Thread: T21 Sims

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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Spikeyshadow View Post
    If the targets were stacked supposedly Destro would be stronger.
    Coven is close enough that you can use bracers at least, but it didn't really seem to make that much of a difference.
    Quote Originally Posted by Baconeggcheese View Post
    I think there'll be a shitstorm.

    period.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Duckz0rs View Post
    I was surprised to see Destro rank so low overall on Hounds and Coven when looking at just raw numbers. Should kind of be our niche, right? (obviously the real niche is focused 2-target, but that's hard to see from just glancing at overall statistics)
    Tbh I wasn't, the specs never scaled well and wasn't tuned to be competitive before scaling happened. It needs love.

    I keep saying that I'm looking for the moment destro is supposed to shine, or the reason why my decision to stay destro wasn't an awful one and unless some tuning happens here then I won't have it.
    "I've carefully played this game to an endless despair"

  3. #23
    i dont trust sims when it comes to raid dmg, ill just stick for a week or 2 till some more HC logs pop up

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Duckz0rs View Post
    Coven is close enough that you can use bracers at least, but it didn't really seem to make that much of a difference.
    True but Coven has multiple adds, it's not a true 2T fight. In my opinion it's likely that Affy would benefit a lot more from the adds.

    I've also seen it suggested that stacked cleave benefits LoF and using a different Grimoire for Destro a lot more while Affy only gains the infernal use. The sims on LOSS seem to support Destro being higher on 2T (stacked) at least when using the raid profiles only. Unfortunately we do not have this situation in the raid yet.

    However like Bacon has said Destro needs some love and probably again later when it tapers off again.

  5. #25
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    there is a lot of movement on a lot of these fights so destro will fall behind. i think theres one where you can basically turret and im sure demo will do great on that one. everything else i see affliction taking it. even if only because its easier to play and can deal with movement without hurting DPS much.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by valky94 View Post
    i dont trust sims when it comes to raid dmg, ill just stick for a week or 2 till some more HC logs pop up
    There's tens of thousands of heroic parses already. They won't be changing much without tuning.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by severan View Post
    There's tens of thousands of heroic parses already. They won't be changing much without tuning.
    true, but not all of them got 4 sets (most of them probably dont) :P

  8. #28
    @valky94 4sets aren't significantly different in power from our current 4sets.
    "I've carefully played this game to an endless despair"

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by severan View Post
    There's tens of thousands of heroic parses already. They won't be changing much without tuning.
    The problem is that everyone in the top parses is playing with 2p4p, that's why its batshit broken..
    this skews the stats so much.. I hope blizz nerf T20 not the spec itself

  10. #30
    It looks like dot classes in general are just too good on the logs so far, same as tos

    St I'm not too worried about destro but aoe feels like it needs a boost.

    I really miss the old toggle f and b amd chaos bolt aoe playstlye felt smooth and sweet of it could be balanced over rain of fire

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also sacrifice gas really annoyed me this expansion. It stinks that we used to have a viable petless option, which they took off us to make it complete dog shit and not even usable on anything, whilst then giving everyone else a damge boosting petless option

    They could have changed it and balanced it

  11. #31
    More like Aff needs a sledgehammer nerf, it's clearly too good and will get out of hand by the end of the expansion.

    I bet Aff and Shadow at least will get some nerf, whether it will be enough time will tell. I doubt they will get more than 5% nerf, unless Blizzard grows a pair and does something other than usual aura twiddling.

    Destruction, probably won't be changed, maybe a tiny 2% buff if that.

  12. #32
    nerfing the sets will do the job

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    More like Aff needs a sledgehammer nerf, it's clearly too good and will get out of hand by the end of the expansion.

    I bet Aff and Shadow at least will get some nerf, whether it will be enough time will tell. I doubt they will get more than 5% nerf, unless Blizzard grows a pair and does something other than usual aura twiddling.

    Destruction, probably won't be changed, maybe a tiny 2% buff if that.
    Not sure why you're suggesting a sledgehammer nerf in the slightest. Is Aff in a good spot in Antorus after 1 week of the raid? Sure. It's not outperforming every spec on every encounter. The fights where the aff design excels are the ones where you really see it doing well so far. Those same fights Destro is also doing well, but falters due to design and less adaptability in the spec on other fights. Calling for a sledgehammer nerf is pretty questionable.

    If we see any adjustments Tuesday you can expect Destro to get a minor buff, and at most Aff 4pc t20 gets adjusted in some way, but probably wont at all. Other than that I don't see any other changes happening specifically for Warlock.
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  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Caides View Post
    Not sure why you're suggesting a sledgehammer nerf in the slightest. Is Aff in a good spot in Antorus after 1 week of the raid? Sure. It's not outperforming every spec on every encounter. The fights where the aff design excels are the ones where you really see it doing well so far. Those same fights Destro is also doing well, but falters due to design and less adaptability in the spec on other fights. Calling for a sledgehammer nerf is pretty questionable.

