[TV] The Wheel of Time

[Noxina]

I enjoyed it, once I managed to not compare it to the books.

The books are still there, now we just get another medium to enjoy.

[Adam Jensen]

To be honest they would of had a far better shot at telling a compelling story if they simply set it in the universe. The wheel of time is so heavy on inner dialogues I can't see any plausible way to covert that into another media without it just be inner monologues the tv series.

I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

Like

Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
The insular nature of the Two Rivers
Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.

[Celement]

I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

Like

Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
The insular nature of the Two Rivers
Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.

I can't see the wheel of time every working... the universe sure but so much of the plot is based around how characters infer from one another ( almost of the chosen work that way for their plots never mind main characters).

It is a decent universe to tell stories in... the borderlands pre the wheels of time story would of worked well or fall of the city that became a rival to the dark one...

Just the main plot is set and can't really be adapted to any other medium save audiobook.

[Mace]

I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

Like

Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
The insular nature of the Two Rivers
Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.

It's a poor adaptation - they shoulld do a reboot like Final fantasy did, and actually try and tell the actual story.

jordan literally wrote a series that should be super easy to adapt. just add some talent to really bring out the suspense, tension, the heroism, the magic and the wonder etc...

but as most people are saying, the show seems to be more concerned about preaching it's own message rather than telling the story that millions worldwide loved, and so ended up being a very mediocre production that was confusing, lacked any of the attachment and compelling immersion in the characters and ethos t, not to mention the mystery that had some sense to it, that are all present in the books.

You'd have to try really hard to mess it up this badly. They just wanted a platform to preach their message, so they converted a popular series .. I think they're genuinely shocked i'ts not popular, and are blaming every rfan critical of it for it's disappointing performance - everyone but themselves and their agenda driven adaptation.

[Rennadrel]

I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

Like

Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
The insular nature of the Two Rivers
Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.

Don't forget the gutting of Mat's story arc involving the dagger of Shadar Logoth, which literally ties him at the hip to Padan Fain (one of the more nefarious of the villains that is focused on) for the majority of the series.

- - - Updated - - -

It's a poor adaptation - they shoulld do a reboot like Final fantasy did, and actually try and tell the actual story.

jordan literally wrote a series that should be super easy to adapt. just add some talent to really bring out the suspense, tension, the heroism, the magic and the wonder etc...

but as most people are saying, the show seems to be more concerned about preaching it's own message rather than telling the story that millions worldwide loved, and so ended up being a very mediocre production that was confusing, lacked any of the attachment and compelling immersion in the characters and ethos t, not to mention the mystery that had some sense to it, that are all present in the books.

You'd have to try really hard to mess it up this badly. They just wanted a platform to preach their message, so they converted a popular series .. I think they're genuinely shocked i'ts not popular, and are blaming every rfan critical of it for it's disappointing performance - everyone but themselves and their agenda driven adaptation.

Which is kind of ironic when you think about it. The story is diverse, the story has great female characters and they are literally the power structure within it and some of the most prominent people of power within the series are also female monarchs, not to mention the Aes Sedai. The difference is that characters like Egwene and Nynaeve take time to build up, they have to go through their struggles, their moments of innocence and weakness as young women, before they get to that point. Egwene's experience with the Seanchan was definitely her coming out moment as far as her ability to channel and she develops wisdom through her training with the Aiel later on that helps her mature (and I feel like Sanderson kinda messed her up by making her hot headed in AMoL). Once Nynaeve breaks her barrier, it puts her on a pedestal that few Aes Sedai her age have held since the Age of Legends as far as her abilities and the fact that she kicks the ass of one of the Chosen is a pretty big deal. Why the fuck was all of that character development pigeonholed for a coming out moment that was supposed to belong to Rand at the end of the 8th episode?

[Shadowferal]

Dated last year...Wheel of Time Prequel Film Trilogy In The Works

Not seeing any movement...

[Rennadrel]

Dated last year...Wheel of Time Prequel Film Trilogy In The Works

Not seeing any movement...

Oh god, it'll be even worse, guaranteed.

[Mace]

Which is kind of ironic when you think about it. The story is diverse, the story has great female characters and they are literally the power structure within it and some of the most prominent people of power within the series are also female monarchs, not to mention the Aes Sedai.

