Battle for Azeroth Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[jdbond592]

We're sooooo reaching 1250 pages at least before Blizzcon.

And we have vaguest idea of xpac at best. Well perhaps not that vague but still..

[Nathanyel]

For Pandaren I have no ideas, but do Subraces need to be a balanced act?

Pandaren are the latest race, so they could be low-priority like Goblins and Worgen are for the HD overhaul. Or this could be satisfied with more customization options, mostly more fur colors and maybe some slight body type modifications. There aren't many "clans" for Pandaren, even the PC ones as inhabitants of the Wandering Isle are still identical to "mainland" Pandaren.

[Ghargatuloth]

Pandaren are the latest race, so they could be low-priority like Goblins and Worgen are for the HD overhaul. Or this could be satisfied with more customization options, mostly more fur colors and maybe some slight body type modifications. There aren't many "clans" for Pandaren, even the PC ones as inhabitants of the Wandering Isle are still identical to "mainland" Pandaren.

See... This is why I say sub-races is a BARBER SHOP caliber update that could just as easily be added alongside a new class or a new race. How is anything you are describing more substantial than us suddenly having been able to change our hair styles and getting a crap ton new styles? AS WELL AS DK

[Soulwind]

That absolutely does NOT parallel.

The visually updated models took the existing races and COMPLETELY overhauled them, they went from having just a few polygons for faces with textures as features to fully realized and expressive.

While on the other hand the "sub-races" most everyone seem to covet so greatly exist as "Dark Iron/Wildhammer" or "Taunka/Highmountain" or "Brown/Dragonmaw" for orcs. My point being that most ALL of these exist in large part in the game already. They would only really need to add a couple more options on top of what's already here or even just do a recolor job on what we have.

How can you even remotely think they are even close to the same?

Because while Dark Iron dwarves are just dwarves with a dark skin and red eyes, taunka are quite different from tauren. The amount of customization that they would have to add to make some of these subraces available is easily comparable to the model revamp in the amount of assets they'd have to create.

Think about it this way, if they add forest trolls, that's a completely new bodytype for male and female trolls. Sure they'd use the same skeleton, but the model itself would be completely different.

Customization would grow exponentially with those as they'd have to add several options to all the new features. So while it's not as much work for animators as the model revamp was, it's as much work, if not more, for model and texture artists.

[Ghargatuloth]

Because while Dark Iron dwarves are just dwarves with a dark skin and red eyes, taunka are quite different from tauren. The amount of customization that they would have to add to make some of these subraces available is easily comparable to the model revamp in the amount of assets they'd have to create.

Think about it this way, if they add forest trolls, that's a completely new bodytype for male and female trolls. Sure they'd use the same skeleton, but the model itself would be completely different.

Customization would grow exponentially with those as they'd have to add several options to all the new features. So while it's not as much work for animators as the model revamp was, it's as much work, if not more, for model and texture artists.

My opposition to this point is a simple one... Mostly that it kind of isn't fair that while trolls and such lucky races would get extravagant new models that borderline function as an entirely new race... Everyone only really suggests "some more customization" for other races like pandaren.

It kind of blows up the already unbalanced sub-race argument that some races would get wildly superior options.

[Fahrad Wagner]

Wasn't page 900 only yesterday? I know it wont be 50 pages every day, but still is some really fast moving. And Blizzcon week is gonna be littered with leaks moreso than Gamescom week.

Indeed! The hypetrain is going into hyperspaaaaaace moooooode.

[Nathanyel]

See... This is why I say sub-races is a BARBER SHOP caliber update that could just as easily be added alongside a new class or a new race. How is anything you are describing more substantial than us suddenly having been able to change our hair styles and getting a crap ton new styles? AS WELL AS DK

Player perception is the key here, though, even if subraces are less work than a completely new race, they will have comparable success. It's cosmetic gameplay-wise, but offers a lot more opportunity for identification with your character.

[Ghargatuloth]

Player perception is the key here, though, even if subraces are less work than a completely new race, they will have comparable success. It's cosmetic gameplay-wise, but offers a lot more opportunity for identification with your character.

You seem to misunderstand me completely.

I am in no way AGAINST sub-races, in fact I'd very much love it if they added them.

My issue is I feel they could just as easily market it as a secondary feature like the Barber Shop and still add a new race or class.

[Nathanyel]

Everyone only really suggests "some more customization" for other races like pandaren.

Oh I'm not against "true" subraces for Pandaren, but I myself just can't think of a good one. Doesn't mean no one else can do that.

