Healers and Mana: A request for observations

[Edwardthehollow]

Fellow Healers,

How are you feeling about Mana regen in Legion? I'm playing a Holy Paladin this Expansion and I was curious how other classes were feeling.

Background: I've played a Resto Shaman in the past and always felt like I struggled for mana no matter how much spirit I stacked. I have not tried shaman in Legion though.

With Spirit gone, and mana normalized, do you feel mana starved in EN? Are you comfortable in Mythic+ runs? Do you have to quaff mana regen potions to feel competitive?

I personally feel like Holy Paladins are doing well. In my raids so far I can make my Mana go to about 5% at the end of every encounter and sit at the top of our healers. And not have to use any external regen. (I am also the lowest overhealing compared to our Holy Priest and Druid)

5 Mans, can be difficult occasionally, depending on the tank class and how fast we are going. But I feel like that is always the case. I don't feel stressed about it.

Thoughts from other healers?

[TheWindWalker]

I'm playing a Mistweaver and was healing a couple hours of Heroic Dragons attempts while timing my -50% Mana Usage cooldown, avoiding overhealing, and sitting in Soothing Mist rather than pumping more heals into a spiky tank once I realized they wouldn't just suddenly die from 75%. Still go OoM constantly.

It's like they designed healers around 20m Mythic wherein you can practically "take turns" and assign "you only need to cast this spell because you are [raid healer/tank healer/spot healer]" and anytime you deviate from that for certain classes you just simply go OoM if your DPS isn't silly high.

[Serath]

Rdruid here, I'm just doing 5 mans really, low Mythic+ right now. I haven't had to take a break for mana per se, but maybe the occasional, "wait about 10 sec to pull the boss," situations. As one would expect I find it almost entirely depends on my group. I was in a normal Darkheat thicket for a quick quest and it took forever and I could barely keep up. the next day with a barely higher iLVL we did Mythic Darkheart with a guild group and it went super smooth with no issues.

I have only done hard content with guildies and only with a pally tank. I have no input on the other classes.

[ThePants999]

Playing HPala, I've not raided yet (I main ret in raids), but in M+ dungeons I've been surprised by how hard it is to OOM. I mean, chain pulling, you've always got to make sure you grab a moment to drink after X amount of packs, but X is higher than I expected. Takes a lot of FoLs to drive that blue bar down!

[Djriff]

Holy Priest offspec here, I've found that if I don't just mindless spam expensive AoE spells and just spot heal i'll almost never go OoM. I do have to agree that healing seems to be targeted around a 20m group size. It'll be interesting to see how this continues to develop as the expansion goes on.

[Edwardthehollow]

Playing HPala, I've not raided yet (I main ret in raids), but in M+ dungeons I've been surprised by how hard it is to OOM. I mean, chain pulling, you've always got to make sure you grab a moment to drink after X amount of packs, but X is higher than I expected. Takes a lot of FoLs to drive that blue bar down!

This is pretty much what I experience in Mythic+ unless I'm running with our Brewmaster tank. He needs a lot of babysitting unfortunately.

[Thra]

I'm playing a Mistweaver and was healing a couple hours of Heroic Dragons attempts while timing my -50% Mana Usage cooldown, avoiding overhealing, and sitting in Soothing Mist rather than pumping more heals into a spiky tank once I realized they wouldn't just suddenly die from 75%. Still go OoM constantly.

Rarely go OoM myself as a MWer unless I am really trying to. Get more mastery, keep ReM and TFT on CD. I don't use Mana Tea as 100 talent, instead I use FT and still have rare issues with mana.

Even during H raids with 30 people and 5-6 healers I find it hard to go OoM. Haven't needed an innervate yet, these are given to our druid/holy priest.


Are you using Essence Font alot? Enveloping Mist alot?

I rarely use EF, and only use EnvM on tank when he really really needs it. My rotation is mostly ReM, TFT and Vivify

[Taeldorian]

This is coming from a holy paladin.

I feel like mana conservation is really easy as holy. I don't find myself going oom that often. In raids I definitely do sometimes on fights we're progressing on but that's about it. It rarely happens in mythic+. So I'm finding it to be pretty easy to conserve mana, at least as a holy paladin.

[Glorious Leader]

Fairly good as a resto druid. Runing mythic+2 today only needed to stop and drink a couple times. The truth is you can be extremely effecient but if your dps and tanks are bad its kinda irellevant. Stuff needs to die fast. This applies to raids as well. If we take the full 5 minutes to kill ursoc cause deeps is slow the gas tank will be running pretty low. If we kill him between 3-4 not so much.

[ryklin]

other than the intense single-target/spot healing fights and tank healing on renferal and il'gyna, I find mana not too bad as a shaman, it really helps that the longer fights like xavius and cenarius have mana refund mechanics, and for some of the really high spending specs like disc, the darkmoon trinket is basically necessary

[Mastho]

As resto druid I manage quite well in EN so far, but I do feel like I have to hold back a bit, trusting in the other healers to fill the gaps. In mythic+, I just need to time the drinking well, as night elf I can shadowmeld and start drinking before the pack dies, as to not interupt the flow of pulling packs.

