The Brexit aftermath thread

[Mayhem]

Not at all here's just one example. The Theresa May remain led government only raised NHS spending at the last budget by an extra 120 million a week. Boris Johnson proposed another additional 100 million a week for the NHS at the beginning of this month in order to reach the 350m target by Brexit and was slapped down by the remain side.

The hard brexiteers in the tory party are credible and realisitic as they have always been as shown on their red battle bus. It's the remain side which are being ridiculous and bumbling along without a clue, dragging the country and NHS down.

A leadership challenge without the very credible Boris in the ring just wouldn't happen.

Wait wait wait, how did they UK get 120 mio a week for the NHS while paying full membership fees? I thought it was either or, not both?

[zealo]

Same Churchill that wanted the UK to be part of a United States of Europe?

Wait Churchill saved us from Europe? Ok you're completely bonkers, sicne the war was against a type of Germany that hasn't existed since the 40s and wasn't about saving the UK but containing a growing power in central europe.

What did exist though up until the 90s was a soviet led Warsaw Pact as a threat well past Churchill's time, and the likes of Churchill saw that coming even before the war ended. I think that were no small factor in why a man who had previously considered the UK to "be with Europe, but not of it" became such a proponent of Franco-German unity.

[Floopa]

as predicted the Brexit vote is tearing the Tories apart. they can't do it without a split in the party.

corbyn is the only political leader in the UK right now who is actually supportive of leaving the eu, as such when the government falls and Labour form a government we will get both Brexit and the socialist democracy this country needs.

[Kiri]

as predicted the Brexit vote is tearing the Tories apart. they can't do it without a split in the party.

corbyn is the only political leader in the UK right now who is actually supportive of leaving the eu, as such when the government falls and Labour form a government we will get both Brexit and the socialist democracy this country needs.

Can it even fall to Corbyn before Brexit? I am not that well versed with the British political climate, but he would need the Tories, or at least the rebel wing of it to support him in forming a government, wouldn't he?

[Floopa]

Can it even fall to Corbyn before Brexit? I am not that well versed with the British political climate, but he would need the Tories, or at least the rebel wing of it to support him in forming a government, wouldn't he?

there will 100% be a transition period under Labour. under Conservatives it's set until 2020, under Labour more likely to the next GE. outside of a Labour majority, Labour could team up with SNP/LD and give them what they want: SNP want indy ref 2, LD and SNP want "remain in the eu" on the final Brexit deal which goes to parliament.

[Deleted]

The problem is that both the EU and UK want to cause as little damage to each other as possible but the harder the EU's stance more it plays into the, so called, Hard Brexit supporters' hands which would be damaging for both of us.

The EU's stance haven't changed - The EU's stance has been known since before the vote in question, and indeed Can't change, regardless of how much pain is due.

- - - Updated - - -

Same Churchill that wanted the UK to be part of a United States of Europe?

Wait Churchill saved us from Europe? Ok you're completely bonkers, sicne the war was against a type of Germany that hasn't existed since the 40s and wasn't about saving the UK but containing a growing power in central europe.

To be fair, Churchill wanted a USE, a British Empire, and the US as the triparte western alliance -

[Deleted]

Not at all here's just one example. The Theresa May remain led government only raised NHS spending at the last budget by an extra 120 million a week. Boris Johnson proposed another additional 100 million a week for the NHS at the beginning of this month in order to reach the 350m target by Brexit and was slapped down by the remain side.

He was slapped down because the money doesn't yet (at all, but ..) exist, since the UK haven't left yet, and because it is outside his remit -

The hard brexiteers in the tory party are credible and realisitic as they have always been as shown on their red battle bus. It's the remain side which are being ridiculous and bumbling along without a clue, dragging the country and NHS down.

Several of the hard brexiteers are rather clear about that part of the point of Brexit is to subject the UK to a chock of massive proportions so they can 'Fix' the UK -

[dribbles]

Same Churchill that wanted the UK to be part of a United States of Europe?

Wait Churchill saved us from Europe? Ok you're completely bonkers, sicne the war was against a type of Germany that hasn't existed since the 40s and wasn't about saving the UK but containing a growing power in central europe.

Ah here is the one and only forum Lib Dem voter, every village has one. Did you read what Nick Clegg said yesterday? "I agree with Jacob" How does that make you feel? Betrayed much? Another Lib Dem student tuition fees moment lols

Wait wait wait, how did they UK get 120 mio a week for the NHS while paying full membership fees? I thought it was either or, not both?

Let's refresh. The leavers offered, plastered all over a bus, an extra 350 million a week to the NHS by Brexit D-Day if we voted to leave. If the leave side had its way the NHS would right now be recieving 220 million a week of that. Almost 2/3rds of their promise would be delivered with still over a year to go, to hit their 350m target, until Brexit.

