How Japan has almost eradicated gun crime

[Blur4stuff]

Countries like Japan make it impossible for gun lovers to make a sensible argument. Some of their favorite lines are, "criminals don't obey the law they'll use guns anyways" or "if people want to commit murder they'll just use something else".

Cold hard facts proves that isn't true and not just by Japan. You can argue that it's their culture. You can argue this or that or something else. Doesn't matter. Japan and others are clearly doing several things right and we should learn from that.

We (the usa and some others) keep going through this nonsense of being proven wrong on something and then just doubling down instead of changing. Whether it's gun control, health care, or a long list of other issues. It has to stop.

[Flarelaine]

It's a meaningless statistic.

I remember when Piers Morgan wouldn't shut the fuck up bragging about how the UK gun-crime rates have dropped since the handgun ban. What he refused to acknowledge or mention in debates was that other violent crimes increased.

If your only goal is to decrease gun crime, then yes, banning those guns (or making them very hard to obtain) will accomplish that. But that is a retarded goal; the goal should be to decrease violent activity in general, not redistribute them and then claim success.

Sure it's labeled as gun crime, but if you have two countries and country A has 10% more murder than country B but almost no gun crime, you could still make this argument. If the only murders that took place in America were with guns and at a much lower rate no one would be talking about gun crime. The real issue is assault/murder.

Both of you seem to imply that Japan has other sort of violence in lieu of gun crime. Well, I've just checked statistics on murder rates. UN statistics track intentional homicides per 100,000 inhabitants. US punches in at 3.9 while Japan has 0.3 - that is a thirteenfold difference. It seems Japan has all sorts of murder under control.

The UK, which as mentioned has a handgun ban, is at 0.9.

[Ahovv]

Both of you seem to imply that Japan has other sort of violence in lieu of gun crime. Well, I've just checked statistics on murder rates. UN statistics track intentional homicides per 100,000 inhabitants. US punches in at 3.9 while Japan has 0.3 - that is a thirteenfold difference. It seems Japan has all sorts of murder under control.

The UK, which as mentioned has a handgun ban, is at 0.9.

https://mises.org/blog/gun-control-f...and-and-canada

I'm not implying anything regarding Japan. I'm implying that the data which *matters* would compare homicide and violent crime rates before and after gun legislation.

Anything else is, frankly, irrelevant.

[Flarelaine]

https://mises.org/blog/gun-control-f...and-and-canada

I'm not implying anything regarding Japan. I'm implying that the data which *matters* would compare homicide and violent crime rates before and after gun legislation.

Anything else is, frankly, irrelevant.

Anything without Japan in it is irrelevant in a thread about Japanese gun crime.

[Ahovv]

Anything without Japan in it is irrelevant in a thread about Japanese gun crime.

lol ok

----

[Surfd]

All else aside, this is not an accurate statement.

Also careful with this argument as you are also implying the 1st amendment shouldn't apply to computers, the internet, or anything outside of quill and parchment.

Terribly sorry. They also had "rifles", which were a minuscule step up from muskets, requiring about the same amount of effort to load and fire, while only being a little bit more accurate.

I also have no idea what you think my statement had to do with the first amendment, as nothing I said touched upon freedom of speech, freedom of the press, right to peaceably assemble, or laws regarding religion.

[Thoughtful Trolli]

The July 26th 2016 Knife attack that killed 19 and wounded 25 others says SUP you don't need a gun m8

It's like that in China too.

There's no reason to get rid of a weapon class when it won't do shit but make the stronger people stronger. Fuck that.

Clinging to our guns is more important than penguin heat shuffling to keep everyone safe.

[Phlegethon]

One part of the secret is that it's very hard to get a gun there compared to in USA.

But but muh gun and muh "standing your ground".

They average IQ is higher in Japan

[Cyberowl]

Not messing with their mafia probably helps too.

[mickybrighteyes]

Country with almost no way to just walk into it...

Tighter restrictions on what comes in...

organized crime basically running portions of teh government...

>.>

and then you got a populace that is fundamentally different in almost every way you can measure, hell they spend the first 4 years in school learning manners and shit. That's 4 more years than almost all of the USA's children get (keep in mind this is on top of what the parents do at home).

Though there was that Mass Stabbing (cause it all happened in a single event)

[Deleted]

Factors that come to mind...

1. It's easier to scapegoat something in a diverse environment like the US, Japan is a more homogenous society without so many divisions as per class, religion, race etc.
2. Due to the above, "shame on you" probably carries way more weight than else wear.
3. They are taught to stab themselves when they mess-up. They have a 60% higher suicided rate than the global average so in Japan, problem likes to fix itself.
4. Stricter gun acquisition laws
5. America loves and romanticises its gun culture so pick your poison i guess.
6. Being from a small island myself, you tend to think twice when there's nowhere to hide from authorities and/or lynch mob that will regard your misbehaviour as an ethnic matter.

[Ghostpanther]

Not hard to kill sick people in their beds.

Or unarmed soft targets in a nightclub.

[Kraenen]

A lot of people are pointing to Japanese society, which is reasonable, but makes me wonder again - what's the murder rate for Japanese-Americans? It doesn't seem to me that third-generation Japanese-Americans are any more stabby or shooty than native-born Japanese people.

Not sure if someone addressed this, but conversely you could ask whether immigrants to Japan eventually have similar crime rates. I did some digging and apparently a book called "Japanese Americans: The Formation and Transformations of an Ethnic Group" has some kind of info on Yonsei/Sansei/Gosei (next-gen immigrants) crime.

Only other thing I could find was this pew study http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank...ey-assimilate/ finding that second gen immigrants have higher crime than the first gen. Nothing specific on Asians or Japanese.

[cubby]

One part of the secret is that it's very hard to get a gun there compared to in USA.

Another secret is that the US has 5,000 times as many people - so the numbers are almost the same. Just kidding.

The real key is that they don't sell guns there - almost impossible to get.

[Uoyredrum]

Japan's entire culture surrounding guns is completely different than the U.S. Doing what they've done would be impossible here, they simply don't have the volume of gun that we do nor the support for them. It's apples to oranges.

[xero5141]

Both of you seem to imply that Japan has other sort of violence in lieu of gun crime. Well, I've just checked statistics on murder rates. UN statistics track intentional homicides per 100,000 inhabitants. US punches in at 3.9 while Japan has 0.3 - that is a thirteenfold difference. It seems Japan has all sorts of murder under control.

The UK, which as mentioned has a handgun ban, is at 0.9.

The problem with those statistics is that if you take out a few outlying areas (Chicago, Newark, Oakland, Detroit to name a few) which is mostly attributed to gang activity (who wouldn't be complying with gun-banning laws anyway) our gun crime metrics drop DRASTICALLY to levels that are much below those of even some of the nations being mentioned in this thread. The problem isn't now and never will be guns, it's the people using guns.

As soon as I hear someone refute the argument that criminals don't abide by gun laws, I (and I'm sure many other people) will rethink my/their stance on the matter.

[Flarelaine]

The problem with those statistics is that if you take out a few outlying areas (Chicago, Newark, Oakland, Detroit to name a few) which is mostly attributed to gang activity (who wouldn't be complying with gun-banning laws anyway) our gun crime metrics drop DRASTICALLY to levels that are much below those of even some of the nations being mentioned in this thread. The problem isn't now and never will be guns, it's the people using guns.

As soon as I hear someone refute the argument that criminals don't abide by gun laws, I (and I'm sure many other people) will rethink my/their stance on the matter.

And if you remove Tokyo and Osaka, Japan's metric plummets even further. This goes both ways.

Also, yes, the problem is with people.