Vanilla Was Created in The Golden Age of Creativity

[Deleted]

Am i the only one who feels like the 90's/00's was a better time for creativity in gaming, movies, songs and entertainment in general?
For some reason i feel like what we have today in the entertainment business is just a remake of something great created in the 80's/90's/00's.
Back then people didn't use to rely on the fame of previous inventions like today.
Hell even the most played game in the world (League of Legends) came from Warcraft III, the grandfather of all MOBA games.
Doesn't it seem to you that we live today on the shadows of previous achievements?

It's almost as if people don't want to create something new and be imaginative and take risks. All companies want nowadays is a cash grab from a copy of something created in the old days.

And because of the lack of creativity we have today in our society...we decide to go back in time with Wow: Classic...to a better time because we simply forgot how to be passionate about something and be creative without thinking about the money.

You agree back then was the Golden Age for creativity? Or am i being a old fart.



Indeed kind Sirs, Discuss, humm yeah, Indeed.
Discussion for Snobs lol

[gaymer77]

Or am i being a old fart.

No you are not. And honestly I agree with you a lot on this. Look at how many things are getting remakes from back then. Grease, Rocky Horror, Steel Magnolias, Ghostbusters, etc etc etc and how many times has Final Fantasy 7 been remastered or remade or something else? Its like not only video game companies but TV and movie studios have ran out of ideas and are just recycling great things from the past for an audience of today.

[apples]

EQ-lite was more creative than stuff today?

man, people are so shortsighted. and the worst part is people revel in their inability to see past their own noses

[Pickynerd]

The old games sucked, we just didn't have anything better to compare, new games are just cash-grabs with a few gems in the middle.

WoW is getting worse, but not because of the "it isn't vanilla" reason either, because vanilla is pretty bad also.

[Ielenia]

You agree back then was the Golden Age for creativity? Or am i being a old fart.

I wouldn't say that back then was the "golden age of creativity", I mean, we have so many good and creative games being created by indie developers... but the current status of triple-A companies is, in my opinion, largely to blame on the players themselves. We just couldn't accept the idea of our beloved games being changed as time went on, which caused franchises like Call of Duty, Battlefield, sport games, etc, to basically stagnate, changing just here and there but never in a really meaningful way, to avoid backlash from their player base. Games that changed saw reduced sales, while the ones that stayed the same saw profits increase.

On top of that, there is also the fact that we, as player, have become quite complacent. Which further allowed triple-A companies to make "cash-grabs" with little to no opposition. The few that actually spoke against things like loot boxes and paid on-disk DLC were too few to make any impact. Because the majority of us just whined on our couches as we found out about those things... but rarely even bothered to make a Facebook post, discuss in a forum, or even send a single tweet about it.

I think nowadays is just as creative as the 90's and 2000's were, thanks to the indie developers, but the triple-A game industry has grown too "lazy" because we got complacent.

[Vofka]

Gaming went mainstream and when something went mainstream it eventually turns to shit. Also gaming companies became too big to take a risk and create something new like every mmo after wow is a wow clone.

[Storfan]

Smoothing out the experience from any bumps in order to reach as wide an audience as possible to make maximum profit for the capitalist overlords.

Just look at SW:Battlefront 2.

[Hitei]

Yeah man. The era of copy-pasted boy bands and female pop singers was the height of creativity. Remember that one movie about that wacky inventor/professor character who's invention gets way out of hand?

[Usagi Senshi]

Gaming went mainstream and when something went mainstream it eventually turns to shit. Also gaming companies became too big to take a risk and create something new like every mmo after wow is a wow clone.

Gaming went more "mainstream" somewhere around 1996/1997 when Sony made it more cool to be a gamer and PSX sales went hard well into the early 2000s. One could even argue (and extremely well at that) that Sega started this trend with the Genesis/MegaDrive in 1991-1993 with many action/sports games to play.

Personally when I started playing Everquest around 2000, I found its gameplay to be extremely shitty/clunky compared to a proper western/eastern rpg/action rpg. Dark Age of Camelot was more fun but still shitty with the combat, presentation, etc. FFXI was better with its better story and world to explore, but still had that clunky menu-based combat.

