Will Democrates shut down the gov't for interest of foreigners?

[Draco-Onis]

They will. And then use the media to blame Republicans. I don't know how anyone could be surprised at this.

If all republicans get on board the government will stay open, all they have to do is pretend it is tax cuts for rich people and it will pass

[Hyral]

The republicans controls all 3 branches of government. Are you saying that the democrats are more powerful than them? That’s pretty pathetic.

Yes. And they are pathetic.

[Daelak]

It is simple, do they have a social security number? do they pay Taxes? If at least the Taxes part is yes, then Hell yes let them in the more the merrier. But if they are just here not paying taxes and living off the government then kick their asses back to wherever they came from.

All illegal immigrants pay federal and local taxes, even if they are paid under the table. They still get EINs which pay into ss, medicare, unemployment, worker's comp. They can purchase homes and rent, so they pay into local sales and property taxes. They couldn't get welfare if they didn't have an EIN, so they are paying into a system that they will never reap the rewards from. They are actually helping to buoy the financial longevity of programs like medicare and workers' compensation.

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Same rules should be applied on everyone.

Let's say that I would want to migrate to the US. I'm well educated, I have no criminal register, I speak English almost as well as native English speakers (or even better than many of them), and as a Westerner I have no stupid religious or cultural demands that would cause issues with the society. And I'm still young, so I could benefit the society for decades before retiring. I would basically be an ideal immigrant. Still I would have to go through a long bureaucratic process, and would have to wait for years or decades before getting a citizenship. Why should illegal aliens with nothing to offer to the society have it easier?

On the contrary, immigrants have provided the US with a constant stream of labor and high productivity since the Quakers landed at Plymouth Rock. The US should let more immigrants in, pulling away the best and brightest human beings in other countries, especially our adversaries, to keep an absolute advantage and ensuring another century of US hegemony over the globe. It is the most efficient form of warfare we have and it doesn't require bombing countries thousands of miles away.

[Kujako]

Geezus! The Republicans own the government.

I guess they cede power? Only way the OP makes any sense.

[s_bushido]

Why should illegal aliens with nothing to offer to the society have it easier?

Oh, fuck right off. Someone doesn't automatically have "nothing to offer to society" just because their parents brought them here illegally. The best part, of course, is that without giving them a path to citizenship, it guarantees that they will not live up to their potential to give back to society.

[Bullettime]

Same rules should be applied on everyone.

Let's say that I would want to migrate to the US. I'm well educated, I have no criminal register, I speak English almost as well as native English speakers (or even better than many of them), and as a Westerner I have no stupid religious or cultural demands that would cause issues with the society. And I'm still young, so I could benefit the society for decades before retiring. I would basically be an ideal immigrant. Still I would have to go through a long bureaucratic process, and would have to wait for years or decades before getting a citizenship. Why should illegal aliens with nothing to offer to the society have it easier?

Because DACA recipients are not those people. They're people who were brought over from toddler age and have no memory or recollection of life in their country. They were raised American from the time they were like a year old, grew up in America, educated through American schools, held American jobs, and even paid American taxes in many cases.

To deport them now would be throwing them into a country they have no clue about and force them to start their lives over due to something they had no choice in. It's not just anti American but anti humanitarian which is why it's not a black and white partisan issue and even some in the GOP support the DACA. What's holding it up is the border wall bullshit the GOP are trying to attach to the DACA negotiations.

They could also use reconciliation to pass it with a simple majority but GOP congressmen in both houses know that voting against the DACA, especially for those who represent states or districts in the south/southwest, could be political suicide going into 2018 and 2020 so they don't even have the votes in their own party to ram it through with a majority. They're basically begging the Dems to come to their side on the border wall so they can have their cake and eat it too. They're trying to save face with their base while avoiding shooting themselves in the face and the Dems are calling their bluff.

[Felya]

They will. And then use the media to blame Republicans. I don't know how anyone could be surprised at this.

You voted in a landslide win in Congress last election. GOP controls all branches of Federal government. Democrats do not have the votes to shut down the government. Just like they didn’t have the votes to stop the tax cut on the rich. So... ask your self... how exactly was GOP successful in overcoming democrats to give corporations a 15% tax cut, but are unable to keep government from shutting down?

Here is a hint... corporations > You...

[Bullettime]

You voted in a landslide win in Congress last election. GOP controls all branches of Federal government. Democrats do not have the votes to shut down the government. Just like they didn’t have the votes to stop the tax cut on the rich. So... ask your self... how exactly was GOP successful in overcoming democrats to give corporations a 15% tax cut, but are unable to keep government from shutting down?

It really feels like many are just parroting talking points and not understanding how and why the situation is so complex as it is.

If they bothered, they would find that the GOP also support the DACA but they can't vote to support it, and thus vote against the border wall, without getting themselves primaried nor can they vote against it without cutting off their own legs in their states/districts going into 2018 and 2020.

