Why WoW: Classic Needs the Tweaks.

[Kirbypro]

Tbh i laught at most of your arguments about how vanilla was so great when most of them you either still have them now and many others are just exaggerations, but lets keep it on topic.

This is why blizzard is in a crossroads. Purists vs non purists will be the new flame war. Before vanilla was announced all enthusiasts were all united in their little emotion war vs blizzard. Now the civil war between them will start, when some will demand vanilla to be as it was, because they want vanilla, not vanilla and cream. Others will demand QoL changes to the game and tweaks to make life easier or enjoyable from their PoV.

This quick divide between the vanilla enthusiasts, one that was early pointed out when the whole crywar started, is one of the reasons why even though i dont mind them getting their servers, I was still skeptical of their success.

+1.

I don't want the Classic whiners to pull dev resources away from the real WoW.

[Doomislav]

IMHO, if blizz is going to do a Classic server option, it should be Vanilla without tweaks. Maybe just questline fixes and background stuff to make everything more stable, but I think it makes more sense just to have Classic be Vanilla.

[Bigbazz]

So Kel'thuzad doesn't count because it isn't friendly to melee, but Thaddius counts because it's godly for warriors.

Wasn't trying to prove that every class could dps. Was just showing you why you're wrong about rogue and warriors being so much better than everyone else. However you still bring a couple of hunters and a shadow priest even if you're min/maxing a 40 man raid.

Kel'thuzad does count, the point I was making was that despite it being unfriendly for melee they still caught up by the end. Are you purposely just looking for something to argue with instead of settling on a discussion? Because it feels like trying to put words in my mouth, attempting to keep fuel on the fire. My point in posting the logs was to laugh at vanilla tuning, the videos don't show anything different just because mages and locks are also competitive on slower kills or kills where melee is at a disadvantage through encounter design.

The original thing I was pointing out still remains, vanilla class balance is hilarious.

[Azadina]

I'll spell it out for you then. A 23 minute MC run isn't the norm. They're stacking classes that can cleave and burst, that's why you see so many warriors in there. They have damage CDs and can cleave down trash. Baron Geddon doesn't even live long enough to see the end of a warrior's recklessness CD.

Seriously look at their Naxx kill videos. Mages and Warlocks are consistently at the top. So stop claiming they get stomped by warriors and rogues because they aren't suited for speed runs.

I'm not even sure why people complain about class stacking. Did they ever have a look on world first Nefarian HC kill in cata? There's even more extreme class stacking. 17/25; druids if I recall.

[Sarevokcz]

There you go.

watching this makes you realize even most bosses in naxx were pretty damn simple mechanic wise compared to nowadays standards, add to that classes were like really easy and Im not sure how will this keep people interested for longer periods of time tbh. Time will tell I guess.

Frankly, I want the classic be the very same thing as it was in naxx patch, except maybe the way addons work, just so the debate about vanilla viability will be finally over regardless of the outcome.

[doot]

Wouldn't making changes sort of defeat the purpose of the whole project? Like I get squashing bugs and all, but the rest I don't know.

[Novakhoro]

Stop please >.< youre going to ruin it before it starts

[mich4el]

Tldr & NO i rather have all the bugs than your version of vanilla which is not vanilla

[yoma]

So you want to cherry-pick what you see through those rose-tinted goggles?

No. Enjoy your vanilla.

[hulkgor]

So, i guess this is the new trend on MMO-C?

Again, people want classic to be classic the way it was. We don't want improvements on mechanics, qol ,models, etc.

We just ... want... CLASSIC.

Geez. I guess the "LOL VANILLA, NEVER" crowd morphed into "VANILLA IMPROVEMENTS".

[Aquinan]

The things i mentioned above are an essential updates Blizzard need to make in order to make WoW Classic THE SAME but BETTER.

Its not Classic or the same if you change it.

[Jastall]

Sorry man but modern WoW is junk. Its been junk since Cataclysm hit stores and that is exactly the expansion I stopped playing after I bought it. I know you classic WoW nuts like it just the way it is and I like classic also and know how to make it work BUT I wont waver from knowing it can be improved upon without destroying the classic experience.

You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. Classic is classic, no changes should be made. Play the game as it was, warts and all. Otherwise people aren't asking for classic gameplay, but for Blizzard to handhold them through a nostalgia trip and prune out the bad stuff.

[Deleted]

Gimmie my CTS/AQR on my Rogue and let's see you all in BGs! Can't wait to attempt the GM grind again, doubt it's possible with a fulltime job but who knows!

