#FreetheNipple

[Drutt]

I'd rather men were encouraged to cover up, to be honest. I don't particularly want to be around half naked people at all.

[ellieg]

Trying to use animals with no sense of self to compare to human behavior is a fool's game.

Try bonobos. The female is just as, if not more, outgoing than males, particularly in the case of sexual encounters. They're also the closest human relation, and can pass the mirror test. If you want a look at another side, try common chimps.. territorial bastards they are, but it's the females that are outgoing and find new places while the males tend to be homebodies that stick with their brothers. For sex? They don't fight over mates. They fight over land and territory because again.. territorial bastards.

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You know what, the patriarchy posted that. Goddamn patriarchy.


Actually, yes, they do sometimes. Great Apes in general apparently do on occasion, but not often.

I know im just posting my opinion on what makes the best society. Most of it has to do with hormones. Estrogen and testosterone are very different and I personally believe they are the biggest motivators in how we act. You can do whatever you want. Im not going to fight any law that lets you walk around with your boobs out. Im saying I personally would prefer that women don't. I believe that if a law were to pass, you would rarely see any women shirtless anyway. They are fighting for the right to do it, and all the more power to them, but I think they are ignoring what makes women, women.

[TwistedSkull]

If they wanna be sexualized then let them.

[Underverse]

I know im just posting my opinion on what makes the best society. Most of it has to do with hormones. Estrogen and testosterone are very different and I personally believe they are the biggest motivators in how we act. You can do whatever you want. Im not going to fight any law that lets you walk around with your boobs out. Im saying I personally would prefer that women don't. I believe that if a law were to pass, you would rarely see any women shirtless anyway. They are fighting for the right to do it, and all the more power to them, but I think they are ignoring what makes women, women.

Modesty isn't a sex-segregated trait.

[Vanyali]

I know im just posting my opinion on what makes the best society. Most of it has to do with hormones. Estrogen and testosterone are very different and I personally believe they are the biggest motivators in how we act. You can do whatever you want. Im not going to fight any law that lets you walk around with your boobs out. Im saying I personally would prefer that women don't. I believe that if a law were to pass, you would rarely see any women shirtless anyway. They are fighting for the right to do it, and all the more power to them, but I think they are ignoring what makes women, women.

Most of what your opinion is based on isn't based in fact, however. That's the major issue. It's based on "well this is my belief of how things work, even though they don't".

Men and women have varying levels of estrogen and testosterone within each group. Me? I've got next to no estrogen naturally. You can waffle on what this means, but I can tell you I can grow a stubble-beard fairly easily, tend to be more aggressive than most other women I've met, and a variety of other "non-womanly" traits naturally.

There are men with higher levels than estrogen that can't grow a beard, tend to be more timid, and have "non-manly" traits naturally.

The point being.. working with "well, you're a man, so you're [x]" and "you're a woman, so you fall in [y]" and ignoring that variations exist is foolish. Pretending that they're the be-all end-all for all behavior is also foolish. It ignores that people are PEOPLE and instead insists on building a society where people are cardboard cutouts without their own thought.

Culture? Far more powerful than "nature" in humans. Culture tends to override instincts. It also creates new ones - instinctually, we're not really monogamous for our entire life. Culturally? Yeah, we are. But there's zero evidence of it being a trait that expands beyond childrearing, and many things that point toward humans behind periodically monogamous.

Seeing boobs? Not an instinctual thing to fantasize and freak out about. Naturally, they're not much different than seeing an ass. Something you look at, say "niiice" sometimes, and move on.

[ellieg]

Most of what your opinion is based on isn't based in fact, however. That's the major issue. It's based on "well this is my belief of how things work, even though they don't".

Men and women have varying levels of estrogen and testosterone within each group. Me? I've got next to no estrogen naturally. You can waffle on what this means, but I can tell you I can grow a stubble-beard fairly easily, tend to be more aggressive than most other women I've met, and a variety of other "non-womanly" traits naturally.

There are men with higher levels than estrogen that can't grow a beard, tend to be more timid, and have "non-manly" traits naturally.

The point being.. working with "well, you're a man, so you're [x]" and "you're a woman, so you fall in [y]" and ignoring that variations exist is foolish. Pretending that they're the be-all end-all for all behavior is also foolish. It ignores that people are PEOPLE and instead insists on building a society where people are cardboard cutouts without their own thought.