They have the ability to ram it through but they don't want to. They want to force Dems to come across the aisle and support the border wall to keep the government open so they (the GOP) get to save face but the bluff is being called.

[Felya]

It really feels like many are just parroting talking points and not understanding how and why the situation is so complex as it is.

I’m assuming you don’t mean me, but I had a lot of talking points in what I said. From what I called the tax cut, to implying we matter less than corporations. But... unlike the person I was responding to... my talking points were specifically referencing events that did happen. My talking points were expressing my disagreement with what happened. His is not only predicting the future, it’s bad at math.

[Bullettime]

I’m assuming you don’t mean me, but I had a lot of talking points in what I said. From what I called the tax cut, to implying we matter less than corporations. But... unlike the person I was responding to... my talking points were specifically referencing events that did happen. My talking points were expressing my disagreement with what happened. His is not only predicting the future, it’s bad at math.

Oh no I'm agreeing with you against that person.

[Realitytrembles]

No sympathy for any illegal immigrant, even those brought here as children. People who are here illegally should be deported without mercy. No exceptions.

Also, end the H1-b visa program. Not cut. End.

Cheap immigrant labor, and importing high-skilled workers from other countries puts significant downward pressure on the wages of Americans.

Steve Bannon is an S.O.B. in many ways, but when he talks about economic nationalism, he has my support.

[Paranoid Android]

I guess they cede power? Only way the OP makes any sense.

I mean so frustrating that these Fox News viewers don't understand basic majority or how our government functions. So no doubt a good 80% or more of Republicans will blame Democrats for Gov. shutdown. Definitely 100% Trumpkins will blame Democrats for Gov. Shutdown.

Have you seen Trump's tweets or comments from is own Chief of Staff or Senate Majority Leader. I know you have but this if for the Trumpkins:

1) First no ChIP funding in the bill/budget. Then Trump tweets he wants CHIP. I'm sure his "pro-Life" people have gotten hold of him and now he is against CHIP.

2) In that brilliantly televised meeting about DACA . Trump stated he will sign the bill in front of them. The Republicans and Dems had a bipartisan bill. Remember SHITHOLE? That is again when someone got a hold of him to kill that deal.

3) Kelly called him and idiot since he stated Trump doesn't know policy. McConnel said the same that they will not or cannot bring a bill to Trump cause Trump doesn't know where he stands on the bill.

[Elegiac]

Cheap immigrant labor, and importing high-skilled workers from other countries puts significant downward pressure on the wages of Americans.

Man, if only we had some sort of floor to counteract wage suppression...like some sort of minimum wage.

Imagine that.

[Allybeboba]

I never said I was Republican .. I never said I was a Democrat .. I have leanings on both sides wow hard to imagine huh

That is the issue with many(not all) on this forum. If you don’t agree(not necessarily disagree) with them you absolutely must be of the opposite side that they are on. There is no in between, only black and white( L and R ).

Moving on to topic...
Both parties should be held liable. Both are just as sh!tty as the other.

Cheers

[NYC17]

No sympathy for any illegal immigrant, even those brought here as children. People who are here illegally should be deported without mercy. No exceptions..

I'll take them over you. Any. Day.

[Kiri]

No sympathy for any illegal immigrant, even those brought here as children. People who are here illegally should be deported without mercy. No exceptions.

Also, end the H1-b visa program. Not cut. End.

Cheap immigrant labor, and importing high-skilled workers from other countries puts significant downward pressure on the wages of Americans.

Steve Bannon is an S.O.B. in many ways, but when he talks about economic nationalism, he has my support.

So, just to be clear, you are for punishing people for the sins of their fathers?

[Realitytrembles]

Man, if only we had some sort of floor to counteract wage suppression...like some sort of minimum wage.

Imagine that.

I agree with the minimum wage and think it should be raised.

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So, just to be clear, you are for punishing people for the sins of their fathers?

Strawman engaged I see.

It's not a sins of the fathers issue. Regardless of how they came here, illegal is illegal. Tough sht.

[NYC17]

I agree with the minimum wage and think it should be raised.

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Strawman engaged I see.

It's not a sins of the fathers issue. Regardless of how they came here, illegal is illegal. Tough sht.

It is literally a sin of their father issue. They came here because their parents(fathers) brought them here.

[Realitytrembles]

I'll take them over you. Any. Day.

Fortunately, that decision isn't yours. Natural born US citizen here. Legally authorized to be here. Have a nice day.

[Kiri]

I agree with the minimum wage and think it should be raised.

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Strawman engaged I see.

It's not a sins of the fathers issue. Regardless of how they came here, illegal is illegal. Tough sht.

How is it a strawman? It was the parents that had any agency in crossing the border, not the children. That is the very crux of the issue, not a strawman.