Healers in games

[clevin]

In trinity (tank/heal/dps) games, in solo heal compositions, it's the tank's job to position according to the encounter, it's the healer's job to position in range of the tank and the dps' job to position in range of the healer - only if they do want heals obviously.

Well... kind of. The DPS needs to be in range of the thing they're DPSing. For ranged DPS they should also be aware of doing that and also being in range off their healers (i.e. don't stand on the other side of the boss at max range). For melee, they can't reposition themselves much, so the healer needs to be in range of them and the tank (and being there for one means you're there for the other too).

As a ranged DPS Ive occasionally run away from raid due to a mechanic (either I'm standing in bad and the quickest way out of it is away from the raid or I have a debuff that I need to get out of the raid). In those cases I'm aware of what I've done and know that I need to come back toward the raid when I can.

[Scrysis]

Generally, I see the opposite "god complex", where DPS feel like they need to do nothing to live, are usually the cause of our wipes due to failing mechanics, and constantly die to stupid things because they're trying to stay in and maximize their dps.

This is usually the case I see. "I NEED HEALZ!!! HEAL ME NAOW! HEALER, WHY DIDN'T YOU HEAL ME?!"

When we were working on Maidens of the Moon Mythic, we had one warlock at the back who somehow thought he was extra special. Never mind that he literally had three other warlocks standing next to him, and three other people just a few feet away, he somehow decided that he was taking all the damage and thus needed more heals than everyone else. I TRIED to explain to him that he wasn't taking any more damage than anyone else in the same row, but he refused to believe it, and called me an idiot. He's been on mute ever since, and raids are much better now. ^_^

I think what the OP and other DPS need to realize is that what they THINK is a god-complex is actually an expression of duty and responsibility to the group as a whole.

Trust me. In a real raid, the healers are just as competitive as any dps, and any low-health dps is another opportunity to add to our HPS and total healing done. But if going after that one dps to heal them means that we're jeopardizing the group as a whole, we can't do it.

DPS also seem to conveniently forget that if there is a mechanic that forces everyone to move, then the healers are moving too. And only a couple types of healers can effectively heal while moving, assuming that they're not too busy watching and moving for mechanics. Usually it's "move for mechanics" then "heal everyone who is still up".

[Keashaa]

Healers are in a good position, because they are always in demand. Which is why so many have an attitude to match that.

lol, w00t?
Healers are the first to be downsized if you can't make the enrage timer of a certain boss.
Nearly every raid looking for new players wants new dps as dps is the hardest job in mythic raids.

[Deleted]

Considering that a tank could die while the healer is running around looking for you, I'd say it's better for dps to make sure they are in range and los of the healer.

Exactly this. Stay in range of your healer and everything is good. Also, aoe healing spells with some healing zones just don't extend magically, so you try to get as many people into it as you can - and if some oddball DPS is standing miles away, it's his fault. There is a reason why most raid encounters have some kind of positioning advice.

[Wries]

In the vast majority of blizzard-designed scenarios you can keep the entire group within a 40 yd radius if properly planned so after that it's really up to the specific situation on who's responsibility it is. The encounters this isn't true it's reasonable to ask the healer to move or have a pre-planned healer split, but hopefully it is also clear or explained (voice com or otherwise) as to where you actually moved so the healer doesn't sprint off the opposite way because all of a sudden your hp-frame just went dark.

Obviously it really depends. I really hate it when pugging the doggies in Antorus when the tanks split to the maximum imaginable distance just so that I have to roll back and fourth when there is really NO penalty in keeping them just a smudge closer together.

But the special snowflake DPS that regularly runs out of range for no particular reason other than that they feel no responsibility towards the group except for producing the fattest logs.. yeah sorry eventually the healers will stop chasing you.

[digichi]

everyone gotta try do the job properly and fuck ups have to be expected from everyone noone can execute the job perfetly not even you

basically this^

any healers blaming dps are probably used to dps blaming them. I was in a HOV group where a warlock got hit by the whirling blade and die, then blame me for 'not healing'. Happened twice, as he got a brez and then died again.

