Mega-Thread: Mueller investigation

[cubby]

Just adding something from elsewhere but for the German Foreign Minister to talk this harshly about essentially not seeing the US as a dependable ally anymore, I think at least the Germans expect Trump to be reelected.

We are in for some dark days if Trump is reelected. That will indicate that a number of key areas have failed.

[Felya]

I think this post belongs here:

She's being held until her hearing on Wednesday. Her indictment shows that Russia and the NRA used shell companies to funnel money into the NRA to interfere in US elections.

It will be interesting to see how Republicans respond to this, specifically the ones who take/have taken money from the NRA.

Some quotes from the indictment:

And here is a video of Trump speaking to Maria Butina about ending sanctions on Russia before the election:
https://www.motherjones.com/politics...-his-campaign/

I've seen a lot of people speculate that "US Person 1" is likely David Keene, former President of the NRA and current editor for The Washington Times.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...-trump-630054/

[Deleted]

lmao America is so dirty, basically if you have some money to throw around Americans will sell thier own mothers for a fair price. Time for the EU to start pulling up its socks when it comes to military spending. The US is clearly now an adversary that we should be planning to contain them.

[cubby]

For one thing, the death of the status quo. I think if we reach 2020 and he is reelected, we will see immediate actions by European nations to diminish the US in world organizations. The true question will be who will ally with China first or if all three of us will start playing against each other. And what will happen if the WTO is ruined (and if Trump lasts that long and continues refusing to appoint judges it WILL be ruined) thus removing the US' most important structural ally in world trade (because everyone who is not an idiot and can read knows that the WTO is structured to be overwhelmingly in favor of the US) and opening up opportunities for Brazil and India to ascend, something I believe favors the EU since unlike the US, we actually are great at making trade deals.

The GOP has gotten very good at shitting on their constituents and then blaming the Dems. Combined with cutting education it's a strategy that is working - Trump is the embodiment of that plan - along with controlling Congress. If Trump is reelected I think the U.S. see far worse than the WTO being ruined - I think the hope that was america, and which even through Bush2 continued to prosper, will die.

And if this is what people who know what is going on want, I can at least respect an informed opinion voting on what they think is right. But this is the masses being lied to - blatantly - and then dying because of it.

If we see Trump in the White House until 2024 - we will become a banana republic. I could see one of Trump's children being groomed for the white house, along with a slim possibility of amending the constitution to see a longer presidential reign. Essentially, the days before true darkness falls on the country.

People laugh at these remarks, but we have NEVER seen anyone this bad in the white house - ever. This is what early 1930's Germany looked like.

[cubby]

I think the issue is that at some point the Mueller investigation got damning evidence not against Trump but rather against the RNC and the GOP knows this. Which meant that they could no longer just pass everything they wanted and then dump him because some of them (or a lot of their money) would go down with him. That was the turning point where from allowing the investigation to happen things changed to them discrediting one of the most conservative and pro-Republican institutions.

That is an interesting point, one that I tend to agree. The FBI raid in 2016 on a small RNC fundraising office, to me, was a red flag for where the investigation was ultimately heading - even though that wasn't directly tied to Mueller. If the investigation is finding that all kinds of foreign money and corruption seeped into the RNC's infrastructure, they will have no choice but "keep on keeping on", so to speak - by attacking the efficacy of the Mueller investigation and backing whatever Trump does.

We're seeing direct ties to the NRA and the RNC national campaign fundraising accounts. RICO is what would take a whole lot of them down, and they have to know that - the flood of retiring GOP members being a key sign of something going on in that area.

I'd honestly hope you'd have the balls to split as a country rather than go forward with such corruption. It's not worthy it. It is vastly harder to repair governance than to devolve it.

I don't see us splitting - either we have a blue wave and trump is out by 2020 or the ignorant majority takes over completely. I do not joke when I make comparisons to 1930's Germany. Trump has already hinted that lifetime presidents would be a good thing that "we should try" here in the U.S. That or nepitism will keep the Trump's in power for decades. Obviously I'm drawing the darkest conclusions - but there aren't many even gray ones to draw with Trump staying in power through 2024.

I used to think they would just not let him run a second term and present him as either tired or having health issues after he'd openly endorse their candidate but as I've said elsewhere I think his narcissism has overcome his rational fear of the responsibility of his position (obvious in his disbelief when he was elected) and he know truly believes he knows best. And if the GOP cannot antagonize him without going down with him, they are going to have to play this to the end.

Agreed. Ease him out with a "mission accomplished" type message to his rabid fans and then fix all his shit with a win over Pence. But not anymore. They are all openly attacking the Mueller investigation and offering any red herring that comes along as bait for the witch hunt narrative - the FBI congressional hearings being the most recent of many such incidents.

I just don't know anymore.

[Wyrt]

I think this post belongs here:

Well, that certainly explains why some Republicans are trying so fucking hard to make Mueller go away. Seems it's more than just Trump on Russia's payroll.

[cubby]

Well, that certainly explains why some Republicans are trying so fucking hard to make Mueller go away. Seems it's more than just Trump on Russia's payroll.

If they brought in foreign moneys to the RNC national fundraising campaign, RICO will fuck them all. And they have to know that - so they need it to go away. Damn what comes of it.

A Mueller Investigation fizzle would kill any possible move against Trump.

[Wyrt]

If they brought in foreign moneys to the RNC national fundraising campaign, RICO will fuck them all. And they have to know that - so they need it to go away. Damn what comes of it.

A Mueller Investigation fizzle would kill any possible move against Trump.

