The Brexit aftermath thread

[Huehuecoyotl]

Someone has to ask for an extension though, the default is still to leave deal or no deal. An extension is not the default.

And why would the EU agree to that extension?, when polls clearly show that should another referendum be tabled the rerun losers vote may well return the same results. If not by a bigger margin to leave. And even if your scenario does happen, that doesn't settle the EU question definitively. Only No Deal settles that for a generation. Do the EU want the UK half in as a disgruntled vassal state shit stirring, vetoing and causing trouble all the time?

I doubt that, but should it happen there will be 17.4 million anti EU UK voters just waiting to jump at the chance of holding to account those UK politicians, in marginal seats, who enabled it.

Sounding more and more desperate there dribbles. The knowledge that your dreams are slipping through your fingers is starting to leak into your posts. We did warn you, but your delusions wouldn't allow you to accept the truth.

Not long now until the truth of Brexits failure is manifest, even to you.

[dribbles]

A deal UK would have no say, no veto, no significance in decision making. You'd be reduced to receiving instructions. You're overrating your importance once more.

Not at all. Unless we end up with "no deal" after March 29th, this is not the end of the brexit process. And 17.4 million people will have a say, one way or the other. UK and EU politicians should be mindful of that.

They will be heard in the UK as we are a democracy, are you admitting the EU is not democratic and those millions of people will just be ignored?

Sounding more and more desperate there dribbles. The knowledge that your dreams are slipping through your fingers is starting to leak into your posts. We did warn you, but your delusions wouldn't allow you to accept the truth.

Not long now until the truth of Brexits failure is manifest, even to you.

No failure in sight, it's not over until the fat lady sings, March 29th is approaching fast.... tick tock.

[LeGin Tufnel]

Someone has to ask for an extension though, the default is still to leave deal or no deal. An extension is not the default.

Are we talking at cross-purposes? I'm not following.

We won't need an extension as May's Deal will pass - we leave the EU.

You think the meaningful vote on May's Deal wilil result in a defeat again?

[Pann]

Nah, it won't get to the stage of asking the EU for an extension. The ERG will bottle it and we're going to end up with May's Deal... I'll wager money on it. Vassel state. Wasn't it Pann who said it'd be this scenario all along?

I was convinced before Christmas that eventually May's would pass at the last minute. Now I am not so sure, I still think it has a chance of passing but anything could happen!

Someone has to ask for an extension though, the default is still to leave deal or no deal. An extension is not the default.

And why would the EU agree to that extension?, when polls clearly show that should another referendum be tabled the rerun losers vote may well return the same results. If not by a bigger margin to leave. And even if your scenario does happen, that doesn't settle the EU question definitively. Only No Deal settles that for a generation. Do the EU want the UK half in as a disgruntled vassal state shit stirring, vetoing and causing trouble all the time?

I doubt that, but should it happen there will be 17.4 million anti EU UK voters just waiting to jump at the chance of holding to account those UK politicians, in marginal seats, who enabled it.

I would imagine that the possibility of an extension has already been agreed in principle within the EU27, even if it is just to give member states additional time to make no deal preparations.

I think that a 2nd referendum would probably not be successful in overturning the leave result.

[dribbles]

Are we talking at cross-purposes? I'm not following.

We won't need an extension as May's Deal will pass - we leave the EU.

You think the meaningful vote on May's Deal wilil result in a defeat again?

We don't know what is in May's deal yet though. But it failed last time back in January by the biggest margin in parliamentary history..230 votes.

If it is still essentially the same do you think it will pass? I wouldn't bet money on it.

[Pann]

We don't know what is in May's deal yet though. But it failed last time back in January by the biggest margin in parliamentary history..230 votes.

If it is still essentially the same do you think it will pass? I wouldn't bet money on it.

Time is a powerful weapon in politics and the prospect of being up against the (no-deal/no Brexit) wall may well be enough to force MPs to back it however if parliament is successful in taking the option of no-deal off of the table then May's dead is, imo, dead in water.

