Gorefiend M progress, need help on logs

[Deleted]

Hello,

Our guild is progressing Gorefiend mythic. (yes, a 150th topic...) We have over 100 wipes, and we're using Method's tactic but we have trouble getting some progress beyond first feast.

Could someone please take a look on these logs and tell what seems wrong/off? So far we were fine analysing it on our own but imho it would be informative for someone from "the outside" to check it out.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BC7vP21WpTkqfQVa

Setup on today's attempts (at least for most of the pulls):

HEALER MARK - MAGES (Eyes -> Gordhan -> Rani)
DPS MARK - WARRIORS (Swag -> Kickez)
BLUE MARK - HUNTERS (Ridai -> Vesses)

Thanks in advance.

[Kazkek]

imo there is too much trust put into using method's strats for HFC. They did this with terrible ilvl and are all very good players. Sometimes strategies that use low ilvl and good players does not equal easiest way to kill the boss when ilvls are inflated and there are mistakes being made.

Method's strat involves having 2-3 different stack points and have just 1 person responsible for each stack point. This is much more difficult than just having every person that is getting sent to the stomach to stack their corrupted soul in the middle of the room and using 3 people at most to cleave them down.

You have a warrior and a DK dps. Make the DK dps go unholy, look up what unholy DKs are doing on that fight and have the warrior and the DK cleave down the corrupted souls. Just those two classes alone would be enough, if you not add a hunter because their damage is really good for single targeting down the souls.

If you do this, then that will free up all your ranged dps to kill the other adds. We have our warlocks nuke down the essences when they come out with <35% health it gives them free embers or w/e.

I know changing up strats after so many attempts seems like a wrong direction, but you have too many people attacking the corrupted souls.

[Summer]

I'm going to agree with the poster above that I have a really hard time believing the Method strat is the easiest way to do this for most guilds. It ties up too many people, you want to use incidental AoE / cleave for steady damage and have 1-2 people responsible for finishing the souls off. The rest of your raid has better things to do like get constructs and the casters down asap.

Not to mention that it doesn't look to be working for you either since looking at

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pes=1&cutoff=3

you have 29 deaths to Digest meaning they didn't get broken out in time, that being by far the leading cause of your wipes :P

[nephzor]

you could litteraly have 1 stack point and have the DK go unholy and solo souls at his gear level he/she shouldnt have a problem doing it, if the damage on souls is low, have the warrior or a hunter help execute the souls. like the above posters said, method strat involves too many people and requires atleast 3 people watching souls and dpsing them down, compared to having 1 stack point and 1-2 melee doing it, while ranged kill the adds.

[Deja Thoris]

On top of what was mentioned you have one warlock doing 3x the damage of the other raiders to the adds

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...one&target=150

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...one&target=146

Qicia and Groz the hunters are doing nothing but tunneling the boss. If they hit anything else its almost an accident. Mages aren't much better.

The mantra for this fight is simple. Hit the adds.

I also dislike Methods strat. Collective responsibility might world for the worlds best guilds but who do you ask to improve when 30 people die to digest? You need to be able to point a finger to Joe and Pete and say "its your responsibility" and if they are out with doom or w/e then Johnny takes over. At the moment you have people dying and thats the end of it.

[Kikazz]

Hello,

Our guild is progressing Gorefiend mythic. (yes, a 150th topic...) We have over 100 wipes, and we're using Method's tactic but we have trouble getting some progress beyond first feast.

Could someone please take a look on these logs and tell what seems wrong/off? So far we were fine analysing it on our own but imho it would be informative for someone from "the outside" to check it out.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BC7vP21WpTkqfQVa

Setup on today's attempts (at least for most of the pulls):

HEALER MARK - MAGES (Eyes -> Gordhan -> Rani)
DPS MARK - WARRIORS (Swag -> Kickez)
BLUE MARK - HUNTERS (Ridai -> Vesses)

Thanks in advance.

This fight is annoying, it took our guild 114 attempts, i can give you details on our strat, but changing a strat after 100+ attempts might jolt your raiders.

havign 1 stack for the dps, and 1 stack for the healers, is good.

we usualyl have these stack points in front of the boss.

we have our melee focus the terror that the tanks go, and backup range, other then that range are 100% of the time on the adds, constructs essences, then terror (tank Add), then after everything is dead then they can go for the boss.

looking at your logs, some dps are using there cds on the pull, which is stupid, doesnt matter if they are 2 min cds, and will be up for the first feast, its wasted if they get sucked in on first marks, they should wait 5-10 seconds into the pull, or better to just wait and use them on the first feast with lust.

you arent getting past the 1st feast due to add control.

easiest way to control adds our group found, was after each feast sacrifice a dps to go in when tank goes down, this way they can dps the contructs on the inside as well as help on the tank add.

all other dps on the inside should dps constructs to 50% then move to the next, your dps seem to be focusing the adds till they die and some adds are getting through at 100% and Usain Bolting into a healer/dps and killing them thus stalling your progress.

when i get home ill go over your logs more thoroughly and if you want i can pm you, or post here my more informative information.

this is just what i can se at a quick glance.

[Puggs]

We literally killed this last night, we had major problems with people's priorities in what to get down. We ended up doing a few pulls without anyone doing any dps to Gorefiend on the pull and having everyone just focussing on what spawns. Slowly then we started to re-introduce opening on Gorefiend but with the caveat that he is the absolute lowest priority. We got him on the 3rd Feast with some last pull magic, so as long as you have everyone alive for the feast he goes down.