I'm not even sure what happens to the country at that point. If an entire political party is taken down, or a significant portion of it. What happens?

[Wyrt]

Ask Italy I guess?

Isn't their economy doing poorly and they just elected far right government? Sounds, not great.

[cubby]

Ask Italy I guess?

Even that scenario, which I agree is a fascinating read, wouldn't remotely compare to what would happen if the GOP/RNC truly imploded. We would either see an ordered dismantlement and rebuilding of the GOP, which would be possible, or a kind of Civil War - either politically or violently.

[Wyrt]

Even that scenario, which I agree is a fascinating read, wouldn't remotely compare to what would happen if the GOP/RNC truly imploded. We would either see an ordered dismantlement and rebuilding of the GOP, which would be possible, or a kind of Civil War - either politically or violently.

Given how much GOP voters love guns.

[cubby]

Isn't their economy doing poorly and they just elected far right government? Sounds, not great.

The neo-con point of view is always much easier to sell than the middle or liberal side. So when turmoil is afoot, it tends to win out. The middle/liberal/social view point is complicated, and takes time and effort. IMO of course.

[cubby]

The point above was that "clean hands" ultimately failed. There was a short term reshuffling but Berlusconni survived unscathed, his judicial opponents vilified.
You would see GOP backers act directly to salvage the GOP. The result would probably be a more corrupt, more populist party that you cannot even indict on the sins of the past since it will rebrand. The voters will shift their allegiances with nearly no losses (90% of GOP voters back Trump after all).
You might even see President Koch in the 2020s.

And the truth just lost in the noise of President-for-Life Trump, with the GOP swarming over their newly re-gerrymanded states. Oh, Canada.

[Bullettime]

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/russi...-united-states

Russian national charged with conspiracy. Russian spy, protege of Alexander Torshin (we've seen that name a lot with Russia-NRA dealings) that was working into right wing circles and the NRA to set up opportunities and relationships for Russia. Favored friend and activist for higher ups within the NRA, was trying to organize Trump-Putin meetings during the campaign,

And it gets worse. She was involved with setting up back channels, encouraged usage of WhatsApp, and has ties in with the second smaller Steele dossier that alleges Trump's people to be getting hiring advice for cabinet positions straight from Russian leaders through said communication back channels.

Oh, and her indictments directly implicate two US citizens yet unnamed, going by US Person 1 and 2, but the pieces point to the unnamed parties being former NRA president David Keene and joint NRA-pro Russian lobbyist Paul Erickson.

She could very likely be the missing link that officially ties the NRA into this mess, especially given other reports coming out about the NRA illegally using shell companies to bypass election finance laws.

[Blur4stuff]

It's looking more and more like the NRA and a number of americans are complicit. The amount of traitorous activity these past few years is astounding.

[Rukh]

It's looking more and more like the NRA and a number of americans are complicit. The amount of traitorous activity these past few years is astounding.

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/russi...-united-states
https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-re...80766/download

The March 24, 2015 email further highlighted BUTINA's relationship with the GUN RIGHTS ORGANIZATION's leadership, including her attendance at events in the United States and BUTINA's and the RUSSIAN OFFICIAL's connections to officials of the GUN RIGHTS ORGANIZATION. BUTINA described recent visits to the United States, including reference to instances when she was introduced to POLITICAL PARTY 1 leaders as a "representative of informal diplomacy" of the Russian Federation.


On October 4, 2016, U.S. Person 1 sent an email to an acquaintance. The email covered a number of topics. Within the email, U.S. Person 1 stated, "Unrelated to specific presidential campaigns, I've been involved in securing a VERY private line of communication between the Kremlin and key POLITICAL PARTY 1 leaders through, of all conduits, the [GUN RIGHTS ORGANIZATION].

Its not just the NRA illegally funneling money. The NRA was used by russians and Republican leaders to set up secret communications.

[Wyrt]

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/russi...-united-states
https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-re...80766/download



Its not just the NRA illegally funneling money. The NRA was used by russians and Republican leaders to set up secret communications.

So, the NRA and Republican Party are both involved in treason.

This is going to get very, very messy. So many guns in the hands of so many angry individuals...

[Edge-]

http://www.dispatch.com/news/2018071...emails-suggest

Friendly reminder: Assange lied through his teeth to protect the Russian government if the evidence behind these indictments is legit.

[Bakis]

http://www.dispatch.com/news/2018071...emails-suggest

Friendly reminder: Assange lied through his teeth to protect the Russian government if the evidence behind these indictments is legit.

Could you link the text if its not too long, I get "www.dispatch.com - Access Denied
Error code 16
This request was blocked by the security rules"

[RaoBurning]

Could you link the text if its not too long, I get "www.dispatch.com - Access Denied
Error code 16
This request was blocked by the security rules"

That's a strange error message. Luckily, it's a short article.

WASHINGTON — At the beginning of 2017, one of Julian Assange’s biggest media boosters traveled to the WikiLeaks founder’s refuge inside the Ecuadorean Embassy in London and asked him where he got the leaks that shook up the U.S. presidential election only months earlier.

Fox News host Sean Hannity pointed straight to the purloined emails from the Democratic National Committee and Hillary Clinton’s campaign chairman.

“Can you say to the American people, unequivocally, that you did not get this information about the DNC, John Podesta’s emails, can you tell the American people 1,000 percent you did not get it from Russia or anybody associated with Russia?”

“Yes,” Assange said. “We can say — we have said repeatedly — over the last two months that our source is not the Russian government and it is not a state party.”