[LeGin Tufnel]

however if parliament is successful in taking the option of no-deal off of the table then May's dead is, imo, dead in water.

But why do you think that? My interpretation is that then the (Leaver's) fear would be no Brexit at all, therefore May's Deal passes.

[Slant]

Not at all. Unless we end up with "no deal" after March 29th, this is not the end of the brexit process. And 17.4 million people will have a say, one way or the other. UK and EU politicians should be mindful of that.

They will be heard in the UK as we are a democracy, are you admitting the EU is not democratic and those millions of people will just be ignored?

17.4 million people just started the process to leave the EU in what they perceive to be a democratic process. The EU is respecting that wish. Rest assured, though, that a third country will not get a say in how the EU runs itself. So, no, those 17.4 million people will not be heard, one way or the other. They will no longer be EU citizens and what they say or think matters just about as much as what Canadians think or say.

What the UK does internally is a matter of the UK and no concern of the EU after March 29th. This is what you wanted. How are you still not getting it?

- - - Updated - - -

We don't know what is in May's deal yet though. But it failed last time back in January by the biggest margin in parliamentary history..230 votes.

If it is still essentially the same do you think it will pass? I wouldn't bet money on it.

WE KNOW WHAT IS IN MAY'S DEAL. What do you think everyone is discussing these days?
https://www.businessinsider.de/read-...8-11?r=US&IR=T
https://ec.europa.eu/commission/site...greement_0.pdf

It's a miracle that you seem to be finding the keys on your keyboard to produce the nonsense in your posts...

[Gigantique]

Thinking that if Brexit doesn’t happen the EU would be the ones «ignoring the democratic 17.4 million voters», and not the UK where the decision to ignore them would be made has got to be the most beautiful act of delusion I’ve seen from dribbles in some time!

[Pann]

But why do you think that? My interpretation is that then the (Leaver's) fear would be no Brexit at all, therefore May's Deal passes.

It lost by 230 votes the last time, with no deal out of the way the remainers do not need to back it as A50 would need to be extended/rescinded when it fails to pass which would mean that the deal would be reliant on leaver Con (bear in mind that Lab will probably vote against it anyway) MPs to vote it through therefore I am not sure (although I might be wrong and haven't looked into the details) there are the numbers to get it through.

[Slant]

Thinking that if Brexit doesn’t happen the EU would be the ones «ignoring the democratic 17.4 million voters», and not the UK where the decision to ignore them would be made has got to be the most beautiful act of delusion I’ve seen from dribbles in some time!

Oh, he's talking about a no Brexit scenario? I think I misread that. Doesn't change much, though. It's not the EU's task to implement domestic policy in the UK. The EU didn't ask for the referendum so the referendum result is quite inconsequential for the EU. They're dealing with member states on this level, not member states' citizens. At least in this scenario concerning Article 50.

[dribbles]

But why do you think that? My interpretation is that then the (Leaver's) fear would be no Brexit at all, therefore May's Deal passes.

May's deal is BRINO. There is not much difference between no brexit and her deal. 17.4 million people are going to be unhappy with either, and at the next possible chance MP's who enable that will be punished at the next available ballot.

The only deal that satisfies those millions currently is no deal, or possibly May's deal if there is the unilateral right for the UK to leave the Irish backstop should the EU choose to use it as a mechanism to keep the UK in the EU against its will.

Has that modification been added to May's deal to placate the brexiteers or not? We don't know...have the EU politicians ignored democracy and the will of 17.4 million people?

And then we can talk about the £39bn....

As it stands, the ERG/leavers/Tories/Labour amongst the 230 as proved in January cannot vote for May's BRINO deal which places us in a worse position than we are in now.

May's deal as it stands cannot pass.

