weakness outside of Empower Wards, it might be pretty nice to keep around. I will give Fel Devastation a shot as well.

[Deliverer]

How nerfed is fel eruption? Is it worth taking now or it's just a stun?
I won't be able to test it untill tonight

[Deleted]

The boots are a bit broken i think, you can lower fiery brand CD to somewhat like 20-23 s in singletarget. Its almost 50% uptime with the artifact trait

[mindw0rk]

With buff to dmg I see potential for crazy fire burst in pvp if you invest in Fiery Demise artifact trait. It will give 60% fire damage boost which will stack with Relentless Assault and Solitude for 90% total. Basically take Agonizing Flames (+100% immolation aura dmg), Burning Alive, cast Fiery Brand and in its 10 seconds duration activate all your fire dmg abilities:
Sigil of Flame + Immo Aura + Fel Devastation + Soul Carver + Felblade.

Thats
862% + 1560% + 1650% +1150% + 560% +500% from burning alive= 6282% core *90% bonus dmg = 11935% burst in less then 10 seconds which you can do every 1 minute. And since all of this is fire dmg it heals you for 15% too.

[Deleted]

How nerfed is fel eruption? Is it worth taking now or it's just a stun?
I won't be able to test it untill tonight

It does about the same damage as one use of Immolation Aura without Agonizing Flames so it's rip for now