What do you think of the Judgement-Colossus style gameplay

[Deleted]

I've been playing a Ret from day 1, and i just cant connect ot this Judgement gamelpay, only strike when its on the target.

It doesnt feel rewarding at all
It doesnt feel fun to me.

what do you guys think?

Its pure and utter garbage.

[Religion-]

Some good Points :
Cons:
1) Clunky with HoPo builder/spender mechanic and causes loss of HoPo potential when target swapping/target dying. Holding back abilities does not 'feel good'.
2) The mechanic's affect on the rotation becomes less noticeable the more gear you acquire in ST situations. More Haste = Less Timing for the pooling+spending required. The mechanic begins to become less visible.
3) The amount of targets hit affects our AoE in a very real way as our Cleave is incredibly weak, and our AE is not dominant in any way, even after artifact traits are unlocked. The limitation of affected Targets further spotlights the ongoing AoE issue.

Pros:
1) Judging is what a Paladin does! And the actual animation/bounce effect are pretty cool.
2) The idea of a temporary combat situation brought about by using Judgment is not an adverse concept, just the implementation does not 'feel good'.

[Mr Rannik]

I like it but then again I re-rolled from Warrior for the decent artefacts/order hall so from my perspective it's like a much better Colossus Smash as you don't need to delay as much for it and it's far less of a problem if you don't.

My exact same thoughts.

It kinda fits the arms warrior playstyle from my former main but without having to be Odyn's errand bitch and be locked up in glorified Vyrkul pub where you can't even reach the tables while Paladins do the actual warrior things (barracks, sparring circles, a war table...)

[arrav]

I honestly just wish it would give you a buff instead of debuffing enemies, would make it much more flexible.

[Donalld]

It sucks. They are always trying to copy warriors and force warrior play style onto Ret it's stupid the spec should feel unique and fun above all else


First we were execute spam like warriors now we're like colossal smash warriors :/

[Haram]

A decent temporary fix to the judgment situation is to just work on a charge system.

This allows 100% uptime on judgment in ST situations (which we're pretty close to with 30% haste), and allows us to save charges for target swapping without severely gimping our damage output. That way greater judgment can be reworked to something good.

[Shelly]

It's not too bad.

I don't really worry about haste just yet - although haste is the new hit rating - we are getting secondary stats to the gills lately so haste will come along.

Ret AoE is weak, but the single target is absolutely brutal and will only get larger as the Ashbringer is filled out and more mastery is built up.

I can deal with that, but yes, it would be nice to have some more AoE especially with the emphasis on 5-mans where there's often small trash groups.

[Sanctos]

I could live with Divine Storm spreading judgment to all targets hit.

[Theholypally]

Don't like it.

Its boring, clunky, and incredibly unrewarding and it doesnt leave any engaging creativity.

Plust the judgment animation now is awful especially if you decide to play mass judgment or w.e. At least on beta mass judge had some flare.

[Deleted]

Quite honestly, after having spent this much time with it, it does make inquisition not feel that bad. It woukd be fine if it was a buff, but quite honestly, it was a mistake since day one. It makes no sense to have that system and the Holy power system. It reminds me of the fantasy of taking 30% extra damage from fury. It just doesn't work. Its a nuisance.

Also, i miss the days where mastery was our best stat. I don't like haste and crit because crit is a dice roll and haste depends on latency at any given time to get the most benefit of. Mastery was always a flat garanteed benefit. Oh well...

[Niroshi]

It made me go Enhancement.

[Triggered Fridgekin]

Garbage. Absolute garbage. They really went dumpster diving for ideas when it comes to this version of Retribution.

It made me go Enhancement.

Also this.

[Mr. Smith]

What's really bad about it is that it's the only mechanic we have that requires any thought.

I mean, I want to suggest making it less central to our rotation by only having it affect our longer-CD abilities like Execution Sentence and/or Wake of Ashes. But if you do that, then all you'd have to do most of the time is store and spend HoPo, which would be extremely boring.

I wish we still had the WoD style of talents, where the last tier had talents that each enabled different rotations. If you didn't like how mindless Final Verdict was, you could do an Inquisition-style buff management rotation with Seraphim, if you didn't like that you could do seal-twisting, etc.

As it is, it seems like if you don't like Judgment Smash, you're just SoL until at least 8.0, which sucks.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

Honestly I think I'd be fine with it if they would just change it to a buff on yourself rather than a debuff, Ret is fucking garbage when any sort of target-swapping needs to happen.

[Deleted]

I really dislike the playstyle dictated by Judgment and our new mastery.

At low haste levels it does nothing but hold you back: you must align both Judgment and your Holy Power generation to do the damage that Blizzard balanced us around. That does not happen baseline, so you are often forced to wait, even though you have 5 Holy Power to dump, so you do less damage.

At high haste levels it does nothing but hold you back: you can easily align both Judgment and your Holy Power generation, but you can only apply the debuff to 2-4 targets at best (if the chaining does not go derp), so you are always capped on cleaving and are still punished when you need to switch targets within ~9 seconds of using Judgment.
At least on a single target it stops being a nuisance, but that highlights how shitty the mechanic is - it only feels right when it is no longer a factor.

The spell and mastery simply feel like a limiter to the spec, and ditching the mechanic revolving around them would be a massive improvement to both the playstyle and the performance.

[Wondercrab]

It feels horribly awkward and baffling to me. It's the single mechanic than turns me off the idea of playing Retribution whenever I think about it. It just seems as though they thought Retribution needed an extra mechanic, then picked one at random to tack on to Judgement to give it some more depth. The unfortunate result is that it just doesn't feel fun to play with, however, nor does it fit well into the overall feel that Retribution has always had.

[Deleted]

I do not really like it, but I don't think it's the end of the world as some people act.

May not be the end of the world, but for be first time ever, it is the end of my pally being my main. Hell I have 3 toons as 110 while paladin is still rocking at 105

[Morally Grey Storm]

I do not really like it, but I don't think it's the end of the world as some people act.

It's not the end of the world sure, but it's not that interesting and engaging. It's not polished and thought out, and adds unnecessary complexity in areas where we are already struggling: aoe and target swaps.
And it actively clashes with combopoint mechanic.

These are the sources of frustration for most players, I believe.