[Blobfish]

On Tv they where saying that if they where to have another Brexit vote.. the Questions on the Referendum would be something like this:

1/ Lets leave Europe with PM Theresa Mays negotiated offer.

2/ Lets just leave Europe .

3/ Lets stay in Europe.


So questions 1 & 2 are for leaving .. that's 2 options to leave

Question 3 is to stay..

The leave vote will be Divided & Stay will win..
I do not see this type of questioning as fair for Pro Leavers.

[Slant]

May's deal is BRINO. There is not much difference between no brexit and her deal. 17.4 million people are going to be unhappy with either, and at the next possible chance MP's who enable that will be punished at the next available ballot.

The only deal that satisfies those millions currently is no deal, or possibly May's deal if there is the unilateral right for the UK to leave the Irish backstop should the EU choose to use it as a mechanism to keep the UK in the EU against its will.

Has that modification been added to May's deal to placate the brexiteers or not? We don't know...have the EU politicians ignored democracy and the will of 17.4 million people?

And then we can talk about the £39bn....

As it stands, the ERG/leavers/Tories/Labour amongst the 230 as proved in January cannot vote for May's BRINO deal which places us in a worse position than we are in now.

May's deal as it stands cannot pass.

The EU politicians don't represent those 17.4 million people for the process of Brexit. They're negotiating with the British Government in an adversarial setup. You want that, we want this. Compromise is the result. A compromise the UK asked for, mind you. Not our problem that you don't like what you proposed. :P

And those millions voted for millions of different Brexits. Since your campaign of lies and deceits practically promised everything at once, that's what you got. Your problem. You solve it.

And just to be clear, nobody gives a shit about those £39bn except you, Dribs. Germany alone made a €58bn surplus last year. That's how little that money actually is.

- - - Updated - - -

On Tv they where saying that if they where to have another Brexit vote.. the Questions on the Referendum would be something like this:

1/ Lets leave Europe with PM Theresa Mays negotiated offer.

2/ Lets just leave Europe .

3/ Lets stay in Europe.


So questions 1 & 2 are for leaving .. that's 2 options to leave

Question 3 is to stay..

The leave vote will be Divided & Stay will win..
I do not see this type of questioning as fair for Pro Leavers.

It isn't. But it is representative of British political incompetence.

[Pann]

On Tv they where saying that if they where to have another Brexit vote.. the Questions on the Referendum would be something like this:

1/ Lets leave Europe with PM Theresa Mays negotiated offer.

2/ Lets just leave Europe .

3/ Lets stay in Europe.


So questions 1 & 2 are for leaving .. that's 2 options to leave

Question 3 is to stay..

The leave vote will be Divided & Stay will win..
I do not see this type of questioning as fair for Pro Leavers.

I think that a ref. with those three options would have difficulty passing electoral commission scrutiny and by and large parliament wants to avoid the possibility of having to leave without a deal therefore they would probably not support it in the first place.

[LeGin Tufnel]

May's deal is BRINO. There is not much difference between no brexit and her deal. 17.4 million people are going to be unhappy with either,

no, because not all who voted for Leave, voted for (or now want) no deal

[dribbles]

I mean a lot of those people have just . . . died. Let's not quote numbers that are meaningless.

I'd refer you back to this poll a few weeks ago. A second referendum is no panacea to people who would like the UK to remain in the UK...

The UK has already made its choice. Despite the shenanigans in westminster it still remains, as a recent sky news poll shows, thus...

[Slant]

I'd refer you back to this poll a few weeks ago. A second referendum is no panacea to people who would like the UK to remain in the UK...

Polls that are sourced "audience poll" really mean just about as much as the toilet paper I just wiped my ass with.

[LeGin Tufnel]

ha ha ha

you couldn't make this up could you

[Pann]

Oooh, May has just said that parliament will have to vote (on 13th March) on whether on we leave without a deal if her deal is rejected on 12th and if they vote against this then a vote will be held whether to extend A50 on 14th.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politi...source=twitter