I had the rest of the group on my side, and on the rare occurance that happens, it's always just one person being a prick and the rest of the group sets them straight.
If a healer has a god complex, they should try dps/tanking. And if they still complain after that, the problem just might be them ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Dug]

Both need to compromise. If your dps has to be in a position that's out of your range and you can get closer then get fucking closer. If you're a dps and you don't need to be in some weird position then position yourself closer to the healers so that they can have the most optimized and uninterrupted healing. You ain't going to be downing any bosses if your dps is dead so make it work and leave the god complex at the door.

[Nyoken]

Never blame the healer for you being an idiot. The healer is doing the job of 2 people all the time, if it's a good healer.

[Anori]

As a healer I don't think the DPS should have to come to me for healing. They're too busy DPSing. I'm all over the map, and when there's no healing to be done, I help out with DPS.

[Waldor666]

I main healer, and I don't run after people if it will put the lives of the majority at risk. For example, if im doing a Mythic 0 and a dps who thinks they are OP keeps running ahead and pulling stuff then god be with you my friend.

If I am in a raid and a DPS has strayed beyond my range by chance, then I will move to heal them. If im doing battlegrounds im running round like a fool and happy to do so for the win.

tl;dr: depends on the reason I have to

[Swizzington]

On the vast majority of raid encounters, if a DPS is still out of range after a little 5 yard shuffle in that direction, the healer isn't positioning correctly. 40 yards is more than enough.

[PhantasmagoriaX]

As a healer I try to stay in the range of everyone, I will go out of my way to find a tank though. I do have a few people who hang back who are not in my range(even when they are told to stack) and its the same people every raid and those people usually die (this has happened since MOP) though its beyond me why they dont stand in my healing rain.

[Rorke]

Most healer players are passive aggressive bitches. It's extremely passive aggressive to let an under performing dps die while acting all quiet when you could just tell the player directly they suck and not stand in shit.

It's the same crap tanks pull if dps accidentally pull a mob and they let the dps tank it. Passive aggressive bitches.

[Iflash]

In raids, there are multiple healers who are spread out. If you are out of range of all of them, it's your fault. Unless you were outside for a specific task.

In m+, there are some exceptions, but generally, it's the dps who is responsible. In high keys the damage is really intense, and there's only 1 healer. One GDC can make a big difference. Having to move to get to you means one GDC wasted most of the time.

[ItachiZaku]

My usual main healer is also a skinner, so good luck running off and being out of range.

[Scrysis]

Most healer players are passive aggressive bitches. It's extremely passive aggressive to let an under performing dps die while acting all quiet when you could just tell the player directly they suck and not stand in shit.

It's the same crap tanks pull if dps accidentally pull a mob and they let the dps tank it. Passive aggressive bitches.

Passive-aggressive my ass. If I'm in a mythic plus with puggies, I'll heal the fail a couple of times. I will try to reposition a couple of times to find the dps if they're way out of position, even though it means more work keeping everyone else alive. Failing that, I'm going to bring out the idiot grip and start using it shamelessly. Depending on how bad they are, they might be airborne longer than a 747 going from LA to Sydney.

The vast majority of the time, I'm not pugging, for good reason, and I can just communicate over voice chat to my guildies if someone is out of range, or taking too much damage.

Need to post this:

[Count Zero]

Everyone should be doing their part to help with everyone else's job.

[Hellborne87]

The pie chart above says it all. You're a lowly dps. Honestly, you're expendable. The healers have their hands full and don't need to chase you around a map. Not to mention, most heals are casts and if all a healer is doing is running around chasing you, guess what's not being done? Casts aka heals.

By the way, I'm a DPS (I heal once in a great while).

[FelPlague]

So this Facebook group I'm a part of posted this discussion about healers, dps, tanks, and the responsibility of the healer. I found it rather interesting to read most of the healers' comments. The majority of them seem to have this god complex where they feel all they have to do as a healer is stand there and heal people when they are in range of you. They feel that it is the duty of the dps to come to the healer when/if they need a heal.

The way I see it, the job of the tank is to hold agro, position the boss correctly (either away from the group if the boss does some sort of cleave or towards the group if the boss has a mechanic where you have to soak damage with everyone), and not stand in shit that hurts them. The role of the dps is to kill shit ASAP. The role of the healer is to keep everyone alive. If your dps is having to run to you because all you're doing is standing there, they obviously aren't doing their job which directly affects your group. Less time the dps is focusing on adds or the boss means more time the adds or boss is up which could mean enrage timers being hit & a wipe happening. I think we all have had at least one boss fight where it was a wipe at 1% or 2% because there were too many dps dead but almost all your healers were still alive and most at full mana.