My issue is I feel they could just as easily market it as a secondary feature like the Barber Shop and still add a new race or class.

Of course. That's best-case, though. Tradeoffs aren't exactly new to WoW. I would accept "just subraces" as a substitute for a new race, but I understand if others don't see it that way.

[Soulwind]

My opposition to this point is a simple one... Mostly that it kind of isn't fair that while trolls and such lucky races would get extravagant new models that borderline function as an entirely new race... Everyone only really suggests "some more customization" for other races like pandaren.

It kind of blows up the already unbalanced sub-race argument that some races would get wildly superior options.

I've suggested Tortollan as a "subrace" for Pandaren. Similar silhouette, compatible skeleton (except for the face), completely different model.

Also, what are they going to do, come up with new kinds of dwaves and orcs just to match the customization of trolls or nightborne, they'll have to work with what they have in the lore.

[Ghargatuloth]

Oh I'm not against "true" subraces for Pandaren, but I myself just can't think of a good one. Doesn't mean no one else can do that.



Of course. That's best-case, though. Tradeoffs aren't exactly new to WoW. I would accept "just subraces" as a substitute for a new race, but I understand if others don't see it that way.

Mists of Pandaria was pretty great, we got Monk AND Pandaren.

I simply cannot understand why so many seem to be content asking for LESS. I'm all for managing expectations and what not... But I think we should make it know we want things, not that we would just "accept" getting a lesser feature if it's one we particularly like.

[Fahrad Wagner]

I've suggested Tortollan as a "subrace" for Pandaren. Similar silhouette, compatible skeleton (except for the face), completely different model.

Also, what are they going to do, come up with new kinds of dwaves and orcs just to match the customization of trolls or nightborne.

If tortollans make it into WoW, I'd be very happy! Those little turtles are so cuuuuute.

[Deleted]

I've suggested Tortollan as a "subrace" for Pandaren. Similar silhouette, compatible skeleton (except for the face), completely different model.

Also, what are they going to do, come up with new kinds of dwaves and orcs just to match the customization of trolls or nightborne, they'll have to work with what they have in the lore.

tortollan are cannon to HS right?

[Fahrad Wagner]

tortollan are cannon to HS right?

Yes to Hearthstone only as for the moment.

[Eurhetemec]

I have links to most of the leaks saved up, with some keywords. So I'll maybe make a stat graph of how many leaks guessed which aspect.

That'd be jolly good fun. Let me know if you need any help.

[Deleted]

Spontaneous thought: how cool would it be if the expansion was absolutely wild? Like... World of Warcraft: Age of Dragons. We venture to Kul Tiras and/or Zandalar before going into the unknown on the Dragon Isles, a completely primeval place with ancient ruins. Once there, in the jungle, we discover the hope for the future of the dragon race. Clutches of fresh and untainted eggs for every brood. Ancient temples which speak of the past of their kind. Traces of an forlorn war between Old Gods and Dragons. Azshara and the naga are there, and there are pockets of void corruption as well. But mainly the theme is basically King Kong on steroids.

[KingSapmi]

Spontaneous thought: how cool would it be if the expansion was absolutely wild? Like... World of Warcraft: Age of Dragons. We venture to Kul Tiras and/or Zandalar before going into the unknown on the Dragon Isles, a completely primeval place with ancient ruins. Once there, in the jungle, we discover the hope for the future of the dragon race. Clutches of fresh and untainted eggs for every brood. Ancient temples which speak of the past of their kind. Traces of an forlorn war between Old Gods and Dragons. Azshara and the naga are there, and there are pockets of void corruption as well. But mainly the theme is basically King Kong on steroids.

Sounds like Mists of Pandaria, with a bigger purpose. I loved MoP, I would be down with this idea.

[Harbour]

Ethereals for the both factions are more beliveable. They are pretty neutral race so it would fit both Horde and Alliance.
And it would be funny if none of the leaks would be confirmed and we will get full new Karesh planet, with couple nods to South Seas vibe.

[Lahis]

I've suggested Tortollan as a "subrace" for Pandaren. Similar silhouette, compatible skeleton (except for the face), completely different model.

Also, what are they going to do, come up with new kinds of dwaves and orcs just to match the customization of trolls or nightborne, they'll have to work with what they have in the lore.

Earthen would be pretty obvious subrace for Dwarves.

[Raetary]

and DHs are Elves, not demons....

Because all elves have demon souls.