I could be wrong as it’s been a few years since I actually went though the series but aren’t there some red ajah who weren’t a bunch of evil bitches and just did there job right? If I remember right being a red isn’t a inherently bad thing they just had a higher amount of bad then the other colours.
I’m going off hazy memories but I think the reds also took pride in that they tended to be the most active ajah and actually went out to do there role instead of just sitting around or playing politics. In that sense it would make sense to want to see your self as a red unless I’m miss remembering which is quite likely.
I mean, that's KIND of like saying " I mean, being a Sith isn't inherently bad, right? I know a lot were crazy, but there were some that just really valued personal freedom."
Yeah, there were some Reds that weren't total bitches, but the VAST majority were, so saying your favourte Ajah was the reds because of the 2% that weren't total psychos is kind of like saying you're a Sith, because Vader turned out alright, in the end.
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The Red Ajah's mission statement was all about finding men that could channel.
Admittedly, those only interested in that sort of thing...probably won't play well at all with others.
I don’t think it’s quite the same. The sith ideals on paper are fine but there all evil where the reds were part of a good order and we’re doing good work. If we want to stick to Starwars comparisons it’s a lot more like having dark more brutal Jedi like say mace wendu but having yodaesct Jedi being the minority.
Not really, no, that's the impression you get early on but the deeper you go into the series the more decent reds you meet. Spoilers for the very end but ultimately the Reds take it on themselves to be the ones to bond with the Asha'man. Not talking about their ill conceived raid, but rather Pevara's plan for the Ajah's future, that they would partner with male channelers.
The black Ajah are the sith equivalents. You meet a handful of shitty reds, but you meet plenty of actual psychos from every Ajah. I'll always be more of a Blue myself, maybe a Gray, but there is nothing inherently wrong with the Reds. They did a dirty job which is bound to make them especially unpopular with anyone who likes male channelers, and by extension plenty of readers.
Last edited by Zaktar; 2020-02-12 at 09:12 PM.
Don't forget that the Reds had far more members go Black than any other Ajah - 1/4 of the Blacks were Reds.
I do remember that, but I remember it being more of an extension of their duty to be the Ajah responsible for male channelers and not some benevolent magnanimous decision and almost felt like atonement for all the shit they did throughout the rest of the series and the fact that their leader was horrible until she got deposed.
The future of the Ajah looked promising for sure because of the few good ones who stepped up after the garbage fire they had before, but at that point I saw them as kind of the redeemed villain who was on their way to atone for their crimes/transgressions.
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There definitely were some good eggs in there, but their reputation was not a good one. I honestly don't remember the details that well either, but do remember that their reputation and overall member attitudes didn't really improve until well into the series after it was shown that male channelers weren't the devils they all thought they were and after their toxic leadership was removed.
If they were the vile shitbags that some others (not saying you) have presented them as, they wouldn't have been willing to view their duty in that way. They would have just doubled down on the idea that the men they'd always (and fairly) perceived as a danger were dangerous. Instead they grew, embraced change. I think, too, that partly what happens to the reader is that Jordan is either deliberately manipulating us or course correcting himself. Most of the reds we meet early on are pretty awful, Liandrin is one of the first examples we get and, well, you know. As the series goes deeper he shows us more and more examples of decent members of the Ajah and once it's plain how wrongheaded Elaida was, we can see by the new choices the group makes in their leadership that they learned from their mistakes.
As a group they have one of the more interesting and, as you suggest, redemptive story arcs. We meet them just as their mission changes from vital to irrelevant so it's easy to just see them as worthless, yet they arguably did some of the most important, difficult, and valuable work of all the Ajahs for the past two thousand years since the breaking. We see that adapting to the change is hard for them, but they ultimately pull it off admirably.
It's fine that the showrunner likes them, suggests to me that he gets the big picture and is into the story.
Cadsuane became the new Amyrlin at the end. She's not very tolerant of the bullshit. So...I wouldn't have been surprised at a epilogue written that they would spend the most time at the Black Tower, if for no other reason than to get away from her...as well as prove their worth with this new mandate
These kind of posts remind me of Vegans. Just like any group there are some crazies out there doing annoying shit. But it is the opposite group that is far more annoying.
Vegan "no thanks, I'm vegan"
Meat eater 1"Omg, vegans won't shut up"
Meat eater 2 "I know right"
Meat eater 3 "How do you know when someone's a vegan? They'll tell you"
Vegan moves off and eats his meal.
The show isnt even out and a large number of posts are "SJWs will ruin this". Calm down. You're worst than actual SJWs.
I'm just calling it like it is. No matter how good Wheel of Time is written, there are a bunch of real asshats out there that will attack it relentlessly. And because I know the contents of Wheel of Time, I know it's EXACTLY the type of thing that will "trigger" those asshats and put them in rage mode.
This isn't "being worse than actual SJWs". If you think otherwise maybe you haven't actually seen what's been going on lately from SJWs.
If the script is faithful to the books...not considering the particular actors...and notwithstanding the different medium...(I understand how things can alter when translating the books to the screen) then they may have a shot at winning over the fans of the books. (It's not racism per se, but racial diversity...also cultural diversity.)
ugh...a Gholam: