Battle for Azeroth Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[cfStatic]

The siege of Theramore lasted days before the Horde forces withdrew, under combined assault by Alliance Forces and Kalecgos, giving the civilians plenty of time to escape before the bomb was sent and blew up the port and the military forces that stayed behind.The civilian refugees were later captured and taken to Orgrimmar where they were caged as prisoners of war until the Siege of Orgrimmar when they were released by the Horde and Alliance forces as they secured the city level. The civilians were not treated kindly, but they also weren't slaughtered, even by Garrosh "I'm Totally a Hitler Allegory" Hellscream.

Jaina planned to flood Orgrimmar and drown every single orc, innocent or otherwise, in her grief over losing Rhonin and Theramore.

That you don't see the difference, there, is kind of chilling.

Wow, it's almost like people do crazy things when overcome by grief and anger.

[Rhlor]

Check the interviews. They talked about how people wanted to play Nightborne, so therefore added them. The Void Elves were just added because they sounded cool.

I also believe that the loss of darnassus is also the fault of those same people, usually the people who asked for the blood elf model in the alliance were the same ones who wanted to conquer lordaeron and take the forsaken from their homes, it was obvious that doing that they would have to do the same with an alliance race to compensate

[Yarathir]

Wow, it's almost like people do crazy things when overcome by grief and anger.

And she didn't even actually do anything, unlike Garrosh and the rest of the Horde that (minus tauren) willingly helped him bomb Theramore.

These faction bias blinders, jeez..

[Marlamin]

9 new encryption keys in 7.3.5.

1 (probably) hides a mount
1 hides 10 Magni VO sound files (4 Magni VO sounds before these are not encrypted: #1, #2, #3, #4)
2 hide nothing (yet)

The rest are hiding stuff that I haven't found any hints for just yet.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

It was Centaurs in Vanilla, actually. So they conciously changed centaurs to Northwatch soldiers, and Northwatch is affiliated with Theramore.

Northwatch was in vanilla just as much. They barely changed Durotar minus in front of Orgrimmar.

[Steampunkette]

Wait, Orgrimmar isn't a valid military target because it also has civilians? So did Theramore. From a war standpoint, if you want to justify Theramore, you have no right to then call Jaina evil for just THREATENING to do the same to Orgrimmar out of rage and desperation. Do you only see half of the story everywhere, to the point that you only see the Alliance doing bad things and that what the Horde does is justifiable, or a necessary evil? Nevertheless, your bias is shining brightly. I didn't know it could be this bad.

Also, again: Garrosh was only deposed once the Horde started feeling the brunt of his tyranny. They were okay with whatever happened to the Alliance. MINUS-

Minus the tauren. The tauren were the only ones who always stood up to Garrosh and defied him outright, to the point that they warned and tried to help Jaina.

Trolls were against him from the beginning, too.

And nah, fam. Theramore was a legitimate target for a carpet bombing (or in this case mana-bombing) because civilian casualties would be negligible, since they evacuated the city during the long drawn out fighting that lead to the later destruction of the city and the remaining military forces (who, by the way, firebombed a village full of civilians with no warning).

Jaina intended to kill EVERYONE. Kids, Lil' ol' ladies. The entire Orgrimmar Orphanage. Everyone drowned and dead. That she was stopped is great, but the intent is there. And the only reason I even brought Jaina up in the first place was to point out how the Alliance's Bigotry is their chief sin, to the point that even those who are -against- the bigotry as characters eventually come to embrace it.

-You're- the one who decided to try and compare her actions to Garrosh's bombing of Theramore as a deflection to start this entire stupid side-argument.

So yeah. I'm done arguing with you on this topic and I stand by my previous point that the Alliance's chief sin is, and has always been, bigotry. They paint all of their enemies as the worst of their enemies, while overlooking all of the flaws of their allies, in a clear cognitive bias.

And when an Alliance character's bigotry is not aimed squarely at an enemy (Such as Garithos and the Blood Elves) they will arrange a situation where their bigotry is justified and can be a new cultural touchstone of hatred.

Meanwhile the Horde with all its fractious independence has myriad sins of their own. From violent and vengeful seclusion to aggressive expansion to greed and avarice.

The Horde's got many sins, where the Alliance has but one.

[Yarathir]

9 new encryption keys in 7.3.5.

1 (probably) hides a mount
1 hides 10 Magni VO sound files (4 Magni VO sounds before these are not encrypted: #1, #2, #3, #4)
2 hide nothing (yet)

The rest are hiding stuff that I haven't found any hints for just yet.

*shakes fist* Hrrhh.. encryption..

- - - Updated - - -

Trolls were against him from the beginning, too.

And nah, fam. Theramore was a legitimate target for a carpet bombing (or in this case mana-bombing) because civilian casualties would be negligible, since they evacuated the city during the long drawn out fighting that lead to the later destruction of the city and the remaining military forces (who, by the way, firebombed a village full of civilians with no warning).

Jaina intended to kill EVERYONE. Kids, Lil' ol' ladies. The entire Orgrimmar Orphanage. Everyone drowned and dead. That she was stopped is great, but the intent is there. And the only reason I even brought Jaina up in the first place was to point out how the Alliance's Bigotry is their chief sin, to the point that even those who are -against- the bigotry as characters eventually come to embrace it.

