The Brexit aftermath thread

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Well done to the European Space Agency for choosing the UK, now outside of the EU, instead of anywhere inside the EU for a new space centre creating 1000's of jobs.

Well ESA isn't an EU institution. ESA has a presence in Canada, which isn't even in Europe.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Well done to the European Space Agency for choosing the UK, now outside of the EU, instead of anywhere inside the EU for a new space centre creating 1000's of jobs.

The European Space Agency has selected Leicester for its new space tech incubation centre. Expected to create 2,500 jobs, the £100m-plus Space Park Leicester development has already attracted global companies including Lockheed Martin, Thales, Airbus and Hewlett Packard

Silence from the rejoiners, can't think why :P

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/...ut-the-economy

Despite Brexit...

Interesting. And clearly yet another article that you haven't read, or haven't understood. Or are trying desparately to misrepresent.

The ESA are planning a space tech incubation site in Leicester, yes. They have a number of such sites, in various locations. Space Park Leicester is where they are planning to base it; it is that location (which is part of the University of Leicester) which is the £100m site which is expected to employ 2,500 people. Not the ESA specifically.

Now find me anything that says something about the size of the investment that the ESA are actually making, or the number of jobs it is expected to create. Because from where I'm sitting this is just the ESA (which as far as I can tell does not have anything to do with the EU directly, and tries to stay non-political) making sure they can hoover up any good ideas that the UK comes up with and make a profit out of them. It would be a shame if we had to build a £100m site just to get a tiny little local office of the ESA to base themselves there.

Really dribbles, at least try and come up with something that isn't paper thin like this. If I can punch holes in it with a couple of minutes of googling and some skim reading, it really suggests you aren't putting the effort in. Low energy from you. Sad.

And your last comment is very telling...."despite Brexit". So you're admitting that this investement is NOTHING to do with Brexit. That it would have happened regardless. Doesn't exactly sell it as a "Brexit dividend", does it?

[Mayhem]

Despite Brexit...

Shouldn't you be saying "because of Brexit"? I mean, "despite Brexit" sounds as if Brexit was a bad thing.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Shouldn't you be saying "because of Brexit"? I mean, "despite Brexit" sounds as if Brexit was a bad thing.

Even the best con-artists slip up at some point.

[dribbles]

Interesting. And clearly yet another article that you haven't read, or haven't understood. Or are trying desparately to misrepresent.

The ESA are planning a space tech incubation site in Leicester, yes. They have a number of such sites, in various locations. Space Park Leicester is where they are planning to base it; it is that location (which is part of the University of Leicester) which is the £100m site which is expected to employ 2,500 people. Not the ESA specifically.

Now find me anything that says something about the size of the investment that the ESA are actually making, or the number of jobs it is expected to create. Because from where I'm sitting this is just the ESA (which as far as I can tell does not have anything to do with the EU directly, and tries to stay non-political) making sure they can hoover up any good ideas that the UK comes up with and make a profit out of them. It would be a shame if we had to build a £100m site just to get a tiny little local office of the ESA to base themselves there.

Really dribbles, at least try and come up with something that isn't paper thin like this. If I can punch holes in it with a couple of minutes of googling and some skim reading, it really suggests you aren't putting the effort in. Low energy from you. Sad.

And your last comment is very telling...."despite Brexit". So you're admitting that this investement is NOTHING to do with Brexit. That it would have happened regardless. Doesn't exactly sell it as a "Brexit dividend", does it?

Lol at tiny little European Space Agency office outpost in a development costing 100 million quid, yeah it will be miniscule. If the construction costs are accurate and it takes a year to build, divide that 100m by £30k average salaries to find the number of UK builders employed for the next 12 months.

100 million quid is enough to build 4x1000 student secondary schools to put it in some size perspective. It is not a piffling sum and taken in the round will be a part of an industry worth currently £300bn to the UK.

Strange that European inward investment in the UK is celebrated by brexiteers and sneered at by supposedly EU supporters wouldn't you say? It is a clear brexit benefit that would have been unlikely to happen had we not voted to leave and were still sending all our spare dosh to the EU. The UK is far more attractive to global companies now we are outside the EU than it was before when we were in.