Culture? Far more powerful than "nature" in humans. Culture tends to override instincts. It also creates new ones - instinctually, we're not really monogamous for our entire life. Culturally? Yeah, we are. But there's zero evidence of it being a trait that expands beyond childrearing, and many things that point toward humans behind periodically monogamous.

Seeing boobs? Not an instinctual thing to fantasize and freak out about. Naturally, they're not much different than seeing an ass. Something you look at, say "niiice" sometimes, and move on.

Im well aware and have stated many times that this is just my opinion. You called out my opinion but the rest of your post is just your opinion. This is why I normally don't talk to you. We are both heavily set in our views.

[Elegiac]

I'd rather men were encouraged to cover up, to be honest. I don't particularly want to be around half naked people at all.

I don't particularly want to be around people that wear Abercrombie and Fitch clothing but, there you go.

[Vanyali]

Im well aware and have stated many times that this is just my opinion. You called out my opinion but the rest of your post is just your opinion. This is why I normally don't talk to you. We are both heavily set in our views.

...no, my post isn't an opinion. This is what we KNOW anthropologically. Calling it an opinion because you haven't bothered to study anthropology or humans and just stick with "i know what i know" is why you insist on making some of the odd leaps you do about "nature".

Humans aren't a very "natural" species. We haven't been for a long while. Right around the time of language.

[Jotaux]

With how many people on here that are so against public breastfeeding, I find it odd and a little contradicting that this is met with such acceptance, followed by comments like - "it's natural, so why shouldn't they?".

I thought most were fine as long as the person doesn't get mad when people stare.

[ellieg]

...no, my post isn't an opinion. This is what we KNOW anthropologically. Calling it an opinion because you haven't bothered to study anthropology or humans and just stick with "i know what i know" is why you insist on making some of the odd leaps you do about "nature".

Humans aren't a very "natural" species. We haven't been for a long while. Right around the time of language.

The stuff you talked about with varying levels of hormones is factual. Most that follows is your opinion. When you start talking about how things "should" be, that's opinion.

[BuckSparkles]

I don't particularly want to be around people that wear Abercrombie and Fitch clothing but, there you go.

Why are you judging books by their covers?

[Mehrunes]

You know what, the patriarchy posted that. Goddamn patriarchy.

You make this excuse so often that I'm beginning to think you're not telling the truth and use the patriarchy as a scapegoat <.<

[Vanyali]

The stuff you talked about with varying levels of hormones is factual. Most that follows is your opinion. When you start talking about how things "should" be, that's opinion.

Please find where I said "this is how things should be" in my post.

Culture overrides instinct. Fact.
People vary quite wildly in hormonal levels (among other things). Fact.

Trying to argue against those because you want it to be simple to reduce people to labels? Not a fact.

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You make this excuse so often that I'm beginning to think you're not telling the truth and use the patriarchy as a scapegoat <.<

Or maybe I'm just that big of a target for the patriarchy. They know about operation: moonbase and are trying to infiltrate!!!

[Deleted]

I don't see why not? This would bring gender equality leaps and bounds closer.

Time to strangle the monkey...

[Mehrunes]

Or maybe I'm just that big of a target for the patriarchy. They know about operation: moonbase and are trying to infiltrate!!!

Ohhhh, that explains Nixx calling you a bee in another thread. You're like the matriarch of all womyn?

[Vanyali]

Ohhhh, that explains Nixx calling you a bee in another thread. You're like the matriarch of all womyn?

wait i got called a bee? NIXX you got some explain' to do!

And I can't tell you about our structure, the patriarchy will see!

[BuckSparkles]

I don't see why not? This would bring gender equality leaps and bounds closer.

Time to strangle the monkey...

Yes, I am sure allowing women to flop their boobs about is SUCH a leap.

Comparable to allowing women to vote, for sure!

[Saverem]

I also support #UpWithMiniSkirts

[Deleted]

I also support #UpWithMiniSkirts

"The Patriarchy is forcing women to wear clothing to cover up their body".
Lets do this.

[Deleted]

I've shared this idea with my gran and she's all for it.
May god have mercy on your souls.