WoW is what changed things for the better but it was already much easier and stream-lined compared to what I had already been playing for nearly 5 years. Why people keep shitting on retail WoW and acting like vanilla was some bastion of supreme MMO gameplay is beyond me because I couldn't wait until they improved and streamlined even more of the shoddy MMO mechanics at the time of what I was playing in WoW at the time. I wanted improved character models and gear customization before TBC ever launched and having to wait 7+ years for both was extremely asinine IMO.

Blizzard was already talking about automated PVE content (said that it would take a few more years to get right) as far back as fall 2006 (after the launch of cross-server BGs) because in a couple interviews they stated that making expensive raid content for sub-5% of the subscriber base wasn't going to be feasible in the long-term.

The people that hate more accessible content and gear are really just straight up cunts tbh and don't understand what it takes to keep a game of this size running and keeping a lot of players paying and happy. They probably also forget on how much of a fucking headache it was to gear some new scrubs out in Van/TBC and get them attuned (I did the Ony attune twice on Horde and once for Alliance and the Kara/SSC/Eye shit on 4 characters at the time, major PITA, I wanted account-wide shit after the first time done) for shit the rest of us already wasted so much time on. The notion that Vanilla is harder than retail makes me laugh as well considering every raid from 2004-2008 is much easier than our current heroic raid (and a all of mythic/+ 5-mans stuff as well) content is.

So no, I always found old MMO designs to be fucking garbage but the addictive nature of them kept me playing and entertained still on some nights. WoW was an improvement but still a carebear fest that a lot of people still fail to realize to this day. It was always going to keep on being a casual/easy MMO for years to come. /shrug

[Mifuyne]

It feels like that but almost everything has been slightly altered or copy pasta since..forever.
It feels "creative" or "new" because you have not seen where whatever you are speaking about came from.
Warcraft wasn't some kind of special creative wonder. Every aspect of the game can be backtracked to older games.

Now that you have grown older, you basically have seen everything basic so it feels like everything was new when you were younger.
This is however false.

Blizzard is playing into what makes us human by creating a Vanilla game by using memories and feelings of when people were younger than they are now.
It'll be a success due to players that never actually played vanilla and those that did to replay their memories of the past.

[Dhrizzle]

I also think the time when I was a child/teenager and discovering new things was better than whatever time it is now.

[Kolbjorn]

EQ-lite was more creative than stuff today?

man, people are so shortsighted. and the worst part is people revel in their inability to see past their own noses

Keep in mind all these "Vanilla is teh best ev4r" types weren't even aware of EverQuest.

They think they're so hardcore... imagine if their corpse was stuck in the Plane of Fear, or say Veeshan's Peak.

[Zensunni]

Am i the only one who feels like the 90's/00's was a better time for creativity in gaming, movies, songs and entertainment in general?
For some reason i feel like what we have today in the entertainment business is just a remake of something great created in the 80's/90's/00's.
Back then people didn't use to rely on the fame of previous inventions like today.
Hell even the most played game in the world (League of Legends) came from Warcraft III, the grandfather of all MOBA games.
Doesn't it seem to you that we live today on the shadows of previous achievements?

It's almost as if people don't want to create something new and be imaginative and take risks. All companies want nowadays is a cash grab from a copy of something created in the old days.

And because of the lack of creativity we have today in our society...we decide to go back in time with Wow: Classic...to a better time because we simply forgot how to be passionate about something and be creative without thinking about the money.

You agree back then was the Golden Age for creativity? Or am i being a old fart.



Indeed kind Sirs, Discuss, humm yeah, Indeed.
Discussion for Snobs lol

Saying that WC3 is the grandfather of MOBA games calls into question your knowledge of the history of video games, and indeed whether or not you were even into Blizzard games in the 90s.

Hint - MOBA games developed gradually in the late 80s and early 90s but the MOBA that really launched the genre into, pardon the play, outer space, was unquestionably Star Craft dude.

[Aggrophobic]

What do you mean? WoW was a rip off, a copy of games (or a game, actually) that came befor it but with a more casual side added to it.
There is nothing unique or creative about it.

[Mifuyne]

I also think the time when I was a child/teenager and discovering new things was better than whatever time it is now.

Pretty sure that's how almost everyperson feels (except for a tiny few that don't).
Because "life" as a child is entirely different than the adult "life".
As a child you'd see many things for the first time and as a adult everything you see is build from things that you have seen before.
It's what makes children very susceptible and easy to sculpt.

