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  1. #1

    End cinematic damaged the lore

    Spoilers...

    Theres very few rules in storytelling but a big one is to make the threats credible, to make the challenge worthy of your heroes quest. This was Sargeras, first appearance in full form in a cinematic and hes THE big bad so they had only one mandate: make him credible. And....they got it utterly wrong.

    1. They have the guy hiding in a cloud like a coward.
    2. The cinematic is basically Sargeras getting his ass kicked.
    3. He whines and screams like a baby.
    4. He gets jailed and now illidan is going to kick his ass for eternity.
    5. Sargeras kills ZERO lore heroes on his way out.
    6. Velen, Khadgar, and co actually look BORED watching this play out.

    Now, it might feel really cool to you TODAY to see this. But this irreparably does damage to the lore. You see, Sargeras’ victories are ALL off screen, rumored, little to no corroboration for any of it. THIS is his FIRST screen time EVER. that means going forward THIS cinematic WILL define who Sargeras is. For the next 10 years, when kids ask “who is sargeras?” People will tell them to watch this video. And they will come away with the impression that Sargeras is an inept stupid moron that loses despite his massive size. In short, his lore will be dimished to that of an imperial stormtrooper over time.

    Some people should be fired for this cinematic. They had one job. And they blew it.
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  2. #2
    From breath-taking Rejection of the Gift cinematic to this cheesy bs. Blizz failed with Sargi badly.

  3. #3
    Not only that, but basically all of WoW is always the same shit. Nothing has weight, ever. Why don't they change the fucking game? Make the sword land in Stormwind and DELETE stormwind, it's over, a fucking crater of shit and it's not replaced, any quest or NPCs that were there are dead FOR EVERYONE. Not phasing bullshit, the game is now a game with no stormwind, no stockades, anything that was there is deleted forever. That's how you make threats credible, by literally affecting the world in a meaningful way. Who gives a shit if silithus gets stabbed. Go destroy the game.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    Spoilers...

    Theres very few rules in storytelling but a big one is to make the threats credible, to make the challenge worthy of your heroes quest. This was Sargeras, first appearance in full form in a cinematic and hes THE big bad so they had only one mandate: make him credible. And....they got it utterly wrong.

    1. They have the guy hiding in a cloud like a coward.
    2. The cinematic is basically Sargeras getting his ass kicked.
    3. He whines and screams like a baby.
    4. He gets jailed and now illidan is going to kick his ass for eternity.
    5. Sargeras kills ZERO lore heroes on his way out.
    6. Velen, Khadgar, and co actually look BORED watching this play out.

    Now, it might feel really cool to you TODAY to see this. But this irreparably does damage to the lore. You see, Sargeras’ victories are ALL off screen, rumored, little to no corroboration for any of it. THIS is his FIRST screen time EVER. that means going forward THIS cinematic WILL define who Sargeras is. For the next 10 years, when kids ask “who is sargeras?” People will tell them to watch this video. And they will come away with the impression that Sargeras is an inept stupid moron that loses despite his massive size. In short, his lore will be dimished to that of an imperial stormtrooper over time.

    Some people should be fired for this cinematic. They had one job. And they blew it.
    Like we were actually going to fight Sargeras anyway. We'd all be dead and the game would be over with.

    "3. He whines and screams like a baby." - gotta love a post with irony, I guess.

  5. #5
    I'm assuming there's combat with him (mythic only?) because he has to end up prone on Azeroth somehow
    You're not allowed to discuss conspiracy theories on mmo-champion, which makes me wonder what they're trying to hide.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    1. They have the guy hiding in a cloud like a coward.
    2. The cinematic is basically Sargeras getting his ass kicked.
    3. He whines and screams like a baby.
    4. He gets jailed and now illidan is going to kick his ass for eternity.
    5. Sargeras kills ZERO lore heroes on his way out.
    6. Velen, Khadgar, and co actually look BORED watching this play out.
    1. The cloud could had been his travelform or even an attack from him to infiltrate azeroth to get to her titansoul.
    2. He is getting sealed back by the other titans, he is still fine.
    3. He said NO because he now needs to wait for xx amount of years again to kill azeroth.
    4. Illidan is dead, he either gets crushed by Sargeras or he dies by lack of food and water.
    5. Lore heroes are ants to him he dont care about anybody as small as us, also he killed thousands of druids in Silithus.
    6. We only see there backs, since when can you tell emontions from watching somebodies back.

  7. #7
    yeah not overly impressed with the cinematic. it was everything that was expected and nothing more. I was hoping for some plottwist but i guess the stabbing is supposed to be that. they shouldn't have put that silithus crap on the PTR.

    not gonna shit on his cloud tho, for someone on the planet that must be pretty scary.

  8. #8
    It is only the avatar of Sargeras, not actually Sargeras. Isn't it? I thought there were more conditions for Sargeras to actually come to Azeroth.

  9. #9
    Yeah, them just standing on Vindicaar, watching the whole event, zero emotions on face was so weak. Its SARGERAS FFS, if you're not scared of him (since he's getting done) at least show some awe or i dont know...

    Everyone behaved as if Sargeras was this bully kid in school that you're seeing everyday. Lets not even comment the stabbing. Sargeras stabbed Azeroth with bigass sword while Velen sighs with relief. No fucks given.

