Mega-Thread: Mueller investigation

[Edge-]

The electoral college very much keeps the status quo. Aside from that, there was a Republican president that lost to the electoral college and won the popular vote but no one raised an eyebrow. Now because the dems lost they're pitching a bitchfit. Grow the fuck up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...e_popular_vote

That has literally never happened.

[Santti]

name one in the last 100 years

I believe it has happened something like 4 times now, that popular vote lost to EC? Don't know the timing, or who lost to whom. Too lazy to check.

[Thekri]

He has all that while in a jail cell?

He is in Martha Stewart jail. Not poor people jail.

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I believe it has happened something like 4 times now, that popular vote lost to EC? Don't know the timing, or who lost to whom. Too lazy to check.

Nope. That never happened. Never been two consecutive instances. 4 of the presidents that benefited from it were republicans... the other one was weird. John Quincy Adams won, but technically all the candidates were the same party, and not every state even voted to determine electoral college votes, several of them still just had their legislatures choose. He didn't technically win the electoral college either, he actually got elected by congress. So it doesn't really count for a lot of reasons.

[Bdatik]

I believe it has happened something like 4 times now, that popular vote lost to EC? Don't know the timing, or who lost to whom. Too lazy to check.

He specifically mentioned it happening to a Republican though. And like every other poster of his ilk, he'll do a magic trick and disappear without a trace.

[Santti]

Nope. That never happened. Never been two consecutive instances. 4 of the presidents that benefited from it were republicans... the other one was weird. John Quincy Adams won, but technically all the candidates were the same party, and not every state even voted to determine electoral college votes, several of them still just had their legislatures choose. He didn't technically win the electoral college either, he actually got elected by congress. So it doesn't really count for a lot of reasons.

Oh, I was just commenting on how it has happened 4 times that popular vote lost to EC (thanks CGP Grey). The specifics were all unknown to me.

But yeah, it appears Antius was full of shit.

[Blur4stuff]

Rural states already get lopsided representation in the senate.

Conservatives live in cities and blue states.

Someone living in the middle of Wyoming doesn't somehow have better judgement than everyone else.

Rural voters would not have their interests hurt without the EC. They would be just fine.

[FeedsOnDevTears]

Oh so they're going that route again where when individual FBI agents have their own thoughts on things that don't line up with Trump's suddenly means something.

Well, Trump would lie and cheat to destroy anyone who didn't agree with him on everything, so he assumes they'll do the same. Because he doesn't have a conscience.

[Trifle]

Guess I'll say this for the 20th time here. Apparently people have trouble grasping the concept of the electoral college and it's genius. The electoral college exists because a city where millions more people live and likely share the same political ideals should not outweigh a smaller population spread out over a larger area where their political ideals will be more mixed.

Cities also have diverse political ideals, and I'm not sure why the votes of people in cities should automatically count for less than the votes of people in rural areas... Heck, that isn't even the case as rural California votes still count for less than the urban votes in eg Connecticut, so I've having trouble seeing this 'genius'.

States already get 2 senators each regardless of size to ensure that states are represented fairly, so extending this to the presidential vote seems unnecessary.

[Shalcker]

Sanctions are votes on by Congress, not the President.

Congress members already visited on 4th July.

Therefore, Trump can't just take them off during the meeting. Your lack of knowledge shows again.

He doesn't actually have to "take them off during meeting"; he only has to provide some possible path of eventually lifting them (that, obviously, doesn't involve giving Crimea back).

[Mormolyce]

Trump-Putin meeting is on 16th, yes, a bit too soon.

Meanwhile i'm enjoying Russian stock rally from mere anticipation; pretty sure most expectations are overblown, but surprises are still possible.

I wouldn't get your hopes up, Congress will shoot anything he suggests down.

You need to buy off more Congressmen you cheapskates.

[draynay]

I wouldn't get your hopes up, Congress will shoot anything he suggests down.

You need to buy off more Congressmen you cheapskates.

They've got so many other interests they're bidding against, congressmen can only pimp themselves out so much, even they have a limit.

[Shalcker]

I wouldn't get your hopes up, Congress will shoot anything he suggests down.