Which is why the European Space Agency are joining soon at Leicester:- Lockheed Martin, Hewlett Packard, Airbus & Amazon presumably as they agree with Prof Paul Monks, head of the University of Leicester’s Science and Engineering College when he says,

“There is no-where in the EU like this and the UK has a particular appeal as a nexus between the US and the EU.
US companies want to work in the UK rather than mainland Europe because of the special relationship we have with them.”

https://www.business-live.co.uk/tech...irbus-16563805
https://www.business-live.co.uk/tech...gency-18480934

So yeah, because of (for Mayhem) Brexit indeed the best of the best are still flocking to the UK. Shameful you rejoiners turn your nose up at it and try, head in the sand style, to pretend otherwise.

[LeGin Tufnel]

Shameful you rejoiners turn your nose up at it and try, head in the sand style, to pretend otherwise.

Your vocab is entering new territory here, Mr D.

What the fuck is a rejoiner? You wouldn't get points in a game of Scrabble for that.

Sounds like some awful American televangelist term for describing someone shortly to meet their maker.

[dribbles]

Your vocab is entering new territory here, Mr D.

What the fuck is a rejoiner? You wouldn't get points in a game of Scrabble for that.

Sounds like some awful American televangelist term for describing someone shortly to meet their maker.

Doesn't the 21st C version of scrabble accept entries from https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rejoiner#English?

Now we have left the EU brexiteers have become remainers, with a desire to remain outside the EU and rejoiners are the ones who want to, well rejoin the EU.

Does that help? I claim my 16 scrabble points :P

[LeGin Tufnel]

Touché...

Dribbles has just beaten me at Scrabble.

[Xarkan]

Wow, good on them. They managed to negotiate to maintain the status quo. Great success for Brexit.

They managed that in 2019.. January 31 2019

Because they probably pretty much said "we want to buy your fish, you want to sell your fish, we will say nothing about about whales" .. hard deal that one. Though i guess it is impressive they did not manage to fuck it up

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Touché...

Dribbles has just beaten me at Scrabble.

Not so fast:

https://scrabble.hasbro.com/en-us/tools#dictionary

It isn't in the official Scrabble dictionary, so dribbles loses his turn and has to return the tiles to his rack. Challenge upheld.

[dribbles]

Not so fast:

https://scrabble.hasbro.com/en-us/tools#dictionary

It isn't in the official Scrabble dictionary, so dribbles loses his turn and has to return the tiles to his rack. Challenge upheld.

With respect to Scrabble they are behind the times, a bit like those living in the past that can't accept the democratic landslide result of the UK brexit vote, they don't even acknowledge that "brexit" is now an official Oxford English dictionary word and has been for several years.

Five years from now, as ahead of the times brexiteers suggest, I'm sure "rejoiners" will be in their dictionary as they catch up with the constantly evolving English language.

3 days until, according to the EU, the chance of transition extension expires and with no chance of the UK requesting one, happy days! Keep on scrabbling to tie the UK to the EU rejoiners, tick tock!

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

With respect to Scrabble they are behind the times, a bit like those living in the past that can't accept the democratic landslide result of the UK brexit vote, they don't even acknowledge that "brexit" is now an official Oxford English dictionary word and has been for several years.

"But it's in xyz dictionary!" is a common exclamation by Scrabble players (usually shortly before they are told to remove their tiles because it isn't in the dictionary that actually matters in the scope of the game).

[caervek]

With respect to Scrabble they are behind the times, a bit like those living in the past that can't accept the democratic landslide result of the UK brexit vote

O.o

51.89% vs 48.11% is a difference of 3.78%, Maybe you should look up landslide in a dictionary :P (NB: That is actually a Scrabble legal word).

[LeGin Tufnel]

Not so fast:

https://scrabble.hasbro.com/en-us/tools#dictionary

It isn't in the official Scrabble dictionary, so dribbles loses his turn and has to return the tiles to his rack. Challenge upheld.