  10. #10
    The Patient Donkeywing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    And they will come away with the impression that Sargeras is an inept stupid moron that loses despite his massive size. In short, his lore will be dimished to that of an imperial stormtrooper over time.
    You're not wrong. I actually didn't believe there would be a Sargeras faceoff since I assumed Big S would appear in the legion opening cinematic if that would be the case. The way they rushed Sargeras and the lore makes it seem the end of the story is near.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellrime View Post
    It is only the avatar of Sargeras, not actually Sargeras. Isn't it? I thought there were more conditions for Sargeras to actually come to Azeroth.
    Nope, it is actual Sargeras

    Quote Originally Posted by Donkeywing View Post
    You're not wrong. I actually didn't believe there would be a Sargeras faceoff since I assumed Big S would appear in the legion opening cinematic if that would be the case. The way they rushed Sargeras and the lore makes it seem the end of the story is near.
    Well Blizz introduced the Void Lords as the new big bads, so we have enough lore for a few extra expansions

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Babadoo View Post
    From breath-taking Rejection of the Gift cinematic to this cheesy bs. Blizz failed with Sargi badly.
    LOL that cinematic was garbage as well since it crapped over the entire Illidan "Champion of the Light" storyline we'd be on since the beginning of Legion. They took a big dump on Sargeras and the Naaru / Light this expansion, all to have Illidan smirk at the camera. Just trash.
    "For years now I've found it to be a such a strange honor to be followed around the internet by expert interpreters, who take plain words in English and replace them with other, more loaded words in English." - Posted by Zarhym

  13. #13
    Titan General Zanjin's Avatar
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    he was a cloud trying to corrupt azeroth.
    stop whining.

  14. #14
    Dreadlord Nemah's Avatar
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    It felt very deus ex machina to me. It was all very convenient. Going to guess there's some other cutscenes somewhere that might shed some light on how it all develops....but....not going to hold my breath. The lack of clarity is the most bothersome part to me.

    While I agree that we were never really meant to physically fight Sarg - because we'd die - I was expecting something a little more, I don't know...spectacular. Someone on these forums (apologies I can't remember your name) commented that we watched Sarg get sucked into a ghostbusters trap.....it's funny, but true.

  15. #15
    Dreadlord Dragore's Avatar
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    The thing I liked most about the cinematic was just seeing the Titans and Sarg mounting Azeroth. And I have to agree, there was absolutely no impact for me. What a huge let down. There was no sort of emotional connection with the lore at all. This sob was the reason why we are all here. He orchestrated the entire WoW universe. And we got nothing. I was really hoping for some dialogue, expecting something like Anakin and Obi in Ep 3. I wanted to see his corruption, I wanted him to explain why he doing what he is doing (even though we know from the lore book).

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Tromage View Post
    1. The cloud could had been his travelform or even an attack from him to infiltrate azeroth to get to her titansoul.
    .
    similar to Kil'jaeden yellow cloud in Warcraft 3 at the black temple

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    Spoilers...

    Theres very few rules in storytelling but a big one is to make the threats credible, to make the challenge worthy of your heroes quest. This was Sargeras, first appearance in full form in a cinematic and hes THE big bad so they had only one mandate: make him credible. And....they got it utterly wrong.

    1. They have the guy hiding in a cloud like a coward.
    He's not hiding in a cloud. This is the form he generally has taken to travel the galaxy and it's quite possibly the form he needs to take in order to corrupt Azeroth's world soul. Remember, his goal wasn't to kill the planet, but rather to enslave her will to him just like with Argus.

    Also, I think this is the first ending cutscene that probably takes Mythic into account seeing as the Mythic only phase of the fight has a bunch of abilities labeled with Sargeras' name in them. I assume he will be fighting us in some form while we're taking down Argus.

  18. #18
    Immortal ArgusTheUnmaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellrime View Post
    It is only the avatar of Sargeras, not actually Sargeras. Isn't it? I thought there were more conditions for Sargeras to actually come to Azeroth.
    No. It's actually Sargeras.

  19. #19
    Oh gods, whine some more. Sargeras has always been a "distant" villain, a faceless threat. The Legion was the threat, and the Legion enacted the will of Sargeras. We were not meant to fight a literal god.

    The players at this point of the plot had just defeated a nascent Titan with help from the Titans' remaining power. The Titans, alien creatures as they are, forced Sargeras into his true form (He wasn't -in- the cloud, he WAS the cloud) yanked him back to the Throne. He stabbed Azeroth and almost anti-climactically, he was gone.

    And that was a good thing.

    Why? Because Sargeras was never more than a singular Titan. He was able to defeat the other Titans because they never expected him---they were "not prepared". At even a fraction of their former might---together and ready, they could subdue Sargeras, he was one, they were many. Even after everything they have been through, Aman'thul called Sargeras "brother", which indicated that the whole of the Burning Crusade was really nothing more than a stupid teenager's death metal phase, and when Mom and Dad were able to reassert their authority, Sargeras was sent to his room to sulk.

    With Illidan poking at his ankles forever.

    You'll notice that Velen was looking at the Throne when he sighed. He wasn't looking at the destruction of Silithus. His reaction is appropriate; the big bad who had tormented his people for 25 millennia was gone. Give the guy a break before expecting him to get verklempt over Azeroth's new woes.


    Hating -this- cinematic because it 'craps all over the lore' is a surefire way to signal that you're being sour grapes.
    Last edited by Steelangel; 2017-11-29 at 06:03 PM.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelangel View Post
    snip
    Yeah, that still doesn't make it good storytelling, a good cinemtaic, or anything else. The representation of WoW' lore in game sucks and has always sucked. OP is right.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow.

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