Well, the worst that can happen is that absolutely nothing changes. Which is unlikely, really - Trump wants his "wins" and i'm pretty sure we can provide a few even if purely symbolic ones.

And any changes to situation can only be to the better because both Trump's Administration and US Congress already used their "big guns" with fairly mediocre effect.

[timberx]

The electoral college very much keeps the status quo. Aside from that, there was a Republican president that lost to the electoral college and won the popular vote but no one raised an eyebrow. Now because the dems lost they're pitching a bitchfit. Grow the fuck up.

How can you be President if you lost the electoral college?

[Mormolyce]

Well, the worst that can happen is that absolutely nothing changes.

No, the worst that can happen is more sanctions. Like last time, remember?

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Guess I'll say this for the 20th time here. Apparently people have trouble grasping the concept of the electoral college and it's genius. The electoral college exists because a city where millions more people live and likely share the same political ideals should not outweigh a smaller population spread out over a larger area where their political ideals will be more mixed.

The electoral college very much keeps the status quo. Aside from that, there was a Republican president that lost to the electoral college and won the popular vote but no one raised an eyebrow. Now because the dems lost they're pitching a bitchfit. Grow the fuck up.

The electoral college does not do that, no matter how many times you repeat that fallacy.

Are Florida and Ohio small rural states?

[Felya]

The electoral college very much keeps the status quo. Aside from that, there was a Republican president that lost to the electoral college and won the popular vote but no one raised an eyebrow. Now because the dems lost they're pitching a bitchfit. Grow the fuck up.

There were only 4 times it happened. Only 2 of those were within last 100 years, which were Gore and Clinton. What the heck are you talking about?

If you are talking about Trump going off that Romney won the popular vote, but lost the election. When Trump was yelling for a revolution... yeah, Romney lost the popular vote... Trump needed to wait 15 min for more results.

You cannot be talking about this, right?

Donald Trump blasted the electoral college in 2012, before it gave him the presidency
http://www.businessinsider.com/donal...r-vote-2016-11

"He lost the popular vote by a lot and won the election. We should have a revolution in this country!" said Trump in a tweet that was later deleted. "More votes equals a loss … revolution!" he said in another.

Obama's popular vote total eventually surpassed Romney's, and the incumbent safely won re-election with 51.1% of the vote.

Should have learned by now... don’t repeat things Trump is saying. You are not a billionaire to get away with it.

[Mormolyce]

How can you be President if you lost the electoral college?

Well technically Bush Jr would've lost the EC if they'd done a full recount, but you know he had the Supreme Court in his pocket. But you're right, it still makes no sense because Bush Jr lost the popular vote too.

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There were only 4 times it happened. Only 2 of those were within last 100 years, which were Gore and Clinton. What the heck are you talking about?

If you are talking about Trump going off that Romney won the popular vote, but lost the election. When Trump was yelling for a revolution... yeah, Romney lost the popular vote... Trump needed to wait 15 min for more results.

Oh God, I think you're right - he's actually taking that idiotic old tweet of Trump's seriously. That's the only explanation. LOL.

[Felya]

Oh God, I think you're right - he's actually taking that idiotic old tweet of Trump's seriously. That's the only explanation. LOL.

If it is that... it’s so much worse, because Trump knew how wrong he was, that even he deleted the posts. Continuing to repeat it, is just bizarre.

[Shalcker]

No, the worst that can happen is more sanctions. Like last time, remember?

More sanctions are result of meeting between Trump and Putin? In your dreams maybe.

Even with last sanctions they had to move deadline because they clearly overshot what was actually possible.

[Dontrike]

He doesn't actually have to "take them off during meeting"; he only has to provide some possible path of eventually lifting them (that, obviously, doesn't involve giving Crimea back).

Why lift them when he isn't enforcing any of them?

[Shalcker]

Why lift them when he isn't enforcing any of them?

It doesn't matter if he will actually lift them - showing he might be open to cooperation at some point will be enough.

Don't expect everything to get resolved in one meeting; we have decades of various grievances.

Most likely areas are something about Syria/Iran (because that's what Saudi's and Israelis want, and Trump seems to be talking to them frequently) and possibly something about terrorism, in vaguest terms possible.

Or he might pull Obama and say he'll have more flexibility after midterms/Mueller wraps up.