[Aggrophobic]

Smoothing out the experience from any bumps in order to reach as wide an audience as possible to make maximum profit for the capitalist overlords.

Just look at SW:Battlefront 2.

And thats just what WoW was 13 years ago as well.

[Zensunni]

And P.S., games like Witcher 3 are so much better, so much wider in scope, so much more amazing than anything made in the 90s, there's no comparison. Part of this is the industry, and game budgets, as well as the computers and development tools out there now. I would say the golden age of creativity in video games is NOW. Maybe you should get onto Steam and start looking over award winning indie games.

[Mifuyne]

And P.S., games like Witcher 3 are so much better, so much wider in scope, so much more amazing than anything made in the 90s, there's no comparison. Part of this is the industry, and game budgets, as well as the computers and development tools out there now. I would say the golden age of creativity in video games is NOW. Maybe you should get onto Steam and start looking over award winning indie games.

Basically this^

The golden age keeps on changing it's dates due to advancements in basically everything.
Factually right now it is better than it ever was and it will even be better tomorrow.

You might not feel like it is better but that is the crux of the story; feeling - which is based on your own personal beliefs and not facts.

[Swiftshadow]

Gaming went more "mainstream" somewhere around 1996/1997 when Sony made it more cool to be a gamer and PSX sales went hard well into the early 2000s. One could even argue (and extremely well at that) that Sega started this trend with the Genesis/MegaDrive in 1991-1993 with many action/sports games to play.

Personally when I started playing Everquest around 2000, I found its gameplay to be extremely shitty/clunky compared to a proper western/eastern rpg/action rpg. Dark Age of Camelot was more fun but still shitty with the combat, presentation, etc. FFXI was better with its better story and world to explore, but still had that clunky menu-based combat.

WoW is what changed things for the better but it was already much easier and stream-lined compared to what I had already been playing for nearly 5 years. Why people keep shitting on retail WoW and acting like vanilla was some bastion of supreme MMO gameplay is beyond me because I couldn't wait until they improved and streamlined even more of the shoddy MMO mechanics at the time of what I was playing in WoW at the time. I wanted improved character models and gear customization before TBC ever launched and having to wait 7+ years for both was extremely asinine IMO.

Blizzard was already talking about automated PVE content (said that it would take a few more years to get right) as far back as fall 2006 (after the launch of cross-server BGs) because in a couple interviews they stated that making expensive raid content for sub-5% of the subscriber base wasn't going to be feasible in the long-term.

The people that hate more accessible content and gear are really just straight up cunts tbh and don't understand what it takes to keep a game of this size running and keeping a lot of players paying and happy. They probably also forget on how much of a fucking headache it was to gear some new scrubs out in Van/TBC and get them attuned (I did the Ony attune twice on Horde and once for Alliance and the Kara/SSC/Eye shit on 4 characters at the time, major PITA, I wanted account-wide shit after the first time done) for shit the rest of us already wasted so much time on. The notion that Vanilla is harder than retail makes me laugh as well considering every raid from 2004-2008 is much easier than our current heroic raid (and a all of mythic/+ 5-mans stuff as well) content is.

So no, I always found old MMO designs to be fucking garbage but the addictive nature of them kept me playing and entertained still on some nights. WoW was an improvement but still a carebear fest that a lot of people still fail to realize to this day. It was always going to keep on being a casual/easy MMO for years to come. /shrug

yep. i freaking agree.

what all these vanilla die-hards fail to realize is that back then, WoW was really all we had as a AAA MMO. We didn't so mind the lack of QoL features because we didn't have any other choice.

Classic will have quite a number of people joining, some of them out of curiosity, others due to nostalgia. However, i believe many will eventually drop out and go back to retail due to inconveniences and boredom. Vanilla WoW and its outdated design just cannot compete with the wide variety of gaming alternatives we have now.

Mechanics in Vanilla was DEFINITELY not harder. Just because people found it hard then does not mean it is mechanically harder than what we have presently. I think the effort to organize a good raid team of 40 people was probably the hardest part.

[Mosotti]

Yeah, Vanilla Ice and MC Hammer were the top of human creativity.