I know right - and it goes to show that these people are not interested in diversity really, nor in equality - but their own weird cult-like crazed stuppurd super cranked up rhetoric. I went through the entire book series again between January and March 2022 - and RJ had it all. Strong women, different races/ethnicities, gay characters and homosexuality, even a form of transgenderism - while presenting an authentic world in terms of people that aren't fixed to some weird ideology the activists are leaning into. But in Jordan's work, everyone could Identify with something, men and women were not the same but overall seemed pretty even to me, unlike the show that seems to think they need to be "diverse" by rubbishing males, and changing an already well balanced story and world.

Once this phase passes in society people would look back and just write them all off as under some weird mental influence exacerbated by the placebo effect of rising global social media.

The difference is that characters like Egwene and Nynaeve take time to build up, they have to go through their struggles, their moments of innocence and weakness as young women, before they get to that point. Egwene's experience with the Seanchan was definitely her coming out moment as far as her ability to channel and she develops wisdom through her training with the Aiel later on that helps her mature (and I feel like Sanderson kinda messed her up by making her hot headed in AMoL). Once Nynaeve breaks her barrier, it puts her on a pedestal that few Aes Sedai her age have held since the Age of Legends as far as her abilities and the fact that she kicks the ass of one of the Chosen is a pretty big deal. Why the fuck was all of that character development pigeonholed for a coming out moment that was supposed to belong to Rand at the end of the 8th episode?

One of the things that Jordan's series does better than any other fantasy, including Tolkein is his character build up, all the characters get an incredible build up to their power levels, and it feels authentic, this is not easy to do, especially given how incredible their rise is - I mean in particular Rand and Egwene, Egwene doesn't have any Ta'veren help to get where she gets, but it works, better than any series I have read.

SO to the male characters, the 3 boys in particular achieve some incredible growth, and by the time of their final bloom in the last book, they are really incredible, but you totally buy it because of the story and the background and the build up done, although the show decides that this is not relevant nor is it important - because you know we have to make the Wheel of Time some woke Game of Thrones, rather than just make it what it is, Wheel of Time a book series I felt was superior to Game of Thrones.

[Gumble]

So they are casting white guys to play Asian parts, a black girl to play a ginger, and a ginger to play the golden-haired Elayne.


I'm...... wow..... all those times people said RJ was overly descriptive in his books to the point of annoynance...... I guess he wasn't nearly descriptive enough.


Thank goodness I'm beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show. I'll see more of it on youtube making fun of it than I will through Amazon. It makes me feel for LOTR fans.... you're in for a rough time.







(Oh, and before anyone says, "BUT THEY WERE THE BEST ACTORS!!!!"...... we all saw Season 1..... they didn't cast good actors, so just stop)

[Noxina]

So they are casting white guys to play Asian parts, a black girl to play a ginger, and a ginger to play the golden-haired Elayne.


I'm...... wow..... all those times people said RJ was overly descriptive in his books to the point of annoynance...... I guess he wasn't nearly descriptive enough.


Thank goodness I'm beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show. I'll see more of it on youtube making fun of it than I will through Amazon. It makes me feel for LOTR fans.... you're in for a rough time.







(Oh, and before anyone says, "BUT THEY WERE THE BEST ACTORS!!!!"...... we all saw Season 1..... they didn't cast good actors, so just stop)

Ironic how you decided to rant a bit, but you're "beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show". Just dont watch it if you dont like it? No need to come here and have some empty complaint about how actors look, as if that matters in a fantasy show. Atleast do like everyone else; have a fit over how they fucked up the show compared to the books.

Or just keep quiet, read the books again to cleanse your mind.

[Xath]

I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

Like

Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
The insular nature of the Two Rivers
Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.

I don't think it can be done as a live action. I believe it could be done animated but the problem is to actually give the story the room to breathe it needs each book needs at least 1 season and the entire story takes about 2 years real time so the actors and actresses would change too much to do that. But with animation you can definitely do that.

[jdbond]

Ironic how you decided to rant a bit, but you're "beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show". Just dont watch it if you dont like it? No need to come here and have some empty complaint about how actors look, as if that matters in a fantasy show. Atleast do like everyone else; have a fit over how they fucked up the show compared to the books.

Or just keep quiet, read the books again to cleanse your mind.

Agreed! Good riddance this tragedy I am shocked to see this comment section still gets few posts!

[Noxina]

Agreed! Good riddance this tragedy I am shocked to see this comment section still gets few posts!

I enjoyed Season 1 tbh, its not exactly the books, but that doesnt bother me much. I still have the amazing books to watch, and a new fantasy show to enjoy.