[Wiedzemir]

watching this makes you realize even most bosses in naxx were pretty damn simple mechanic wise compared to nowadays standards, add to that classes were like really easy and Im not sure how will this keep people interested for longer periods of time tbh. Time will tell I guess.

Frankly, I want the classic be the very same thing as it was in naxx patch, except maybe the way addons work, just so the debate about vanilla viability will be finally over regardless of the outcome.

I don't think anyone ever claimed that bosses were hard in vanilla due to mechanics. Most of them were gear checks (patchwerk is literally the definition of DPS gear check), either in terms of stats or resistances, and only a few required some more or less complex strategies. However, when you actually have to get this specific gear, that makes it all more complex. This barrier was removed in the modern WoW but instead we have "complex" mechanics and the race against the enrage timer. More so, despite what most claim, the majority of raid encounters never really required the full 40 man raid, you always had warm bodies that were there were barely contributing. However, this allowed to bring gatherers and non-dedicated-raiders into the raid as well and don't have them on the eternal bench.


Plus I'm not sure why you people are so focused on raids. For me raids in vanilla and BC were more of a chore than a goal, despite the fact that I played a warrior tank most of it. The best memories of the time I have outside of raids. There was plenty do and the world was alive.

[Deleted]

The things i mentioned above are an essential updates Blizzard need to make in order to make WoW Classic THE SAME but BETTER.

Great comprehensive post.
But you will waste your time.

Currently you see all sort of people panicing and running around like ignited chicken.

You will have those salty classic hater who want people to "Experience" real classic in hope they are hating it and you have those scared puritanes that fear they suddenly get LFR and Demon Hunters and Cata zones for no reasons once they give in to even the slightest changes.

So currently the whole community is in total confusion right now and are overreacting in both ways.


I guess people should wait a few weeks or month to let things cool down before suggesting and discussing possible changes and the pros and cons of those in a more reasonable atmosphere.

[Deleted]

So, in short, you want the Wotlk version of the game, not Vanilla. Making all specs relatively competitive was Wotlk design philosophy and goal.

WoTLK made specs competitive? Say whaat xD

[Wiedzemir]

WoTLK made specs competitive? Say whaat xD

It made different specs competitive :P

Obviously it's going to get tweaked. There's no way Blizz is going to go forward with 40m raids.

Why not exactly? Actually today is the day when it can be done stress free. I can still remember raiding on my GeForce MX440, damn it was hard unless everything in the graphics section was turned down. Still was fun. Plus again. 40 man raids, never really required all 40 people going all 100%, there was always a dozen of warm bodies that were brought in the raid because they're part of the guild, crafters-gatherers or just nice people to chat with but they're not dedicated raiders, and that was great for the overall guild community.

[Deleted]

I really dont want them to try and balance the game! Really I fcking loved it back then, and played a lot of diffrent classes.

Right now you cant solo gank a healer, because its balanced around 3vs3 arena its shit.
Right now all classes can fcking combat heal, its rubish and stupid.
Right now all classes got CC again retarded.

Right now all classes can do everything, I really dont hope they will try and change anything! Let it be, vanilla was fcking amazing.

If they wanted to change anything it should be the graphics, something that dosnt touch the gameplay experience.

[Deleted]

You only think I have a "motive" because you were biased with your own motive before you even read my comment, which you decided not to reply to directly. Also, "ur english sux n u shuld make mpre effprt with how u rite thinhs"

I write from phone sometimes, glad you fell better about yourself lol.

And my point still stands, only gankers want broken classes, they want to be Maydie & Pat 1-shotting everyone..




and ofc the pom pyro x2 trinkets mages
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLEhudSh51U

and stunlock until death rogues...

[Bigbazz]

I write from phone sometimes, glad you fell better about yourself lol.

And my point still stands, only gankers want broken classes, they want to be Maydie & Pat 1-shotting everyone..




and ofc the pom pyro x2 trinkets mages
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLEhudSh51U

and stunlock until death rogues...

That's great and all, but I played on a PVE server until WOD and don't even do PVP, so much for my motives eh? My motive is only that Vanilla is an old game that should be preserved as a part of gaming history that can be visited and experienced as it was, not with the taint of modern conveniences or subjective views on how the game should be changed for balance or personal enjoyment... It should be as it was, people asked for Vanilla and they are getting it.

Ganking players in PVP is not something that disappears with good class balance, it mostly revolves around players using underhanded tactics to gain an easy advantage over an often undergeared, lower level or currently engaged in combat low health player. Your ideas fixated on ganking have their energy spent in the wrong place.

You could start tho by rolling on a PVE server, when Vanilla comes.