This post from that group just bugged the shit out of me. What are your thoughts on healers and what they should do?

I think as others have said, dps should try to stand near healers, but healers should not simply just turret

THis could be used as dps aswell "Wow tank yoru fucking horrible you moved the boss so i needed to move to dps it"
no the dps needs to spread out, to make some mechanics easier, and they need to move to get good dps on some things, example i know on the dragons on nightmare it would be often to see a destro of afrfliction lock sitting near the middle of the room just out of range of the healers to double dot or havoc spam both dragons.

Ranged and melee somtimes need to move when the boss moves, or some mechanics happen, so any healer who thinks their job is to just turret heal are bad healers... And it is just stupid when healers get a god complex, because every role is very important, and in reality tank is the most important because of how little you need and how hard they are to get, aswell as how dependant the whole raid is on it. Yes heals are important, but fuck off if you think you are more important.


TL : DR
No, healers still have to fucking move to be in range of dps, just like dps have to be in range of boss when tank moves it. DPs should avoid getting out of range, but healers are still required to fucking move... tanks are the most important, not heals.

[adamzz]

So this Facebook group I'm a part of posted this discussion about healers, dps, tanks, and the responsibility of the healer. I found it rather interesting to read most of the healers' comments. The majority of them seem to have this god complex where they feel all they have to do as a healer is stand there and heal people when they are in range of you. They feel that it is the duty of the dps to come to the healer when/if they need a heal.

The way I see it, the job of the tank is to hold agro, position the boss correctly (either away from the group if the boss does some sort of cleave or towards the group if the boss has a mechanic where you have to soak damage with everyone), and not stand in shit that hurts them. The role of the dps is to kill shit ASAP. The role of the healer is to keep everyone alive. If your dps is having to run to you because all you're doing is standing there, they obviously aren't doing their job which directly affects your group. Less time the dps is focusing on adds or the boss means more time the adds or boss is up which could mean enrage timers being hit & a wipe happening. I think we all have had at least one boss fight where it was a wipe at 1% or 2% because there were too many dps dead but almost all your healers were still alive and most at full mana.

This post from that group just bugged the shit out of me. What are your thoughts on healers and what they should do?

If the healer is in range of the tank but not in range of you then you are at fault. No, the healer shouldn't run around and chase you because that would risk getting the tank killed. If you are too far away from the healer then chances are you are either too far away from the boss or you are not following the tactics correctly.

Give me just one example of a fight where DPS are out of range but are still doing their job. On KinGaroth they can be out of range if they stand on the opposite side of the boss, but if you are standing there you have longer to run to start DPSing the correct adds when they spawn, which is a loss of DPS and you are not doing your job correctly. Eonar is a place where you can get out of range, but as long as your group is doing the encounter correctly there will always be a healer in range. The only time you might be out of range if there is a stray add that you are chasing down, in that case you need to communicate that and make sure your group knows so you don't try to solo it because that is a waste of time.

Aggrammar is also a big area, but you will never be out of range from a healer if you do it correctly, not even if you are on CC duty and considering you need to stack behind boss on the combo attack you can't be too far away anyway.

On Coven there is a possibility that you might be out of range when killing adds, but that shouldn't happen as you shouldn't go solo against one add since it's better to nuke adds as a group. Let's say lightning adds spawn, why would you run solo to the add in the back when the whole group is taking care of the adds closest to the bosses? If you are a melee player, running to the add furthest away is a loss of DPS, if you are a ranged player why aren't you DPSing at max range? Let's say flame adds spawn, everyone needs to run out of mid, obviously you don't run out to the back since the majority of the group will be at the front with the bosses or to the sides. Healers can't move freely in that phase, sure you can run behind the adds to get to you but while they take that detour someone else might die due to lack of heals. Always kill adds around the bosses first and work your way to the back.

So please, give me just a single example of a boss fight where you as a DPS will be out of range but still do your job properly.