Ha.

There are so many analogies to be drawn here: not playing by the rules, inexactitude with facts ('rejoiner' would actually be 15 points not 16), overly optimistic appraisal of future events etc.

3 days until, according to the EU, the chance of transition extension expires and with no chance of the UK requesting one, happy days! Keep on scrabbling to tie the UK to the EU rejoiners, tick tock!

Not necessarily:

https://www.lexology.com/library/det...2-b9ee6ba32f01

So, is a No Deal Brexit inevitable if there is no extension sought and granted before 30 June 2020?

The simple answer is no. There are five main outcomes (but other possibilities could emerge over time):

1. a deal is concluded between the EU and the UK – the odds are currently against that but it is certainly possible (the experience of the EU is that deals can be done but they are often long and late)
2. the UK changes its mind and seeks, before 30 June 2020, an extension – the odds are currently even more against that occurring but it is possible
3. near the end of 2020, the EU and UK agree to extend the 31 December 2020 deadline on the basis that both sides "are almost there" and it is necessary to extend the deadline so as to close the deal – this is certainly possible but both sides lose some face
4. there is a hard no-deal Brexit – this is possible. "Trading on WTO terms" – the phrase used by many Brexiteers – would not resolve matters because there are many issues called out by the UK as important (e.g., fisheries) which would not be addressed by "WTO terms" so there would be a great deal of uncertainty and confusion
5. there is no agreement between the EU and the UK but each side decides unilaterally to extend certain privileges to the other and agree informally to continue as they are. So, the UK Government might well say that it has not sought an extension (as a matter of formality) and could continue to operate the transition regime as if nothing happened. That is not easy but could be used as a "sticky tape" solution and if there is no agreement then a great deal of "sticky tape" would be needed to cover the cracks and the gaps

[Demolitia]

Ha.

There are so many analogies to be drawn here: not playing by the rules, inexactitude with facts ('rejoiner' would actually be 15 points not 16), overly optimistic appraisal of future events etc.



Not necessarily:

https://www.lexology.com/library/det...2-b9ee6ba32f01

So, is a No Deal Brexit inevitable if there is no extension sought and granted before 30 June 2020?

The simple answer is no. There are five main outcomes (but other possibilities could emerge over time):

1. a deal is concluded between the EU and the UK – the odds are currently against that but it is certainly possible (the experience of the EU is that deals can be done but they are often long and late)
2. the UK changes its mind and seeks, before 30 June 2020, an extension – the odds are currently even more against that occurring but it is possible
3. near the end of 2020, the EU and UK agree to extend the 31 December 2020 deadline on the basis that both sides "are almost there" and it is necessary to extend the deadline so as to close the deal – this is certainly possible but both sides lose some face
4. there is a hard no-deal Brexit – this is possible. "Trading on WTO terms" – the phrase used by many Brexiteers – would not resolve matters because there are many issues called out by the UK as important (e.g., fisheries) which would not be addressed by "WTO terms" so there would be a great deal of uncertainty and confusion
5. there is no agreement between the EU and the UK but each side decides unilaterally to extend certain privileges to the other and agree informally to continue as they are. So, the UK Government might well say that it has not sought an extension (as a matter of formality) and could continue to operate the transition regime as if nothing happened. That is not easy but could be used as a "sticky tape" solution and if there is no agreement then a great deal of "sticky tape" would be needed to cover the cracks and the gaps

BoJo made it so that no extension can be requested at this point.
The EUs main concern at this pointbis that a sectorial/cherry picked/ tailored deal would potentially have to to be approved by every member state.
Now there is time to change the law on both sides for an extension if both sides agree, but clearly Barnier's mandate is what keeps the EU together. Germany's presidency will work some level of magic, but the UK has to give to.

It's alot of if

[LeGin Tufnel]

BoJo made it so that no extension can be requested at this point.
The EUs main concern at this pointbis that a sectorial/cherry picked/ tailored deal would potentially have to to be approved by every member state.
Now there is time to change the law on both sides for an extension if both sides agree, but clearly Barnier's mandate is what keeps the EU together. Germany's presidency will work some level of magic, but the UK has to give to.