[Gumble]

Ironic how you decided to rant a bit, but you're "beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show". Just dont watch it if you dont like it? No need to come here and have some empty complaint about how actors look, as if that matters in a fantasy show. Atleast do like everyone else; have a fit over how they fucked up the show compared to the books.

Or just keep quiet, read the books again to cleanse your mind.

I have, on Knife of Dreams atm, working through the slog of mr Perrin and his obsessive hunt.

And posting on here about the silliness that Amazon is doing is laughing at the show, and lamenting for LOTR fans who are going to go through all of this soon.


if you enjoyed this show, more power to you, you must enjoy most things that are made

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

So when this show gets canceled in the coming months this will be shown to be as "successful" as the Shannara Chronicles.

^ This, lol.

It's a shit adaptation and a mediocre show. It's entertaining enough, I guess but I'll be absolutely blown away if this goes farther than season 2.

https://deadline.com/2022/07/the-whe...on-1235074082/

Moiraine Damodred and the One Power continues.

Amazon has handed an early Season 3 renewal to its fantasy epic series The Wheel of Time. The move, unveiled during the show’s Comic-Con presentation, comes ahead of the launch of Season 2 of the Rosamund Pike-fronted series.

[Tentim]

https://deadline.com/2022/07/the-whe...on-1235074082/

I wonder if the budget will be cut or of amazon will keep the production values despite the lack of audience interest. I've only seen three episodes myself and I'm not curious enough to check but it feels a lot like the star trek series.

They keep the series alive because they dont want to raise red flags around their other productions.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

I wonder if the budget will be cut or of amazon will keep the production values despite the lack of audience interest. I've only seen three episodes myself and I'm not curious enough to check but it feels a lot like the star trek series.

They keep the series alive because they dont want to raise red flags around their other productions.

Amazon has never had a problem cancelling a series before...and they renewed this even before season 2 premiered.

Also, "feels like the star trek series" isn't the dis you think it is.

[Katchii]

https://deadline.com/2022/07/the-whe...on-1235074082/

Consider me blown away then.

[Mace]

I wonder if the budget will be cut or of amazon will keep the production values despite the lack of audience interest. I've only seen three episodes myself and I'm not curious enough to check but it feels a lot like the star trek series.

They keep the series alive because they dont want to raise red flags around their other productions.

one day they will discover how the people they hire lay and manipulate social media buzz to pretend that their poor shows are more interesting and liked than they actually are.

What I suspect is happening is that to keep their jobs these guys are feeding their investors b/s reasons for the failure of the show or the poorer performances and then using social media and the access media that their fellow cohorts are in as evidence to support.

One day the investors are going to realise these guys have been b/sing them to keep their jobs and are actually making crap that really isn't that popular.

RJs the Wheel of Time was popular globally, and highly critically acclaimed, yet for some reason, the show runners felt they knew better and could alter his work for their own fantasies and think that thier "in the bubble" view of the world is what everyone would like.


As a result you got an excellent story turn out as mediocre run of the mill garbage with the same scenarios and set up like almost every show in the last 2-4 years has been. All the charm of the original work lost in the intersectional feminism, critical race theory activist conversions more interested in their own fanfic than that of the established author's.

The end result is a vastly inferior product and a far less interested global and national community - because frankly, they just don't relate tot he story in this changed format and don't like it enough.

Seriously, everything charming and unique or classic about the wheel of time, many of the good bits, are completely removed - and there is no justifiable or good reason for this.

Furthermore, the show looks cheap, the scenes often don't make sense - and none of this is what the author actually did - it literally ruins his work because it has the name of that work on it.

[Nynax]

I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

Like

Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
The insular nature of the Two Rivers
Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.

IMO a lot of what really "sells" a fantasy world on screen is when you don't take time to explain certain things and allow them to simply exist as an obvious fact for the audience to pick up on. So Moraine can give her speech on Manetherin (hell, Two Rivers folk are just as clueless as the audience there), and you can have people afraid of the Dark One's name without explanation until a character does a stupid. You show, not tell, and allow things to exist because that's just how they are here.

People were able to watch Lord of the Rings without an exposition of the politics of Elves or why they were "leaving." Movie only audiences had zero idea that dwarves and elves had beef until Gimili said something, and then you just accepted it. The history of Aragorn’s lineage and why he specifically was in exile isn't even explained in the movies, but you just kinda go with it. Book fans understood all the nuances, and the movie is better for it, but it didn't hurt the movies to include them without explaining them.