Make no mistake, voting to remain in the EU with the UK run by a remain government has left the NHS underfunded. Why do remainers not want to fund the NHS properly? Shameful, they have blood on their hands.

Can it even fall to Corbyn before Brexit? I am not that well versed with the British political climate, but he would need the Tories, or at least the rebel wing of it to support him in forming a government, wouldn't he?

Corbyn is not a panacea for remainers, he is more a brexiteer than Theresa May will ever be. Staying in the EU is so unpopular that no leader of any major political party in the UK supports that position any more.

I wonder how many conservative MP's have written now demanding a new leader, I bet they are at about 45/48 today. Just a couple more put pen to paper and Theresa the appeaser is history. Got to feel a bit sorry for the EU, all that wasted time, money and energy over the last 18 months on fruitless negotiations. Still they always were good at wasting other peoples money...

[Mayhem]

Let's refresh. The leavers offered, plastered all over a bus, an extra 350 million a week to the NHS by Brexit D-Day if we voted to leave. If the leave side had its way the NHS would right now be recieving 220 million a week of that. Almost 2/3rds of their promise would be delivered with still over a year to go, to hit their 350m target, until Brexit.

Make no mistake, voting to remain in the EU with the UK run by a remain government has left the NHS underfunded. Why do remainers not want to fund the NHS properly? Shameful, they have blood on their hands.

But according to you it's not a remain governemnt because at the last GE leave won with a super majority, after all both tories and labour are in favour of leaving the EU.

Sooo where did the money come from? And why wasn't that money put into the NHS by the parties prior to the referendum when the money obviously was there already? Again, you are still paying for at least another year.

[Kiri]

Corbyn is not a panacea for remainers, he is more a brexiteer than Theresa May will ever be. Staying in the EU is so unpopular that no leader of any major political party in the UK supports that position any more.

I wonder how many conservative MP's have written now demanding a new leader, I bet they are at about 45/48 today. Just a couple more put pen to paper and Theresa the appeaser is history. Got to feel a bit sorry for the EU, all that wasted time, money and energy over the last 18 months on fruitless negotiations. Still they always were good at wasting other peoples money...

That....has nothing to do with my question?

[dribbles]

But according to you it's not a remain governemnt because at the last GE leave won with a super majority, after all both tories and labour are in favour of leaving the EU.

Sooo where did the money come from? And why wasn't that money put into the NHS by the parties prior to the referendum when the money obviously was there already? Again, you are still paying for at least another year.

It's well known that May and her no 2 Hammond voted remain/lost in the referendum and would do so again in a second. We all in the UK now know that was a mistake and the wrong position to take, it is only fair she pays the price. Her removal and replacement with a proper Brexit winning leader more representative of the will of the people is just a correction of unfortunate circumstance.

That....has nothing to do with my question?

The answer to your question is that possibly yes Corbyn could, if no new proposed Conservative leader can command the confidence of the house of commons by simple vote then the government falls and a new general election will be held. Bet the EU is going to love that with the clock ticking.

[Mayhem]

It's well known that May and her no 2 Hammond voted remain/lost in the referendum and would do so again in a second. We all in the UK now know that was a mistake and the wrong position to take, it is only fair she pays the price. Her removal and replacement with a proper Brexit winning leader more representative of the will of the people is just a correction of unfortunate circumstance.

But that was known prior to the GE as well and you yourself wrote that because of the outcome of the GE and the strong and stable government she was able to form, the GE overwhelmingly showed that the will of the people (aka tory and labour voters) was to leave the EU.

You are still not explaining where that money suddenly comes from and why it wasn't put into the NHS prior to voting leave.

[Floopa]

You are still not explaining where that money suddenly comes from and why it wasn't put into the NHS prior to voting leave.

in 2016 without a rebate we would have paid £17.1 billion to the EU, but we get a rebate of £4 million, so in 2016 the UK paid £13.1 billion to the EU, and EU spending on the UK was forecast to be £4.5 billion. therefire the UK’s net contribution was £8.6 billion

so, £17.1 billlion is roughly £329 million per week. however the actual contribution is £13.1, or £251 million.

we could in effect spend £250 million/week on our NHS after we fully leave the eu. the thing is, that £13.1 billion - that's ours to do what we like with.

remember - that's when we leave. COMPLETELY leave.

this is why i support Labour on this. Labour have a leader who is a eurosceptic - he has been for decades - and he will certainly pledge (of that £13.1 billion) £6 billion/year to the NHS which is what it needs to stay afloat.