    If we see any adjustments Tuesday you can expect Destro to get a minor buff, and at most Aff 4pc t20 gets adjusted in some way, but probably wont at all. Other than that I don't see any other changes happening specifically for Warlock.
    he's a destro fanboy that's why

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by toothreaper View Post
    he's a destro fanboy that's why
    I assumed it was the "all boss statistics" on WCL that people like to circle jerk over without actually analyzing the data on a per fight basis like you should while still taking it with a grain of salt.
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  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Caides View Post
    Not sure why you're suggesting a sledgehammer nerf in the slightest. Is Aff in a good spot in Antorus after 1 week of the raid? Sure. It's not outperforming every spec on every encounter. The fights where the aff design excels are the ones where you really see it doing well so far. Those same fights Destro is also doing well, but falters due to design and less adaptability in the spec on other fights. Calling for a sledgehammer nerf is pretty questionable.

    If we see any adjustments Tuesday you can expect Destro to get a minor buff, and at most Aff 4pc t20 gets adjusted in some way, but probably wont at all. Other than that I don't see any other changes happening specifically for Warlock.
    A sledgehammer nerf is overdoing it, but aff is very undeniably overperforming at the moment. At the same time Demo and Destro are undeniably underperforming.
    Aff is THE most dominantly present spec in the top 10 for every fight in Antorus except for Antoran High Command (where boomies and SP reign supreme) and Aggramar, which has only 1 aff lock in the top 10.

    It's blowing Demo out of the water on ST fights (Garothi, Imnonar), and destroying Destro on 2-target sustained cleave (it's supposed niche) on Hounds and Shivarran Council, as well as burst cleave on Kin'garoth.

    Looking at other specs it could very much be that aff is one of the few specs that's properly tuned, and the rest is heavily undertuned. Frost for example is nowhere to be found, even on ST.
    Quote Originally Posted by Baconeggcheese View Post
    I think there'll be a shitstorm.

    period.

  17. #37
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    Actuall for affli atm the 4set T20 2set T21 sims 60k higher than both 4setT212setT20 and 4setT21 with other legendaries combos and higher ilvl pcies. It just goes to show how affli 4set needa a buff (and T20 a nerf prety soon probably) cause if left as is just goes back to how much my Mythic gear dps was in Tos lol. That doesnt seem like an upgrade

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by toothreaper View Post
    he's a destro fanboy that's why
    More like it is the reality of Affliction overperforming even in encounters where it should not do so and it also scales very well on top of that.

    Yes, I personally do not want to be forced to be Affliction, but if it is not tamed there will be no choice and personal feelings aside it is obviously overtuned now and will outscale others even further down the road.

  19. #39
    Boss breakdown looking at heroic parses on warcraft logs at 75th percentile. The % DPS delta is relative to destruction.

    The 3 big outliers high command, eonar, portal are from very high reap and WoC uptime. Dropping souls and WoC generating from the adds would tone it down a lot.

    Destro looks like it just needs a buff and also maybe getting hit hard by the high movement required.

    Boss Aff Rank Destro Rank % DPS Delta
    Gorothi 7 22 6.8%
    felhounds 2 3 5.2%
    High Command 4 19 19.9%
    eonar 1 21 50.3%
    portal keeper 2 21 24.7%
    Imonar 6 12 3.1%
    kingorath 3 16 7%
    Varimathras 13 7 -2.1%
    Coven 1 3 12.9%
    Aggramar 16 22 4.8%
    Argus 4 3 -1.7%

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Duckz0rs View Post
    Aff is THE most dominantly present spec in the top 10 for every fight in Antorus except for Antoran High Command (where boomies and SP reign supreme) and Aggramar, which has only 1 aff lock in the top 10.
    Aff has a heavy RNG factor so top10 are totally irrelevant, especially in ST

    Garothi : Affli shouldn't be this high, it's a ST fight. The impact of movement is gonna be reduced
    Hounds : 2 targets with movement, Affli / SP are high.
    High command : adds fight so affli is high
    Eonar : this fight is a joke, dps is totally irrelevant here
    Portal keeper : adds fight so affli is high and most affli are staying on the boss
    Imonar : Affli shouldn't be this high, it's a ST fight. The impact of movement is gonna be reduced
    Kin'garoth : Affli shouldn't be this high, it's a ST / cleave fight and with short burst
    Varimathras : ST fight with low movement, affli is middle of the pack but should be in the low part
    Coven : 2 targets / cleave fight with lot of movement, affli is heavily favored by its execute and its talent build (having a single dot to refresh)
    Aggramar : affli is at its place
    Argus : affli is getting stupid damage from the adds intermission, at its place in terms of damage to boss

    The main problem is with the ST fight.
    And the more movement, the bigger the difference is.
    Also its the first week, so many fight have people dying to stupid mistake making the execute talent extremely good.

    They should :
    -nerf affli t20 P4
    -small buff to destru
    -buff to demono AoE (but they don't seems to care about this spec anyway)

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