-You're- the one who decided to try and compare her actions to Garrosh's bombing of Theramore as a deflection to start this entire stupid side-argument.

So yeah. I'm done arguing with you on this topic and I stand by my previous point that the Alliance's chief sin is, and has always been, bigotry. They paint all of their enemies as the worst of their enemies, while overlooking all of the flaws of their allies, in a clear cognitive bias.

And when an Alliance character's bigotry is not aimed squarely at an enemy (Such as Garithos and the Blood Elves) they will arrange a situation where their bigotry is justified and can be a new cultural touchstone of hatred.

Meanwhile the Horde with all its fractious independence has myriad sins of their own. From violent and vengeful seclusion to aggressive expansion to greed and avarice.

The Horde's got many sins, where the Alliance has but one.

Been a good chat. I never knew faction blinders could be this severe, so your existence is quite intriguing to me.

[George Lucas]

Northwatch was in vanilla just as much. They barely changed Durotar minus in front of Orgrimmar.

Nope, Northwatch Expeditionary Forces were never in Durotar prior to Cataclysm. Tiragarde was manned by Kul Tiran Forces, which were replaced by Northwatch Marines, who even mourn the bodies of the fallen Kul Tirans. The plans to attack the three places in Durotar were in a centaur camp, as it was said. The centaurs were also replaced by Northwatch Marines and the Northwatch scouts in the valley of trials were also added in Cataclysm.

[Deleted]

Been a good chat. I never knew faction blinders could be this severe, so your existence is quite intriguing to me.

Looked in a mirror recently?

[Makorus]

Northwatch was in vanilla just as much. They barely changed Durotar minus in front of Orgrimmar.

No, in Vanilla, the quest were Attack Plans from Centaurs. Now, they are Attack Plans from Northwatch, who expanded by a hell, especially in Durotar and Southern Barrens.

[Yarathir]

Looked in a mirror recently?

"No u." doesn't work when I acknowledged from the get-go that Alliance has bad, morally grey or just pure dark sides.

And I'd like them to have some more and the Horde some less so it can be grey vs grey, not white with a few black spots vs black with a few white spots.

[Steampunkette]

Don't be fucking retarded. I literally argued the opposite in my post, the children is what made it complicated. And there is no evidence of children being put in camps (they probably were, but thats besideds the point, it is never mentioned in the lore that there were children). Thrall was found among his dead parents by Blackmoore 6 years before the camps were constructed.

The Lore states that ALL of the clans were captured except for the Bleeding Hollow (which escaped fully) and parts of the Dragonmaw and Blackrock clan.

ALL of them. Every man, woman, and child were captured from their Chief to their last Peon.

It doesn't have to say "They also captured the children and farmers" if it says they captured -everyone-.

Genn's urge to have them all executed would've been an act of genocide, not justice.

[Rhlor]

I like this!!!



so cool!!!

[Deleted]

"No u." doesn't work when I acknowledged from the get-go that Alliance has bad, morally grey or just pure dark sides.

And I'd like them to have some more and the Horde some less so it can be grey vs grey, not white with a few black spots vs black with a few white spots.

And yet whereas Steampunkette acknowledged from the start the Horde has multiple flaws it somehow does work.

Flawless logic as ever.

[Yarathir]

And yet whereas Steampunkette acknowledged from the start the Horde has multiple flaws it somehow does work.

Flawless logic as ever.

Yes, flaws, and then she totally whitewashes every part the Horde plays in its atrocities and proclaims that it wasn't a major part of the Horde that helped Garrosh accomplish its goals, as if Garrosh could have done it all on his own, or with a small group/minority.

[GoodUsername55]

Alliance definitely got fucked over with cities unless they put the vindicaar in along with gilneas and such.

[Yarathir]

Alliance definitely got fucked over with cities unless they put the vindicaar in along with gilneas and such.

The Vindicaar is pretty tiny, though, in all truth. Unless they add some kind of extra layer, but I doubt they plan to put in extra work.

[Kieldon]

The Vindicaar is pretty tiny, though, in all truth. Unless they add some kind of extra layer, but I doubt they plan to put in extra work.

It could be worse. Imagine mountable Vindicaar.

[Yarathir]

It could be worse. Imagine mountable Vindicaar.

Tbf, a mountable 1-person mini Vindicaar would be pretty swell. Cruising around the place.

[Steampunkette]

This forum has got so many Hardcore Alliance players that even discussing the lore surrounding actions from an external perspective is viewed as Horde-Bias, and defense of such discussion is viewed as confirmation of Horde-Bias. It's a lovely Catch-22 of reinforcement bias.

For the record I've played both Horde and alliance since I started playing during Cataclysm, where I mained a Nelf Mage. In Mists I wound up on a Belf Warlock. WoD rolled around and my DranSham was my main. And now in Legion I've been maining a Belf DH.

In Battle I'll be running a Void Elf Warlock. I do my best to get as much of the story as possible, though, so I always have at least one alt on whatever other faction I'm playing. And I always level up brand new characters for every expansion.

If you can't even discuss the overarching negative themes of the factions without immediately digging into "But the other faction did/is/was..." and when that side-argument results in the other person actually discussing your points jumping directly to the accusation of "Faction Blinders" you might wanna step back from the game a bit and try to dissect your cognitive biases.