[Mayhem]

in 2016 without a rebate we would have paid £17.1 billion to the EU, but we get a rebate of £4 million, so in 2016 the UK paid £13.1 billion to the EU, and EU spending on the UK was forecast to be £4.5 billion. therefire the UK’s net contribution was £8.6 billion

so, £17.1 billlion is roughly £329 million per week. however the actual contribution is £13.1, or £251 million.

we could in effect spend £250 million/week on our NHS after we fully leave the eu. the thing is, that £13.1 billion - that's ours to do what we like with.

remember - that's when we leave. COMPLETELY leave.

Yeah, but you are still paying, so where is the money that was put into the NHS suddenly coming from?

[Floopa]

Yeah, but you are still paying, so where is the money that was put into the NHS suddenly coming from?

there is none. lol. who said money had been put into the NHS? NHS spending per capita has gone down since 2010 under the tories lol

[Mayhem]

there is none. lol. who said money had been put into the NHS? NHS spending per capita has gone down since 2010 under the tories lol

Dribbles did, post #3608

[Kiri]

in 2016 without a rebate we would have paid £17.1 billion to the EU, but we get a rebate of £4 million, so in 2016 the UK paid £13.1 billion to the EU, and EU spending on the UK was forecast to be £4.5 billion. therefire the UK’s net contribution was £8.6 billion

so, £17.1 billlion is roughly £329 million per week. however the actual contribution is £13.1, or £251 million.

we could in effect spend £250 million/week on our NHS after we fully leave the eu. the thing is, that £13.1 billion - that's ours to do what we like with.

remember - that's when we leave. COMPLETELY leave.

this is why i support Labour on this. Labour have a leader who is a eurosceptic - he has been for decades - and he will certainly pledge (of that £13.1 billion) £6 billion/year to the NHS which is what it needs to stay afloat.

That sounds to me like an overly optimistic assumption. As much as people complain about EU bureaucrats, it is not like that is something unique to the EU. GB has a lot of them as well, with myriads of departments wanting a piece of that particular cake. Even if you assume that there is absolutely no change in the GB's maximum budget stemming from economic change, not all of that money will go to the NHS by default. Leaving the EU means that certain functions once delivered by the EU would once again be the UK's responsibility. Part of the money you no longer send to EU to, in essence, pay for these functions would go to organizations in the UK other than the NHS. Of course, that is a very complicated system, but never believe a politician who says that a sudden increase in available budget will fully go into social services. That is just not feasible.

[Mayhem]

That sounds to me like an overly optimistic assumption. As much as people complain about EU bureaucrats, it is not like that is something unique to the EU. GB has a lot of them as well, with myriads of departments wanting a piece of that particular cake. Even if you assume that there is absolutely no change in the GB's maximum budget stemming from economic change, not all of that money will go to the NHS by default. Leaving the EU means that certain functions once delivered by the EU would once again be the UK's responsibility. Part of the money you no longer send to EU to, in essence, pay for these functions would go to organizations in the UK other than the NHS. Of course, that is a very complicated system, but never believe a politician who says that a sudden increase in available budget will fully go into social services. That is just not feasible.

Stahp, everyone knows the EU will pay the UK for securing their borders and customs checks.

[dribbles]

Dribbles did, post #3608

Actually remainer Phillip Hammond was reported as saying it on Jan 23rd 2018 - "I gave the health secretary an extra £6bn at the recent budget and we will look at departmental allocations again at the spending review when that takes place."

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politi...-down-11898234

And Boris Johnson countered the same day with an additional payment on top of that of 100 million a week, moving towards meeting his battle bus pledge of 350m a week extra for the NHS.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42783247

So now you know it, remainers want the NHS to crash and burn, Brexiteers want to save our NHS.

Utter nonsense, and it makes no sense whatsoever - she was put in power after the vote everyone knew she preferred to remain, removing her would make no difference in that regard.

Of course it would make a difference. Appointment of a Brexit PM would lead to immediate cessation of Danegeld payments from the UK to the EU enabling full funding of our NHS.

[Mayhem]

Actually remainer Phillip Hammond was reported as saying it on Jan 23rd 2018 - "I gave the health secretary an extra £6bn at the recent budget and we will look at departmental allocations again at the spending review when that takes place."

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politi...-down-11898234

And Boris Johnson countered the same day with an additional payment on top of that of 100 million a week, moving towards meeting his battle bus pledge of 350m a week extra for the NHS.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42783247

So now you know it, remainers want the NHS to crash and burn, Brexiteers want to save our NHS.

And you still haven't answered where that money came from, also by now i don't know who the remainers are anymore, because according to you they are neither the tories nor labour, that doesn't leave too many, incidentally none of them were in charge in the past years. Somehow none of this adds up, it can't be some of the stuff you wrote was untrue, can it?