[Keiyra]

Resto druid perspective - for mythic+ its fine - only if the shit hits the fan do i find myself having to stop to drink

Raiding...this is a lot tougher. Its VERY easy to go oom with rejuv - so you really have to throttle your Rejuv usage even taking into account pots and innervate (don't have a monk healer otherwise id innervate them). Granted - this is progression where a lot more people are getting hit and you feel like you need to rejuv the whole raid. Its definitely a challenge to heal enough without going dry 2/3rds of the way through, but i expect it to ease up as dps get better with mechanics.

[Mattiu]

Resto druid's mana hurts the most of all healers IMO, i can pull a lot of hps, (usually 350-400k on heroic ursoc 2 healing it) but its really hard to not go oom. Im even using mana trinkets like Promises, the alche trinket, amalgam and cocoon. I still don't have the 6% mana regen trait but when i do i'll farm all 3 relics for this trait to have a 12% mana regen and see if it helps. Guessing it will help a lot

[Deleted]

Resto druid perspective - for mythic+ its fine - only if the shit hits the fan do i find myself having to stop to drink

Raiding...this is a lot tougher. Its VERY easy to go oom with rejuv - so you really have to throttle your Rejuv usage even taking into account pots and innervate (don't have a monk healer otherwise id innervate them). Granted - this is progression where a lot more people are getting hit and you feel like you need to rejuv the whole raid. Its definitely a challenge to heal enough without going dry 2/3rds of the way through, but i expect it to ease up as dps get better with mechanics.

^Same goes for me. And odd enough it feels like it is very fight dependant. We are working on Heroic Il'gynoth (killed Nythendra and Ursoc) and that find tends to oom me very fast due to little real raid damage but large random (Random as in not predictable) single target hits.

Resto druid's mana hurts the most of all healers IMO, i can pull a lot of hps, (usually 350-400k on heroic ursoc 2 healing it) but its really hard to not go oom. Im even using mana trinkets like Promises, the alche trinket, amalgam and cocoon. I still don't have the 6% mana regen trait but when i do i'll farm all 3 relics for this trait to have a 12% mana regen and see if it helps. Guessing it will help a lot

Out of curiosity, what is the size of your raid group?

[Keiyra]

I still don't have the 6% mana regen trait but when i do i'll farm all 3 relics for this trait to have a 12% mana regen and see if it helps. Guessing it will help a lot

It'll help a little - if you had 3 relics for 12% regen - thats 2.8 extra rejuvs per min. Without those relics, the base trait 3/3 is an extra 1.4 rejuvs per min. - better than nothing but its not "a lot"

[CParker1987]

MW here. I don't really have any mana issues. Just be efficient with the heals... gotta know your spells and what they do.

[Keiyra]

^Same goes for me. And odd enough it feels like it is very fight dependant. We are working on Heroic Il'gynoth (killed Nythendra and Ursoc) and that find tends to oom me very fast due to little real raid damage but large random (Random as in not predictable) single target hits.

Yeah Il'gynoth is the worst fight for us, random single target bursts - other healers will snipe over hots. However we are good to focus hots on the spew targets. But yeah, you might be better off mana wise to let the other healers focus more on those eye blasts, since they will likely just snipe ur rejuv anyway, save the mana. Swiftmend, WG the melee with dot stacks from oozes, tanks and spew targets ftw.

[Mattiu]

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Out of curiosity, what is the size of your raid group?

we do 10-12 man depending on the people we have online

[Deleted]

Yeah Il'gynoth is the worst fight for us, random single target bursts - other healers will snipe over hots. However we are good to focus hots on the spew targets. But yeah, you might be better off mana wise to let the other healers focus more on those eye blasts, since they will likely just snipe ur rejuv anyway, save the mana. Swiftmend, WG the melee with dot stacks from oozes, tanks and spew targets ftw.

May I ask you what talent setup you run? I am considering swapping to germination and cultivation for this fight. Is that a smart move? I feel like those talents might be more valuable here then Flourish / Inner peace

[dacoolist]

Well, two things: HPal in mythic dungeons, I even healed my first myth+5 last night.. CANDY, I never run out of manage/it's EZmode so far... now.. onto EN. Lets just say, if your pug raid leading asshole decides to make one of the shit healers go dps, so that you're two healing 14 man cenarius, number one - expect to be OOM half way through the fight, two, stand by that damn mana improving tree as much as possible, three - kill your raid leader (keep it pg, swap factions and camp them.. IRL!)..

Again, if your group sucks ass, HPal will be devastating to your mana, unlike all other healers that seem to literally never run out of mana, HPals in certian situations are crucial, but they can run OOM in big time raids without question.