We had the 1 stacking point with a Warrior taking them down with myself(DK) as backup if he was busy. We assigned ranged to Essences > Constructs, and DK's on the spirit (we have 3), however priorities slide around depending on what is around at the time. Communication between the warrior and other backups to ensure everyone kept on top of freeing people.

[Ridai]

Thank you all for your comments, we really appreciate all the help we can get.

The logs are mine, unfortunately I got DC'd yesterday and forgot to /combatlog right away, so couple of our tries aren't there in the log.
I think we managed to get to the second feast yesterday and that was our best try so far, but our main problem is that too many people die way too early - mostly due to Digest (which we believe is also a result of poeple doing small mistakes that take them in da belly, and the snowball goes on and on and on..). So we thought that dpsing souls is the biggest issue and tried different ways to cope with that, unfortunately with no noticeable luck tbh.


I just wanted to add this, in the defence of my fellow hunters:

Qicia and Groz the hunters are doing nothing but tunneling the boss. If they hit anything else its almost an accident. Mages aren't much better.

Qicia and Groznyj were with us yesterday only for 6 of those 18 wipes, that's why their damage on adds is low compared to everyone else. Mages were on soul duty but ofc they should focus adds over boss anyway.

[Adramelch]

looking at your logs, some dps are using there cds on the pull, which is stupid, doesnt matter if they are 2 min cds, and will be up for the first feast, its wasted if they get sucked in on first marks, they should wait 5-10 seconds into the pull, or better to just wait and use them on the first feast with lust.

That's just flat out wrong in the case of 2min cooldowns. If you use them 5-10 seconds into the pull then they won't be up for the start of the feast and you won't have your CDs up for like half the duration of the ring. On the other hand, how is not using them at all better than "misusing" them on pull?

3mins and up you keep for the feast obviously.

[Deja Thoris]

Qicia and Groznyj were with us yesterday only for 6 of those 18 wipes, that's why their damage on adds is low compared to everyone else. Mages were on soul duty but ofc they should focus adds over boss anyway.

It's irrelevant. Look at their total damage, look how much was done to the boss. (More than 75%) If you're stuggling with this fight and wipe before a feast then I'd expect lots of damage to other stuff (60%) and boss (40%). This generally isn't the case for you raid. I know it won't happen because of the rampant "MUST HIT BOSS" syndrome that infects most guilds but try not hitting the boss until the feast and see if you can start getting there cleanly. Then you can start re-introducing boss damage outside of feasts.

With most of your players at 725-730 you need to beat a new mindset into them. Mechanics matter.

[Deleted]

Thanks for all the responses. Today we ordered our DPSes to avoid hitting the boss for a bunch of wipes, and afterwards got back to "open fire" after our add-wise performance improved. This worked fine, even though we were forced to 4-heal it.

[Greylan]

Do you have a sub rogue with soul cap? We use a rogue to one shot the add in his stomach at the start of the fight, makes getting to the first feast super smooth. This video illustrates how we do it -- it may also work with other classes that use the soul capacitor. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZazNUrKy5JI

[Deiae]

greylan, that is a very cool strat. I really hope it works on an enhancement shaman as well or a relatively low geared rogue (reroll). your rogue is at 733 now. is it ever tight or unreliable for your gear to pull this off?

[Greylan]

It's never tight, and I was probably 730'ish when we first tried it and it wasn't tight then. The only danger is DPS down there forgetting they can focus on skellies and trying to help on the big add, which of course makes him leave too early. I'd say your rogue reroll would definitely be fine (again, your enhance shaman might too with his CD's up, we've never tried one) and even if the add isn't killed by it, it will come up with such low health it'll die in a hurry.

[Deleted]

Thanks for your opinions.

What is the preferable healing every healer should be doing inside the belly to the essences? Our healers mostly make above 1.5M, mostly closer to 2M.

[Stenulf]

Have additional players enter the stomach so you always have one extra player in there. Also if you have rogues force them to use crippling poison and harras those skeletons that manage to get out. This will make it very easy for your casters.

[Deleted]

You're talking about sending a dps when tank gets sucked in?

[chronia]

Thanks for your opinions.

What is the preferable healing every healer should be doing inside the belly to the essences? Our healers mostly make above 1.5M, mostly closer to 2M.

i don't see why there would be a magical preferable number. We never looked at numbers, but at how the adds came out. No essences coming out is best ofc (but impossible i guess during progress), but its better to have lets say 2 coming out at 30% then 1 coming out at 10% and the other at lets say 70%. Just tell em to make sure that no come out with more then 40% HP, this should make sure they get max 1 cast off, and most of the time not even 1 cast (pref sub 30% so more classes can execute them when coming out).

Same goes for the skeletons, if you can't kill them all (which is likely pretty much impossible during progress) aim to get them all low, so they come out in execute range, then to kill a bunch and have the rest come out at high HP. Hunters / Warlocks and prolly some other classes can pretty much one shot everything that comes out at 20 (a bit higher even for hunters) or less % HP left. This will make sure you have fast clean up and no skeletons that can pop their speed buff and hit someone due to that.

[Deleted]

I'm only asking about the number because their seems to be a number of occasions when essences are leaving belly with quite some health, and healers are mostly doing the healing I mentioned - hearing on YT that one needs to do about 1M healing was laughable based on our experience so that's where my question arose.

[chronia]

I'm only asking about the number because their seems to be a number of occasions when essences are leaving belly with quite some health, and healers are mostly doing the healing I mentioned - hearing on YT that one needs to do about 1M healing was laughable based on our experience so that's where my question arose.

Ah, i see, we do have the experience that some classes are better at healing them efficiently then others. I think disc priest are not so great at healing them up. But in the end each class should be able to get them lower then 40-30% at all times without to much problems.