It's alot of if

Yep, I know... but where's the give here? E.g., you'll have the UK right wing press calling for French fishing trawlers to be shot out of the water. Both you and I know this is evil, obscene & ridiculous, but it's the truth.

Of course, however, this isn't BJ & the free-marketeers' end goal (a stress-free life on their private islands in the South Pacific). Question is: how do they square that circle now?

[dribbles]

BoJo made it so that no extension can be requested at this point.
The EUs main concern at this pointbis that a sectorial/cherry picked/ tailored deal would potentially have to to be approved by every member state.
Now there is time to change the law on both sides for an extension if both sides agree, but clearly Barnier's mandate is what keeps the EU together. Germany's presidency will work some level of magic, but the UK has to give to.

It's alot of if

The spartans in the Tory party, positions strengthened as Boris continues to cleanse the civil service swamp of remainers with the promotion of David Frost UK negotiator, will not allow the UK to move on its red lines. The EU has to give, particularly on this, amongst many other things:-

“there can be no way that the European Court of Justice can be allowed to have any role in the UK’s national life after the end of this year.”

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/po...g-to-eu/29/06/

That would constitute a bad deal, and a no deal is better than that.

[LeGin Tufnel]

The spartans in the Tory party, positions strengthened as Boris continues to cleanse the civil service swamp of remainers with the promotion of David Frost UK negotiator, will not allow the UK to move on its red lines. The EU has to give, particularly on this, amongst many other things:-

“there can be no way that the European Court of Justice can be allowed to have any role in the UK’s national life after the end of this year.”

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/po...g-to-eu/29/06/

That would constitute a bad deal, and a no deal is better than that.

buuuuulllllshiiiiit...

They don't give a fuck.

All they care about is lining their own pockets (with maybe the exception of Cummings, who is a genuine bona fide psychopath).

[Huehuecoyotl]

The spartans in the Tory party, positions strengthened as Boris continues to cleanse the civil service swamp of remainers with the promotion of David Frost UK negotiator, will not allow the UK to move on its red lines. The EU has to give, particularly on this, amongst many other things:-

“there can be no way that the European Court of Justice can be allowed to have any role in the UK’s national life after the end of this year.”

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/po...g-to-eu/29/06/

That would constitute a bad deal, and a no deal is better than that.

Ah, the joy of watching people that believe that in negotiations, all the "give" is going to come from the party in a position of greater power. Except when it's us in a position of greater power, of course, then we can force the other party to move to our advantage.

How does your head contain this much cognitive dissonance without exploding like that guy in Scanners?

Still, either Boris climbs down and gets humiliated. Or we go ahead with no-deal Brexit and ALL the Brexit crew get humiliated. I'd rather the former, of course, but if the latter is our only choice....

The last time Boris was in a position like this, with a deadline looming, he signed a deal that was WORSE for us than the one May tried to get through, and sold out NI to the EU. He then sold it as a sucess to his gullible marks (eh dribbles?) afterwards, but no amount of lipstick was going to make that particular pig attractive. But he's going to need to make it as attractive as possible, because if he wants a deal he's going to need to go the proverbial Black Mirror on it.

Sorry, I just threw up in my mouth a little.

[Demolitia]

The spartans in the Tory party, positions strengthened as Boris continues to cleanse the civil service swamp of remainers with the promotion of David Frost UK negotiator, will not allow the UK to move on its red lines. The EU has to give, particularly on this, amongst many other things:-

“there can be no way that the European Court of Justice can be allowed to have any role in the UK’s national life after the end of this year.”

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/po...g-to-eu/29/06/

That would constitute a bad deal, and a no deal is better than that.

/slowclap ok troll.
You're not really in a position to negotiate anything. We will drag on negotiatiations on trade for as long as we need and starve you.
The thing you are interested in selling us. Services. Is an equivalence the EU can decide unilaterally.